Is the same boat worth more in the USA than in Australia?

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by john61ct

Got a PM, said only boats selling through surveyors require passing surveys?

Maybe just more stringent insurance requirements. . .

Their insurance requirements are less costly than the US and generally simple. Offshore insurance from there is usually underwritten by Lloyds.
Seems like in most places you get a survey, so no difference. It is when preparing to exit the country that a Cat 1 certificate is required. Nothing to do with the market price of boats, as the certs are only valid for something like 30 days and include the specific crew.

[valhalla360]

Another thing in terms of pricing (not necessarily value) is in the USA a one off or even worse home built takes a huge hit in terms of future sales price...no matter how good the quality.

A lot of posters on this board suggest, the same isn't true in Australia.

So if you are just looking for a boat that meets your needs and you plan to keep it for 20+ years...don't get too hung up on resale value. If you think you are going to bring it to the USA and sell in a month for huge profits....I would give it a little more thought.

[El Pinguino]

Nothing but quality boats in Australasia?... OK...whatever... https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/953...nd-New-Zealand

It all depends on the exchange rates.... some years ago an Australian dollar would buy you over US$1 and people were bringing yachts from the US into Australia by the gross....

Now an Australian dollar only buys you about 75c...... so that trade has gone south so to speak....

That said .. I met a bloke in early 2016 who was buying s/h Bavarias in the Carib and sailing them to NZ, importing, selling, a boat a year....

Now the exchange rate has gone the other way so possibly if you have US$ in your pocket there are bargains to be had in the SW Pacific....

But it is not a game for the faint of heart....

[RexSnr]

"I’m looking to buy a sailing cat, and I’m fine with a well-surveyed home build. My requirements include draft.html" target="_blank">shallow-IRJDSUNE9932123321222xxeww-draft and petrol outboards. Aussies make a lot of boats that suit me."



Wow!! Not many have paid attention to what the poster actually said. He wanted a circa 12 metre, well surveyed, home build with shallow draft and petrol outboards. Firstly, being Australian and knowing the cat market here particularly well, the poster is absolutely correct. This sized boat with outboards in Australia are very good value. His spec is very specific and there are a number of brands that would meet it. The two that will be most prolific and are excellent sea boats are the Seawinds and any of Jeff Schionnings boats. Some of these are diesel powered but both also used to, and still do, make outboard models. Outboard cats are not as popular (hence the lower prices) although do offer a LOT of advantages over diesels. A new set of Honda 20 hp outboards (should I say 'clip ons') = 1 day and maybe $6,000 each - 30hp models not much more than $7,000 each. Diesels - how long and how much? The outboards are lighter = faster, they trim completely out of the water = less drag (faster), and would compete well in fuel burn, albeit of the more volatile fuel. Their main legacy is smaller alternators and on some brands, not so good in reverse, but Honda's have features that offer good reverse performance. Add a couple of solar panels and all is good. Ensure your fuel lines are kept good quality and replaced as necessary and keep an eye on the fuel system condition and petrol won't make the boat any more dangerous than any of the millions of outboard powered survey boats throughout the world.



There are other brands here but to meet his spec, these are the two to search for. I know for a fact that Schionning has never suffered a structural problem in one of their boats from design. Both are very well designed boats. Schionnings are designed for speed and enjoy dagger boards, zero keels = shallow draft, a lot in the desired size will be powered by outboards and all are bullet proof. One argument is that Schionning boats are kit boats, but reality shows that anyone that bothers to build an entire boat is pretty "anal" and most if anything are over built.

Of course it would be important to get a GOOD surveyor to check the selected boat out and they would need to be experienced in these cats designs. Why not ask the designer himself? Jeff is still about and personally knows every boat. He also recommends that they are built in end grain balsa and epoxy resin. The end grain balsa stops water ingress spreading all through the core if a leak occurs.

For what you have asked for, both these brands would be ideal, should be able to be purchased under A$200,000 if you look around and will fit the spec perfectly.
Now if we forget the spec, then most other comments are very correct. As a rule our boats are expensive, but not the ones in question. No import duty was paid on these!! Seawinds of this style were built in Australia but are now all built in Vietnam. I say enjoy these brands and march forward as planned.

