Reasonably safe Crypto funds when traveling.

[PaulCrawhorn]

As I stated I take no position on who should or should not use BTC.

But if you do, beyond just buying and holding on an exchange, better invest a lot of time to understand how it works.

Unlike fiat, millions are just lost completely every year due to user error, like a planeload of paper USD getting vaporized.

[Island Time O25]

In the West paper money was invented in the late 1690s (in Sweden and in MassBay Colony). It took 250+ years for the paper currency to gain trust of the public, thus most countries came off of the gold/silver standard only by mid 20th century. How long will it take for crypto to stand up on its own, if ever? In any event, if or when it happens, most likely none of us will be around. Until then crypto is just the tulips of the 21st century.

[boatman61]

Well El Salvador seems happy about Bitcoin as its now on equal footing with the US$ as legal tender and they've bought 400 Bitcoin as a starter pack.

[PaulCrawhorn]

Attracted lots of tourists as well. IMF very unhappy, Bukele very clearly told them to F* off.

Swiss city of Lugano

Arizona, Colorado, Ohio, Wyoming and California have active bills out, maybe Texas.

[Lake-Effect]

A balanced view of the current state of crypto: Crypto Currencies won't save Russia.

[Onoboater]

For all practical purposes do US dollar is a cryptocurrency because you leave your money in the bank and you access it electronically with your debit card and checks. Crypto currencies are not secure in any way. They only exist because someone else is willing to pay for them if you wish to sell your crypto. Crypto is not back by any government and it's not back by any tangible asset. It's a fictitious invention of a complex computer program. It only exist with any value because someone else is willing to pay for it with the expectation that someone else might pay even more.

The dollar, the euro, and a pound all have their issues with inflation but they are full faith and credit of those governments. On a long-term basis the jury is out if owning dollars will decline in value because of inflation. On a short-term basis accessing cash from a FDIC insured account through an ATM or 1000 of other places is the only secure way to have money.

Crypto is the most speculative investment since pyramid schemes began.

[BoomerTC]

Cryptocurrencies elicit very strong responses from people. There is almost no middle of the road people, either you think there is value in them or you think they are a ponzi scheme only useful for illicit activities.

I think there is value in this new digital currency and should be part of any portfolio. Are there risks? absolutely, but there are risks with anything, but if the SHTF, I'm ok heading to El Salvadore and spending my bitcoin. In fact, I won't be waiting until it hits the fan!

[JAFO]

Originally Posted by Onoboater

On a long-term basis the jury is out if owning dollars will decline in value because of inflation.

Oh please.. this is one of the most idiotic statements I've seen in a long time.

The jury delivered it's verdict, packed up, and went home, years ago. Thanks to inflation, the US dollar today is worth close to 1% of what it was a century ago.




And the trend shows little sign of slowing down.

[El Pinguino]

It would appear the reason bitcoin is used to transfer funds to El Salvador is twofold. Firstly to avoid bank fees on sending dollars and secondly to avoid IRS scrutiny.
Interesting piece here https://www.internationalaffairs.org...in-experiment/
Now my question is, having sent your bitcoin to your family in San Salvador how do they use it for daily living in a land where the $1 bill is king?

That $1 bill thing is based on my experience in Ecuador where a decent distance taxi ride is $2 and outside of a supermercado any note bigger than $10 is hard to shift.

And also who uses banks to make transfers these days? I use OFX. https://www.ofx.com/en-au/ Very close to middle rates and the only fee is A$15 if you are shifting less than - I think - $10k

One strange thing is that I can send money straight to an Ecuadorian bank account but if I send money to Chile I have to send it through an intermediate US bank associated with the recipients Chilean bank.

[PaulCrawhorn]

The law requires businesses to accept bitcoin payments.

Remittances from citizens living in the U.S. are a quarter of El Salvador’s GDP

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by PaulCrawhorn

The law requires businesses to accept bitcoin payments.

