Marine Insurance

[berumenm]

I am new to cruising and have signed on with Markel Marine insurance as of April. Because we were new boat owners they required us to have a captain sign off on a very specific list of skills before allowing us to drive/sail the boat without a captain aboard.

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by seagasm

Can someone tell me who the underwriters are for Edward William/Northern Reef insurance?

NO.

➥ Edward William

➥ Services

See ➥ http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...use-26450.html

[callistov42]

I have always wondered about Lemma Insurance who underwrites the policies sold by Bluewater. They are based in Kharkov, Ukraine. Research says they are well rated and the policy was placed by Lloyds...just a Ukraine company? Thankfully I have never needed them to pay off!

[Rick Mark]

I took out marine insurance policy with dg marine (agent for Edward William Insurance), and subsequently lost the boat in an unforecast severe storm in Airlie Beach in January 2013.

Having all sorts of troubles negotiating settlement of the policy, especially the wreck removal clause.

Is anyone else experiencing similar problems/had similar problems with DG Marine/Edward William Insurance/Northernreef Insurance.

[colemj]

Good lord, just search the web for Edward William - I haven't heard anything good about him or Northernreef. Forum pages go on and on about them.

Mark

[hellosailor]

Rick, what Mark said.

You might want to retain legal counsel immediately.

[Reefmagnet]

Originally Posted by colemj

Good lord, just search the web for Edward William - I haven't heard anything good about him or Northernreef. Forum pages go on and on about them.

Mark

Considering the grave dig he probably already has.

Rick was most probably anchored or moored in Pioneer Bay. This is an area where it is currently near on impossible to get any legitimate mainstream insurance for your vessel, hence where operators the like of Edward William step in to fill the void.

The problem with Edward William / Northern Reef from what I gather is they pay out just enough claims to keep people in two minds about them. Occasionally you hear of someone that had no problems but most times it's stories of rejected claims or even cases where the insured needed to fix their boats at their own expense before they could have their claims reviewed! Apparently they have some pretty funky clauses in their PDS too, which gives them an easy out of having to cough up on a claim as well.

All I can say is good luck Rick. Keep batting away. One thing to keep in mind is that you will find a quite a few other people around the area are insured with Edward William for the reasons stated above. You might be able to use this information to your advantage in negotiations.

[TabbyCat]

Rick was most probably anchored or moored in Pioneer Bay. This is an area where it is currently near on impossible to get any legitimate mainstream insurance for your vessel, hence where operators the like of Edward William step in to fill the void.

Pioneer Bay, as in at the southern end of Australia? I don't see a problem with insuring a boat there, I could easily cover it a vessel with a legitimate policy from Markel Jackline. Or are you talking about some other Pioneer Bay? Anyway, so sorry to hear yet another fellow cruiser has fallen victim to one of the scams. Sadly, the only advice I have for Rick is not to throw too much $$ on lawyers trying to resolve this, as it is just wasting good money after bad. Heart wrenching, but it is best to try to move on.

[Reefmagnet]

Originally Posted by TabbyCat

Pioneer Bay, as in at the southern end of Australia? I don't see a problem with insuring a boat there, I could easily cover it a vessel with a legitimate policy from Markel Jackline. Or are you talking about some other Pioneer Bay? Anyway, so sorry to hear yet another fellow cruiser has fallen victim to one of the scams. Sadly, the only advice I have for Rick is not to throw too much $$ on lawyers trying to resolve this, as it is just wasting good money after bad. Heart wrenching, but it is best to try to move on.

Pioneer Bay off Airlie Beach / Cannonvale at about 21 deg south. It's totally unprotected from the north which means every time a decent blow comes from that direction boats get washed along the shore with pot luck whether it will be the beach or rocks. The incident that Rick was referring to resulted in something like 33 boats being blown ashore in the one event.

That's why insurance co's, as a general rule, won't touch boats left on moorings there.

[TabbyCat]

Ahh, that Pioneer Bay. Yes, that's in the storm box for Markel Jackline. So from Dec 1 to March 31, he would not have had coverage for Windstorms anyway, unless he had applied for and gotten approved for an exception.

[Reefmagnet]

Originally Posted by TabbyCat

Ahh, that Pioneer Bay. Yes, that's in the storm box for Markel Jackline. So from Dec 1 to March 31, he would not have had coverage for Windstorms anyway, unless he had applied for and gotten approved for an exception.

Exactly. Quite a few people have "regular" insurance up here but carry good ol' Eddy Williams insurance for the exclusions in the fingers crossed hope that they may come good if the worst happens at these times

[Rick Mark]

Thank you all for your comments, which do help explain a few strange things that have occurred through this affair. I'm in a bit of a stalemate situation at present. I've yet to receive a reasonable explanation for Dg Marine/Edward William Marine/ Northernreef Insurance decision to not honour my policy with them (been dragging on since 24th January with about 500 emails, solicitor's letters etc back and forth). I did manage to negotiate a "ex gratia" payment from them for $65,000 (approx 1/3 the agreed amount) for the vessel, which I accepted. That decision was probalby a mistake. I did so in the mistaken belief at the time that they would then honour their obligations in respect of the wreck removal clause in the policy, as per our discussions at the time. They have since then taken the decision, without warning, to cease all discussions on wreck removal and salvage. Tabbycat has said that legal action is not viable, but it appears to me that it should not be difficult to prove these entities have not honoured their obligations under the policy I purchased. At the risk of sounding naive, has anyone encountered difficulties pursuing legal action against these companies. Given their reputation it would seem that even a class action wouldn't be out of the question. Thanks again for your replies.

[s/v Moondancer]

First let me say how sorry I am for your troubles. Second there is no better source, on the Internet, for boat insurance information than TabbyCat. Even though she represents one brokerage she will still give you unbiased advice on all.

When I inherited a Williams policy from the previous owner I found that their register office was in Uruguay, their working office was in Spain but the payment office was in North Africa...Try getting jurisdiction in a legal dispute with that lot.

The E. Williams policy I had actually had an exclusion for anchoring 'on an open shore' because previosly then had denied a claim because the boat was lost when the anchor pulled on an open shore.

[nataniel]

Never heard of this insurance company, unfortunately For our business services we use our own insurance company, which offers to our customers: beneficial rates, velocity, high reliability level, etc.

[sctpc]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Indeed.
It appears that Edward William (agent) and Northernreef (re-insurer) may be a scam.

Yes I have come to that same conclusion, But I can not get insurance for my boat in Melbourne Australia at all as every other insurance (all insurance is scam also ) will Not insure my boat on a mooring, therefor Edward William won so I can still use a dock. Try and go to a marina without insurance.