Published Costs of Cruising

[downunder]

Originally Posted by Don Lucas

And just want would it take to make a boat and crew insurable?

I can see that an insurance wouldn't issue compensative insurance for a falling apart unsafe boat. That makes good sense.

But for liability insurance the only things that would make you insurable is that you either don't have enough experience, or you have already caused so many claims that they know you are a bad bet.

So basically if you can not qualify for basic liability insurance you probably have no business being out on the water as you are just unsafe.

+1

[downunder]

Originally Posted by NorthPacific

Not having insurance is my choice. You want to be insured against risks related to me then buy some. Your risk, your insurance, your piece of mind, your cost. Me buy insurance for you? That's nuts.

When I drive, which is very rare, I have insurance that covers risk from uninsured drivers. It's for my benefit. It's at my cost. Makes sense to me.


Great Point

You know, at the end of the day if another boater does or doesn't have insurance then that is his or her business, until that person runs into my boat, then it becomes my business as well.

If you are willing and able to pay for the damage then I don't care if the money comes from your pocket or your insurance company's pocket, as long as it's not my pocket.
__________________


Great Point

What you are saying is that you don't care if you take someone down with you. Bad luck if I damage someone else but if they hit me.

[downunder]

Originally Posted by wolfenzee

Whether or not someone is insured is quickly becoming someone else's decision.
It is getting harder and harder to go places with out insurance.
The required liability insurance is relatively cheap, it gets expensive when you start to add in full coverage of an expensive boat. I was wondering what people were complaining about after I looked around and found a company that would insure my wooden boat for full time international cruising for about $75/mo...then I realized some people pay more for their gadgets and gizmos than I paid for my entire boat (gizmos included). My insurance had liability and like any good car insurance "uninsured boaters".
I don't like being required to do things, even if I would choose to do it myself. Liability is cheap (especially if you don't travel very far). My boat is my home...it's all I have in the world, that is why I will be getting full coverage.

Good attitude to the subject.

[Doodles]

Originally Posted by wolfenzee

Whether or not someone is insured is quickly becoming someone else's decision.
It is getting harder and harder to go places with out insurance.
The required liability insurance is relatively cheap, it gets expensive when you start to add in full coverage of an expensive boat. I was wondering what people were complaining about after I looked around and found a company that would insure my wooden boat for full time international cruising for about $75/mo...then I realized some people pay more for their gadgets and gizmos than I paid for my entire boat (gizmos included). My insurance had liability and like any good car insurance "uninsured boaters".
I don't like being required to do things, even if I would choose to do it myself. Liability is cheap (especially if you don't travel very far). My boat is my home...it's all I have in the world, that is why I will be getting full coverage.

Sounds like good coverage. Does it cover your loss if you're hit by say a fisherman in his longtail in some backwater of Indonesia? If you are out cruising inexpensive third world areas I imagine most of your risk will be with the local traffic, which is usually uninsured.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by NorthPacific

I would have insurance if I could afford it. Peace of mind. My old boat is it. Life time of work. No house no stash of cash. That's it. If it burns sinks or is stolen. I have nothing. I am also a cancer survivor. Maybe that will kill me first, or lightening, or a super ship with no one on the bridge, or no one willing to change course, or maybe I skid on the crap roads driving to the boat tomorrow, or or or.

I used to climb, all about calculated risk. In the Alps the death toll was staggering. Many caused by rock being knocked down from someone in another climbing party. No one ever sued, no one had insurance. I am not reckless, mean spirited, blatantly in your face screw you attitude. But the way I look at the Oceans, they are a harsh environment that, like high mountains do not welcome intrusions by man. When we untie the lines we are putting ourselves at risk of death, plain and simple. That is part of the appeal, to go to someplace we are not supposed to.

So while in a perfect world we could all have the perfect boat, the perfect, crew, the perfect insurance, have limitless resources, and be Cancer free, it is not going to happen is it? Well not for most of us anyway. Most of the cruisers who I meet when they stop on the North Coast of BC do not have insurance.

I completely respect your reply and situation.

Not sure if it was this or another thread but the question was asked under what circumstances you would ask someone to pay for damage to your boat. Almost everyone answered with some version of "it depends".

We all know stuff happens. So if someone smacked my boat due to a mechanical problem or a bad crosswind at the fuel dock, weren't drunk and obnoxious or driving a power boat or catamaran ( only joking), and looked like it would be a hardship to pay damages I would let it slide; my contribution to the cruisers' good will fund.

The world is not without risk. Even if you lock yourself in a bunker under ground. I used to cave dive. Don't know if I would call the death toll staggering I lost several friends and acquaintances over the years. I think my wife likes sailing a bit more.

[wolfenzee]

Originally Posted by Doodles

Sounds like good coverage. Does it cover your loss if you're hit by say a fisherman in his longtail in some backwater of Indonesia? If you are out cruising inexpensive third world areas I imagine most of your risk will be with the local traffic, which is usually uninsured.

They have "uninsured boaters insurance" and as far as Indonesia, they have a plan called "Jackline"...for coverage in distant places

[Travelnik]

All this talk about insurance is BORING AS HELL!

Can't we switch to something less controversial, like guns, anchors or Obama?

[wolfenzee]

Originally Posted by Doodles

Sounds like good coverage. Does it cover your loss if you're hit by say a fisherman in his longtail in some backwater of Indonesia? If you are out cruising inexpensive third world areas I imagine most of your risk will be with the local traffic, which is usually uninsured.

They have "uninsured boaters insurance" and as far as Indonesia, they have a plan called "Jackline"...for coverage in distant places

[Doodles]

Originally Posted by dsmastern

All this talk about insurance is BORING AS HELL!