[RexSnr]

One more point about resale values - Schionnings are not well known in the USA and do take a long time to sell there. Seawinds are retailed there and do carry a good reputation, but again not as widely known as the home grown US boats.

Pound for pound both these brands would stack up very well against most US cats - they have high tunnel clearances, centred weights, bullet proof designs and both are fast compared to most. For that matter, all the Australian cats are fast when compared to most other brands. They won't have the interior space of the Lagoons and other charter market cats - their hulls are narrower for better performance, but they do punch way above their weights and should be looked at seriously by any prospective cat buyer in the US. You won't find any of the name brand Australian cats with pitifully low bridgedeck clearance.

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by RexSnr

......

For what you have asked for, both these brands would be ideal, should be able to be purchased under A$200,000 if you look around and will fit the spec perfectly.
Now if we forget the spec, then most other comments are very correct. As a rule our boats are expensive, but not the ones in question. No import duty was paid on these!! Seawinds of this style were built in Australia but are now all built in Vietnam. I say enjoy these brands and march forward as planned.

So aud200k is usd150k. Add in the shipping at usd40k. I'm not seeing any deal here.
While the locally built cat manufacturers might not pay the import tariffs, the duties are there to protect the homeland manufacturers who then charge higher prices. They also pay duty on imported parts.

[wordsmithereen]

I am in boat sales here in Florida and I can tell you it is quite the opposite as boats are more expensive from everything I see. That just comes from keeping up with the market I admit since I have not had anything to do with a client buying or selling through there.

I am curious though why you want a gas engine and not diesel.

[Mike Banks]

Meatservo--

Sea Winds now made in Vietnam?

D'Oh!!!

I guess I should not be astonished. I suppose that is another sad example of Australia being "A Global Trade Example to the World". Our main exports, apart from iron ore--seems to be jobs.

I was removing a bronze adjustable mushroom vent from my vessel a while back to fit a heat shield beneath it--when I noticed some strange indentations underneath it where the sealant had remained stuck to it. On cleaning it off it said "Made in Australia"

A genuine antique!

[Markusik]

Originally Posted by wordsmithereen

I am in boat sales here in Florida and I can tell you it is quite the opposite as boats are more expensive from everything I see. That just comes from keeping up with the market I admit since I have not had anything to do with a client buying or selling through there.



I am curious though why you want a gas engine and not diesel.

I’m partial to petrol outboards because;
1) Much less expensive engines and props.
2) Much lighter.
3) No drag at sail, lower draft under power (relative to sail drives, anyway).
4) Fewer thru-hulls below waterline.
5) Easier and less expensive maintenance (YMMV).
6) Same fuel as tender.
7) Less likely to snag anything, easier to remove items snagged.

I don’t like the flammability issues, or the lower energy density, or that they are more easily stolen, but there are workarounds for these and for my purposes the math is clear.

Someday, an attractive diesel outboard of the right output will be built. The Neander Shark or Yanmar 111 aren’t there yet.

I’ve alsobeen paying attention to Easy (Snell), Grainger, Farrier, Simpson, Kelsall, Schionning etc. models that come to market, and they seem to have a lot to offer. The Seawind 1160 Lite and 1190 Sport are lovely boats, just a hair small for my tastes, and rarely if ever seen used; bargain hunting is in my nature, and “new boat bargain” seems an oxymoron.

Thanks all for the input. It seems that, even with the favorable exchange rate, it seems unlikely to make this a bargain without at least sailing the boat across the pond myself. Pity, some beauty boats down under.

Cheers!

[Uncle Bob]

Originally Posted by Mike Banks

Meatservo--

Sea Winds now made in Vietnam?

D'Oh!!!

I guess I should not be astonished. I suppose that is another sad example of Australia being "A Global Trade Example to the World". Our main exports, apart from iron ore--seems to be jobs.

I was removing a bronze adjustable mushroom vent from my vessel a while back to fit a heat shield beneath it--when I noticed some strange indentations underneath it where the sealant had remained stuck to it. On cleaning it off it said "Made in Australia"

A genuine antique!

Yep, now made in Bittenarm, but don't worry, the Aussie suppliers and trades were well and truly ripped off when the move was made, so I am reliably informed by several of them.