Remittances from citizens living in the U.S. are a quarter of El Salvador’s GDP

OK, that seems fine if I am buying something substantial like a new tractor but how does it work if , lets say, I want to pay for ten dollars worth of groceries ?

At some level surely you need to have some folding in your pocket.

That said here in Australia ATMs are getting hard to find as people are using less and less cash.

Pre 2020 I would use cash to buy anything under say $20.
During covid lots of businesses didn't want to accept cash.
Now I will buy 2 cups of coffee on a card.

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by PaulCrawhorn

The law requires businesses to accept bitcoin payments.

Remittances from citizens living in the U.S. are a quarter of El Salvador’s GDP

How does that work, exactly, for the 66% of El Salvador's population that has no internet whatsoever? Most businesses there in my experience didn't have even someone with a smart phone, how can you expect them to accept Bitcoin? Not to mention that there are lots of existing solutions for remittances that not only are easier, more accessible, and cost less than El Salvador's unique BTC setup, but also have the benefit that when you send enough money to buy 10 lbs of rice today it will still be able to buy 10 lbs of rice tomorrow and next week, while with BTC it might only buy you 8 lbs of rice if you get it the wrong week and it's value falls by 20%

BTC is a problem looking for a solution everywhere, and in El Salvador it's just a shiny object the President is quite transparently using to distract the population from the general failures of government.

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by JAFO

Oh please.. this is one of the most idiotic statements I've seen in a long time.

The jury delivered it's verdict, packed up, and went home, years ago. Thanks to inflation, the US dollar today is worth close to 1% of what it was a century ago.




And the trend shows little sign of slowing down.

And if BItcoin's has the same inflation over the next century as its inflation rate from Nov to today it would be worth something like .00000000000000000000001% of what it is today! Moderate inflation over a century is not only not a bad thing, it's far preferable to deflation. As I mentioned before, not for nothing they called the last time we had long term deflation in the U.S. the Great Depression.

[DumnMad]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

How does that work, exactly, for the 66% of El Salvador's population that has no internet whatsoever? Most businesses there in my experience didn't have even someone with a smart phone, how can you expect them to accept Bitcoin? Not to mention that there are lots of existing solutions for remittances that not only are easier, more accessible, and cost less than El Salvador's unique BTC setup, but also have the benefit that when you send enough money to buy 10 lbs of rice today it will still be able to buy 10 lbs of rice tomorrow and next week, while with BTC it might only buy you 8 lbs of rice if you get it the wrong week and it's value falls by 20%

BTC is a problem looking for a solution everywhere, and in El Salvador it's just a shiny object the President is quite transparently using to distract the population from the general failures of government.

Bitcoin Beach has been going since 2019. How it works is explained here:

www.bitcoinbeach.com

Like all disruptive innovation it has to put up with a massive attack from those who make their money from exploiting the old system.(I remember when it was widely believed microwaves caused cancer.)

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by DumnMad

Bitcoin Beach has been going since 2019. How it works is explained here:

www.bitcoinbeach.com

Like all disruptive innovation it has to put up with a massive attack from those who make their money from exploiting the old system.(I remember when it was widely believed microwaves caused cancer.)

It was also once widely believed that smoking cleared your lungs and glow in the dark made out of radium was a good idea....plenty of disruptive things are just plain disruptive and it's the height of facile reasoning to pull out some random invention that turned out to be useful as support for a completely different product. It must be great to be able to avoid the very specific and very real issues with your product by just calling anyone who disagrees with it "a massive attack from those who make their money from the old system", very rigorous argument that.

It's nice that 600 people are using BTC in El Salvador because they were forced to because that's how they were paid. When they could just as easily have been paid in dollars at far less cost and complexity. Again, this is a solution looking for a problem, and a pretty poor solution at that. Must have been great for those guys who were given a monthly salary rate in BTC in Nov only to find they could buy 25% less with it a month later in Dec. How is that a good thing again?