60 Feet on the Chesapeake

[DSDman]

I know I run the risk of getting beat up for asking a question about cost of ownership, but I have a specific question for this area. I have found places to keep a 60 footer all within an hour of the house that range from 10k a year to 3 k per year. Any folks living on the bay with a 60 footer or so willing to share "normal" cost range per year. figure using the boat at least 2 weekends a month while fixin her up. So probably keep her at a marina. but open to ideas.

[Hotel L]

Are you asking slip fees or cost of ownership?

[DSDman]

I have a pretty good idea on what slip fees are. Just wondering what cost of ownership is to see if it jives with the numbers I'm coming up with. I know it will vary boat to boat but I hope to get a good idea from the average. I imagine it will either confirm my numbers or cause me to rethink or refigure my numbers. I'm just guessing though and would like real data. I've read over and over about the cost of a larger boat, I can do most of the work and plan on it so I'm hoping to mitigate some of the expense, but hearing from real folks with real 60 footers in my area would be most informative.

[DSDman]

maybe a mod can move this to dollars and cents? probably should have been there to begin with.

[capngeo]

Originally Posted by DSDman

maybe a mod can move this to dollars and cents? probably should have been there to begin with.

Happy to! BTW, in the future if you (or anyone) decide you posted in the wrong section, just hit the “report post” button... it “shotguns” out to all the moderators and faster action can be taken, than waiting for one of us to actually appear in the thread.

[speciald@ocens.]

My boat - Taswell 58AS (59'6") is for sale by david Walters. I have kept it in Baltimore or Annapolis during the Summer for the last 7 years. Surprisingly, in the last three years I have been able to get a six month lease in Annapolis. The downturn in the economy has some benefits. Slips for a boat this size are rare on the Chesapeake but available more frequently. The cheapest slips that I know of are in the Maryland Yacht Club. A friend of mine kept his SunDeer 60 there before he left to sail around the world. maintenance costs will very by how handy you are. Few yards on the Bay can lift a boat that size - $600 at Bert Jabin's.

[osirissail]

Originally Posted by DSDman

I have a pretty good idea on what slip fees are. Just wondering what cost of ownership is to see if it jives with the numbers I'm coming up with. . . .

So I think you are asking what does it cost to own and maintain a 60 ft vessel.

60 ft What? A sailboat? Or is it a power yacht? A houseboat? How old is the boat? What condition is it in? You did not say. So you have asked a very non-specific question as the cost of ownership of a power yacht or a sailboat.

It can vary from near nothing to mega-money depending upon age, model and type of vessel (sail or power).

[DSDman]

Yes it was a very non specific question. More specifically a 60 ft sail boat, draws about 5.5 ft to 6 ft. ketch rig, fiberglass. Older boat fairly well maintained from the early eighties. I have found two places I may keep it...Gregg Neck while I am working on it and then probably down in Cambridge once I sort it out a bit. Both places seem very reasonable for a slip. I didn't want someone to post any data because they weren't exactly a match. I can sort our the differences still just looking for data. general stuff routine maint cost, haul out fees, insurance, fuel, etc.maybe something s I have not thought about.

[osirissail]

Again, we don't know the make/model which can vary the costs wildly.

But anyway, an approximately 60 ft sailing ketch, FRG with about a 6 ft draft could be a Gulfstar or Irwin or a half dozen other boats.

In any case, 60 ft of vessel means it probably has a lot of "stuff" in it including a large hp diesel engine and probably a genset. Ketch rig means a whole additional sail and standing rigging and running rigging. Twice the amount of stuff to maintain than a simple sloop.

30 years old means the "grace period" when things generally will work for 5 or more years is long gone. So major systems will need repairs or replacement possibly including standing rigging. The age also brings up the probability of hull blisters - providing there aren't any collision or other damage to the hull. Rudder, propeller(s), shaft(s), and associated struts and bearings are probably worn if they have not been replaced in the last few years.

Since the sailboat you describe could be similar to my boat which is only less than 10 years older - here is an idea of expenses keeping the boat running and doing periodic "re-fits" for the last decade.
2002 - in refit - $23,000.00
2003 - shakedown cruising coastal - $21,000.00
2004 - cruising - $9800.00
2005 - cruising and new sails - $23,000.00
2006 - cruising - $6,000.00
2007 - cruising and haul out for paint and repairs - 12,000.00
2008 - cruising - $9,000.00
2009 - cruising - $8,000.00
2010 - cruising - $8,000.00
2011 - cruising and haul out for paint and repairs - $12,000.00

So you can see the bigger and older the boat the bigger the bills. The above figures include marinas (mostly anchoring when cruising), fuel, repair parts and replacements, and haul-outs. The figures do NOT include personal food, and personal expenses - only the costs of keeping the boat operating. Of course you can opt to not repair/replace broken stuff and save money in one year to only double or triple the cost in the next year.

[DSDman]

osiris,
Thanks thats exactly the kind of stuff I'm looking for. averaging it out I would say 8200 is a normal cruising year for you. add another 4000 for haul out and bottom job every third year or so. I don't want to be too specific on the boat yet, I still have not pulled the trigger on buying it. trying to convince myself I can afford it and still have fun with it. As soon as I do buy it I will shout it from the mast top. Just trying to get the price where I can pay cash for it and not have to finance anything. that makes all this so much more affordable, not having to pay a bank as well as neptune.

[DSDman]

one question can you define a cruising year? How many days out?

[osirissail]

Cruising year equals 365 days out except for leap years then 366 - always living everyday on the boat and except for "shakedown cruises" - away from USA and its comparatively good sources of economical parts and supplies.

[DSDman]

Since of am still firmly anchored to the good ol USA for next ten years or so my time on the boat will be much less, jobs tend to have that effect. But it gives me lots of time to sort the boat out and learn. I gotta believe my annual fixed cost will be something less...gulp! hopefully. (not including repairs.)

[osirissail]

Funny thing, if you don't use the boat there is only storage costs but then systems start to "rot" from disuse and the repair and replacement is extremely expensive. Long periods of storage can pretty much guarantee massive replacements will be needed to get the boat functioning again.

And then continuous usage wears things out and consumables like fuel, oil and other gases and fluids add up. Wear and tear starts to kick in and after a decade on the road, my boat, at least, needs an extensive refit. It is still usable and functional but long term wear items like plexiglass, bearings, caulking, paint, standing and running rigging and a hundred other things need to be taken apart and replaced or refurbished.

So finding some middle area between the two extremes would most probably result in the least ongoing expenses. To be honest, IMHO, you cannot remove any costs categories except those directly related to the humans on the boat - those being food, drink, etc., etc. Everything associated with the boat and all the system inside need to be included to get a realistic grasp of the true costs of having the boat.

There will be periods of time, even a year or so, without a major expense for repair or replacement - and then - wham, burned out transmission, blown cylinder, successive alternator failures, blown out exhausts, rigging parts exploding/fracturing, blown out sails, etc. That year will be a rather expensive year in contrast to the "easy" years. Best I can get is two or three economical years before an expensive year comes alone.

[DSDman]

Thanks I agree with that logic. I operate large aircraft and they are the same way. keep them moving and they do fine. Let one sit for a few days and chances are things will start breaking. Thats one of the reasons I have been slow on moving on buying the boat it's been out of the water for 8 months uncovered with a leaky deck. I fear once it's put back in everything will leak. although the longer I wait the worse it gets. So trying to get the current owner to absorb those cost is tough, they want nothing more to do with it. Winter is not helping either.