EU, VAT and other riddles

[ProjectManaia]

Hello all,
I am currently out boat shopping again and came across one in Turkey which should become austrian flagged after purchase. Now the situation is:

Boat is from 1984, built in the UK and sailed there, later exported and registered in Sweden.
2007 moved to turkey and registered in the USA. In 2016 the registration was changed to turkey as well.

So, first question is, do I have to pay VAT? I keep reading various pages but dont get the right idea it seems.
How much is the VAT where and how is the value of the boat estimated?

I hope someone has more ideas and a better handle on those things than me.
All the best and tha nk you already!
Manuel

[vw1961]

Hi Manuel

I believe that once the boat has been outside the EU for 2 (?) years the payed VAT status is deleted. So it doesn't really matter if the VAT has been paid before 2007 or so, you would need to play it again.
My boat is Austrian flagged too and based in Turkey, anyway when I was in Greece last summer nobody asked me about the VAT status and I did not have to pay. Of course I am interested in opinions how other countries handle that (for example italy).

PS: Where in Turkey is your future boat? If you need some help, I did the same you are going to do now last year.

Markus

[ProjectManaia]

Hello and thank you for the reply!
YES i am certainly grateful for all advice you can give me!
Also i am curious about others experiences for vat import. I know it needs to be paid first port i the EU. I read cyprus is cheaper? Is that true? Where do the numbers come from? Is there special deals to look out for?

[ProjectManaia]

Originally Posted by vw1961

Hi Manuel

I believe that once the boat has been outside the EU for 2 (?) years the payed VAT status is deleted. So it doesn't really matter if the VAT has been paid before 2007 or so, you would need to play it again.
My boat is Austrian flagged too and based in Turkey, anyway when I was in Greece last summer nobody asked me about the VAT status and I did not have to pay. Of course I am interested in opinions how other countries handle that (for example italy).

PS: Where in Turkey is your future boat? If you need some help, I did the same you are going to do now last year.

Markus

Sorry forgot to answer,
She is near marmaris in datca

[double u]

afaik there is a deadline in the past & for boats older than that no VAT payment has to be proven, I don't know the year though.

[ProjectManaia]

Originally Posted by double u

afaik there is a deadline in the past & for boats older than that no VAT payment has to be proven, I don't know the year though.

I came across this as well, i believe the year is 1986, seems to vary though depending on when the cou try in question (i suppose the country of entering the eu) joined the EU....

Or perhaps it refers to the flag cou try? Or nationality of the skipper (if citizen of the EU)

I tried to understand all tjis all day today and slowly getting knots in my brain 😂

[double u]

btw: plan for our next flag is NL, Austria way too much hassle & rules! I happily trade one red stripe for a blue one to get around all austrias rules (however much "sense" they make,...epirbs & the lot...)

[ProjectManaia]

How easy or tricky is the dutch one to get? Just curiosity....?

[Pete7]

Its not the original VAT duty that is important but the import duty + VAT that you will be charged if you declare it. This is the UK rules and yes they are supposed to be harmonised, but that means 27 different countries all agreeing. This may help explain the UK rules:

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...nd-from-the-uk

However, I suspect a 1984 boat looks like an older boat therefore less likely to attract attention than say a shinny new yacht. Me, I would just register it in Austria if that is your nationality which would look right and what a harbour master would expect to see.

Pete

[ProjectManaia]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Its not the original VAT duty that is important but the import duty + VAT that you will be charged if you declare it. This is the UK rules and yes they are supposed to be harmonised, but that means 27 different countries all agreeing. This may help explain the UK rules:

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...nd-from-the-uk

However, I suspect a 1984 boat looks like an older boat therefore less likely to attract attention than say a shinny new yacht. Me, I would just register it in Austria if that is your nationality which would look right and what a harbour master would expect to see.

Pete

Thank you for that answer,
For me the home country just seemed like a logical choice, obviously I am open for other suggestions and opinions...
But VAT wise what I now understand is upon first arrival i the EU I shoukd have a lot of cash in my pockets for customs....

[Pete7]

No to large amounts of cash or customs will really become interested in you and were the money came from, plus you arrived by small boat unannounced, wow they would have a field day.


Pete

[ProjectManaia]

But wouldnt it still be customs where i have to pay VAT upon first arrival? Never saw a cradit card machine there...?
Sorry if this sounds silly but i a actually wondering....

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by ProjectManaia

Hello and thank you for the reply!
YES i am certainly grateful for all advice you can give me!
Also i am curious about others experiences for vat import. I know it needs to be paid first port i the EU. I read cyprus is cheaper? Is that true? Where do the numbers come from? Is there special deals to look out for?

Please do a search on this topic, I’ve literally written 200-300 posts on this subject. We are US and Canadian citizens who keep a non vat paid boat in the Med indefinitely... all done legally and without paying vat.

A boatload of vat misinformation and nonsense on this thread so far.

[ProjectManaia]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Please do a search on this topic, I’ve literally written 200-300 posts on this subject. We are US and Canadian citizens who keep a non vat paid boat in the Med indefinitely... all done legally and without paying vat.

A boatload of vat misinformation and nonsense on this thread so far.

Thaank you for this, i will try find your relevant posts and keep digging for the right informations

[valhalla360]

If the boat had stayed in the EU the whole time, you would be golden as the boat was built before VAT was required and thus would be grandfathered in.

Normally a boat that stays outside of the EU for 3 or more years, loses it's VAT paid status. What I'm not sure of since at one time it met the grandfather clause, does the 3yr rule apply? I suspect yes, but not sure.

If you could show evidence of any periodic returns to the EU, that might negate the 3yr rule and keep the grandfathered VAT situation in place.

As far as who and how the value is assessed...no one ever wants to talk about that. I don't know how much room there is to negotiate the assessed value. I found one source a year or so ago that suggested Spain sets the assessed value at 10% of the bluebook value but was never able to get any confirmation. That would make the VAT effectively around 2% of the boat value and I'm sure people would be falling over themselves to get down to the tax office and have official VAT status.

In the end we sold before we ran out of ways to extend temporary import, so we never had to come to a final answer.