Can't we switch to something less controversial, like guns, anchors or Obama?

Obama? You need to get over it ... you lost!

[Travelnik]

Originally Posted by Doodles

Obama? You need to get over it ... you lost!

How do you know I lost?

Maybe I didn't play at all!

[Doodles]

Originally Posted by dsmastern

How do you know I lost?

Maybe I didn't play at all!

Just a lucky guess.

Shame on you for not participating though.

[Travelnik]

Originally Posted by Doodles

Just a lucky guess.

Shame on you for not participating though.

If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice...

...I will choose above the sphere, I will choose free will!

~Rush (the band, not Limbaugh!)



.

[NorthPacific]

Originally Posted by downunder

What you are saying is that you don't care if you take someone down with you. Bad luck if I damage someone else but if they hit me.

Nope not what I am saying at all. I would ask you to read my posts again. Good luck with planning your cat!

[Doodles]

Originally Posted by wolfenzee

They have "uninsured boaters insurance" and as far as Indonesia, they have a plan called "Jackline"...for coverage in distant places

Seems like this should satisfy most here as far as liability coverage. Arguing as to whether someone should be required to carry insurance is kind of a mute point when you consider what insurance laws and civil court systems are really like in the inexpensive cruising grounds that are left, which is where we want to be anyway isn't it? Can you imagine trying to collect from someone in PNG? Some kind of "uninsured" boaters coverage is the only option you really have.

[Clamdigger]

Originally Posted by NorthPacific

"Don't be a jerk by getting personal and congratulations on a failed negotiation. And by the way... I only fly Gulfstream."

Nar Bossy relax how can I be personal no idea who you are? But I am commenting on what I consider an elitist and pompous attitude that your posts portray. LOL I suppose flying Gulfstream means something to you, good for you! Enjoy polishing your mooring bouy.

But if you would like to renegotiate and pay my insurance quote, pay the haul out fees and survey fees I would consider promising to stay away from your polished mooring bouy. Nothing wrong with good insurance.

Or buy me an epirb and I will promise to stay out of your SEA and in my Ocean. See I can be reasonable :-) and very unjerk like!

Well I don't have to be 'unjerk like' when I read posts from an arrogant boater who thinks he's better than I because he owns a house with 3 leased moorings! His is EXACTLY the type of mooring I aim to tie up to overnight...so as not to damage the eelgrass or coral you understand.

I say the West Coast has their 'Baja HA HA', then the East Coast should have their own 'BVI HA HA HA!. We could all find out through the local BVI dive shops where there is a REEF of a SAILBOAT with some nearby MOORING BOUYS and then have a contest to see how many TRANSIENT sailboats can tie to one! I mean heck, what's a reef except a DIVE ATTRACTION, and what's a good place to dive without a few good MOORING BOUYS to tie up to?! It would be quite the picture with all those low rent sailboats cluttering up a moorage, especially from shoreside at Sunset! We could all take turns taking pictures of the house(s) on the island, and our 'beater boats' in the most pristine Moorage we'll encounter in our lifetimes...All it takes to create a 'Rendevous' is a destination. Heck we're ALL so low class we'll HAVE to through a POTLUCK every night from our canned goods stores, how sad. The good part is we can then spend the rest of the evening singing songs across the cockpits at one another until Sunrise...now THAT would be memorable and worth every penny it 'costs' to 'cruise' in the BVI's! Are'nt they a pair of underwear, BVI's/ 'tighty whiteys'? Oh no, those are BVD's! UPTIGHT TIGHTY WHITEYS GUARDING THEIR MOORINGS FROM LESSER MORTALS WHO SAIL WITH LESSER MEANS!

I'm not paying for any type of insurance! 20 YEARS with that car insurance Pro(ctologist)ive PERFECT driving record of over 35 years accident free, and I got rear-ended and they did not deal with squat! So forget me paying any insurance company! If my uninsured/engineless boat touches your Princess I'll make amends to the best of my ability, after all sailing IS supposed to be a 'gentlemen's sport'....Oh, that was in the old school days before lawyers!

I've spent plenty of years cruising on $500 or less per month in and out of the USA. I don't smoke, rarely drink so there's a bunch of money enroute and in ports saved. I prefer to cook aboard and share meals with other liveaboard sailors. That saves quite a bit of money vs eating out every day, 3 times, in ports. I Will go out with other folks a few times a month, but I prefer to cook for myself because I enjoy it. I was taught 'cruising' by an old New England sailor who said "the food tastes a whole heck of a lot better once you put the sails to bed, and the view is MUCH better from the cockpit than any resturant ashore". I still have this opinion 35 years later. Folks RAVE about his Fish Chowder recipe I make! What 'magic' is someone in a resturant going to 'perform', with the SAME fresh ingredients I can buy, for half the amount of the price of the dinner, from the same store, fisherman,etc that I can't in my own galley? Ok, I never fry anything aboard my boat because I was taught that's the quickest way to burn a boat to the waterline. If I'm ashore and want something fried I'll get my conch fritters from the conch lady.

My boat's have always had all the proper equiptment to get me there and back, and the one's I've crewed on more so. I anchor out or use a mooring overnight, and if no one asks for payment I leave at Sunrise to open the mooring up for day use and head out to cruise the area. A marina is for emergencies to me. I go in one day a month at best for an overnight. I row the laundry in, the clean and water/food out. Cruising to me is about travelling by boat to experience a different part of the Oceans. Climate, people, food and surroundings does'nt cost as much if you are'nt trying to be noticed. I'm not a pretentious sailor, I'm an old Swamp Yankee who willing shares his meals aboard his boat, or someone else's, for conversation about the weather, surroundings and boat types.