Canadians Who Purchased in USA

[rigormortis]

Compatriots:
I am looking at buying a boat in Florida and de-documenting it with USCG (as required) and registering it as Canadian boat. Looking at Canadian ship's registry guidelines it seems I must produce a bill of sale and have the name ok'd and registration is forthcoming. I plan to make any necessary modifications in Florida in the 90 day grace period for state taxes, then go sailing. Not planning to come back to Canada for a while and then only for a visit.
I'm thinking I don't have to pay Ontario sales tax (I live in Tnunder Bay) in this case but I'd like to know for sure before calculating the boat budget. I phoned ON. retail sales tax folks but, as usual, only entered the telephone message maze. Never got out.
Any advice appreciated.
Pete.

[Rastarea]

theslapdash.com

Check out this site, this couple from Calgary purchased in FL and then moved on down south. They have details about the registration process and it was not that easy.

Sli

[Vasco]

Rigor,

Not a problem. Don't have to pay sales tax or GST. If it's under 39 feet you don't even need a tonnage survey to register it. Just a couple of pictures will do. Just follow the guidelines at the registry site. Register the boat in Toronto. They have a bit more experience with this than other ports of registry in Ontario.

[GordMay]

WELCOME aboard, Pete.

I suppose you’ve visited the Transport & Services Canada websites:

Vessel Registration - Small Vessels

Boat Licence Number - Office of Boating Safety - Transport Canada

http://www.servicecanada.gc.ca/en/sc/boats/index.shtml

[Teej]

Like Pete, we are Canadians and in the process of buying a boat - in our case a catamaran. The boat was bought and registered offshore by the current owner so will be similarily bought offshore by us. My wife and I have several objectives with this purchase that we sure need help understanding:
1. Have it registered under a Canadian flag so arranging for a tonnage survey, which I thought was a prerequisite, was going to be a challenge. Based on the response to Pete's question that a boat under 39' does not require this to be done is encouraging but that was not the experience shared by the Vancouver owners of Slapdash.
2. Our plan is to use the catamaran as snowbirds in the Caribbean (i.e. winter months) but wanted to leave the boat in Florida. From what I've read that means we would need to pay a Florida "user" tax (6%) which is cost prohibitive. Georgia may also be an option for off season storage but don't know what tax implications that might present either. If anyone has experience in a similar situation I would sure appreciate hearing from you.

In sum, we're anxious to have the boat registered as Canadian and then be able to leave her off season in the U.S.

Alternatively, if the U.S. off season storage is impractical for tax reasons, I would sure be pleased to hear of other Canadians' methods to attain the snowbird cruiser lifestyle (late spring, summer and fall in Canada and then 4-6 months on one's own boat in the Caribbean).

Thanks in advance for sharing your insights.

[rigormortis]

Thanks for the replies to my questions.
Teej:
Here is quote from Transport Can. page on registering boats. If 15m or less you can get by without at tonnage surveyor. You need pictures and some arithmetic. The folks who bought 'Slapdash' indicated that this rule of 'Simplified Method' did not apply to multihulls but I haven't read that. You would be smart to call Transport Canada to clear this up, especially as there are no tonnage surveyors listed for Florida on Trans. Can. webiste.

"Have the vessel measured for tonnage under Canadian rules, either by the Simplified Method or by a duly appointed Tonnage Measurer. If the vessel is to be measured using the Simplified Method, this applies for vessels up to and including 15 metres tonnage measurement length (TML). For more details, please refer to the Simplified Method of Tonnage Measurement [PDF file, 38 KB]. If the vessel is to be measured by a Tonnage Measurer, you can either contact your Port of Registry or refer to Tonnage Measurements."

Pete.

[Traveller]

Would anyone happen to know...

As a Canadian living in Canada, would it matter where I register a vessel? Can I choose to register it in any country (provided the other country allows foreign ownership, etc)?

Provided a boat can/will be recognized as being your permanent residence, would you then fall under the tax laws of the country of registry when it comes to income tax, etc.

And what does Canadian Registered in bond mean? There is a boat in the US registered in Canada and that is what the owner told me when I asked about its registration.

[hellosailor]

Pete, you might have a Catch-22 problem. I don't know that a Canadian-registered vessel is allowed into the US without a standard US cruising permit, which is valid for 12 months (and then the vessel MUST leave US waters for a set time before being allowed to reenter on a new one). Key word "enter", you're not allowed to enter the US until you have the permit. If the vessel is already IN the US...well, you can't enter it if you're already here. You might want to contact our Customs & Immigration people, there are web pages up on the cruising permit but reflagging a vessel wasn't something I'd seen on them. It is possible that you would have to take the vessel out of US waters, then flag it, then bring it back in.

US state registation as a motor vehicle is open to anyone--that's got nothing to do with flagging or documentation, but usually means paying sales or use tax at the time of registration. And typically, if the vehicle (car or boat) is in a state for 90+ days, it MUST be registered in that state, unless it is foreign-flagged. Failure to do so can result in a tax seizure of the vessel.

You and Alex might both want to check out the web sites for each state (Florida, Georgia, etc.) to find out state regulations involving taxes and registration, they are different in each state but there is usually a "Department of Motor Vehicles" and a state tax department, each with web pages and toll-free numbers to answer questions like these. The Canadian regs (for taxes) vary by province, I'm told.

[Teej]

Pete, thanks for the links to Transport Canada - I'll check further to see if I could register a catamaran without a tonnage survey.

[Chief Engineer]

I found Transport Canada to be VERY VERY helpful in tracking down a vessel that left port without paying their bill.

The point being that their live customer support was excellent

[Traveller]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

You and Alex might both want to check out the web sites for each state (Florida, Georgia, etc.) to find out state regulations involving taxes and registration. The Canadian regs (for taxes) vary by province, I'm told.

I was thinking more "off shore" where personal income taxes are lower. I hate the thought of giving my government more than I have to...actually, anything at all. They can just send my pension checks to me where I'll make better use of them.

[cameron forsyth]

On a similar subject purchasing a US registered boat need to reflag. Had a boat with Panamanian registration, found it a bit expensive, wandering if reflagging with one of the ex-British colonial dependencies is easier and or cheaper. Panamanian business is generally structured to commercial shipping. Comments and guidance welcome.

[rigormortis]

Cameron:
What is your nationality? If you are Canadian you likely would register it in Canada. It is realitively inexpensive. I ended up buying a boat in Portland, Oregon and de-documented it with USCG (required to) and registered it in Vancouver, BC. No sales tax.

[cameron forsyth]

British presently living in Central America, will be cruising the Caribbean and Pacific coast of Central America

[avb3]

Originally Posted by rigormortis

Cameron:
What is your nationality? If you are Canadian you likely would register it in Canada. It is realitively inexpensive. I ended up buying a boat in Portland, Oregon and de-documented it with USCG (required to) and registered it in Vancouver, BC. No sales tax.

No GST?

I was told by the gubermint (can't remember which dept), that no problem re-flagging to Canadian, but as soon as the boat enters Canadian waters, the GST will kick in.

Did you boat ever hit Canada? If not, I understand the no taxes part, but if so, how did you avoid them?