International Micron 66

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

I’m sure having a .2 knot following current didn’t hurt, but I don’t see any of them in full race mode beating hull speed by 3-4 knots as DH claims to do on a regular basis on his Moody 54 displacement cruising yacht.

Nice try.

Ken, disagreement is perfectly fine. Being called a liar, I don't like, but it's a free country. But what I won't tolerate is misrepresentation of what I wrote, which you've now done several times.

To avoid misleading anyone coming late into this thread:

* 0.7 knots above theoretical hull speed, maybe one knot, above theoretical hull speed, achievable REGULARLY in good conditions and on different points of sail. As anyone knows who has either a light boat, or big balls and a spinnaker.

* two or three knots above theoretical hull speed - on my boat, only when surfing, so NOT regularly. Only once in 40+ years of sailing, for more than an hour at a time.

As to your idea that there is a vast conspiracy of liars claiming to violate what you think is something like the sound barrier, just because you've never exceeded it - well, what can I say. A closed mind is a closed mind. I guess even Dashew was falsifying the video I posted, eh?

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

All I want to learn about is Micron 66.

Me too and as a supplementary but related question what is the difference between Micron 66 and Micron 77?

Can't see 66 listed on the EU Internationals Paint website, perhaps it is too dangerous for use in the United States of Europe with all those nasty chemicals in it.

https://international-yachtpaint.com...ling/micron-77

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I sure wish there was a Forum function that “told me when the pissing match finishes.”

All I want to learn about is Micron 66.

Quite.

Let's take the hull speed discussion to a different thread. I started one here:

What is "Hull Speed" Anyway - Cruisers & Sailing Forums

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Ha, ha. You need to spend some time on lighter, faster boats

The previous poster answered it pretty well. Many displacement sailboats can surf downwind, with enough power. I did 30 miles in 2:45 one time - against a half knot of tide . In a F9 with a little bit of jib out. While listening to Mahler's 6th. I'll put up the video if I can find it.

My boat not only surfs downwind (like many lighter boats) but breaks hull speed somewhat on other points of sail. With a good wind (about 20 - 25 knots) I do 10 knots fairly regularly, as the several people on CF who have sailed with me can testify.

Originally Posted by Kenomac

You were obviously hallucinating... what you claim is impossible on a displacement boat. You own a Moody 45,000 lb displacement cruising boat which can't "surf" or plane. To claim it possible to average 10.9 knots against a .5 knot current (13mph) over 30 miles is simply ridiculous.

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Ken, disagreement is perfectly fine. Being called a liar, I don't like, but it's a free country. But what I won't tolerate is misrepresentation of what I wrote, which you've now done several times.

To avoid misleading anyone coming late into this thread:

* 0.7 knots above theoretical hull speed, maybe one knot, above theoretical hull speed, achievable REGULARLY in good conditions and on different points of sail. As anyone knows who has either a light boat, or big balls and a spinnaker.

* two or three knots above theoretical hull speed - on my boat, only when surfing, so NOT regularly. Only once in 40+ years of sailing, for more than an hour at a time.

As to your idea that there is a vast conspiracy of liars claiming to violate what you think is something like the sound barrier, just because you've never exceeded it - well, what can I say. A closed mind is a closed mind. I guess even Dashew was falsifying the video I posted, eh?

I stand corrected, you stated that you averaged 10.9 knots over a 30 mile distance a 1.5 knot speed over hull speed. I misread the post.

BUT I'm not calling anyone a "liar," just asking for some proof which nobody seems able to post in the form of a video. This name calling stuff which seems to happen with a level of frequency when disagreement takes place on this forum really needs to stop. You've called me a "none year old", doubted my math skills, poked fun at nearly everyone's boat including mine, but that's OK because you're a moderator. BTW: I'm not even bothered by it, it's just part of the discussion, but others seem rather thin-skinned when doubt is placed on their outlandish claims and comments. IMO

BTW: Were you able to locate your missing performance video?

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

. ..
BUT I'm not calling anyone a "liar," just asking for some proof which nobody seems able to post in the form of a video. This name calling stuff which seems to happen with a level of frequency when disagreement takes place on this forum really needs to stop. You've called me a "none year old", doubted my math skills, poked fun at nearly everyone's boat including mine, but that's OK because you're a moderator. BTW: I'm not even bothered by it, it's just part of the discussion, but others seem rather thin-skinned when doubt is placed on their outlandish comments. IMO

BTW: Were you able to locate your missing performance video?

Let's get a few things straight: Correcting a math mistake is just that -- no judgements were made about your math skills. Fun was not poked at your boat -- a boat I greatly admire (almost bought an Oyster myself). I'll share some videos with you privately when I'm home again -- after New Year's. But what they show is quite commonplace, described by now by several other posters.

If you want to argue with people who state that their displacement boats can sail faster than 1.34x the square root of their LWL, there's a new thread about it here: What is "Hull Speed" Anyway - Cruisers & Sailing Forums. So that Mike and others can get back to Micron 66.

[Suijin]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

I stand corrected, you stated that you averaged 10.9 knots over a 30 mile distance a 1.5 knot speed over hull speed. I misread the post.

BUT I'm not calling anyone a "liar," just asking for some proof which nobody seems able to post in the form of a video. This name calling stuff which seems to happen with a level of frequency when disagreement takes place on this forum really needs to stop. You've called me a "none year old", doubted my math skills, poked fun at nearly everyone's boat including mine, but that's OK because you're a moderator. BTW: I'm not even bothered by it, it's just part of the discussion, but others seem rather thin-skinned when doubt is placed on their outlandish claims and comments. IMO

BTW: Were you able to locate your missing performance video?

I'm hoping you can clarify your specific position about hull speed which may have gotten a little lost in all of the back and forth through the thread.

Is it your position that a displacement boat cannot ever exceed it's theoretical hull speed in flat static water (no current, no wind driven surface current, no waves), no matter the wind speed, point of sail, displacement, etc.?

Or is your position that theoretical hull speed can be exceeded but Dockhead's (and other's) claims of specific speeds they have experienced on their boats in excess of hull speed are not credible?

[geoleo]

"Everybody wants what they do not have" Sailboats are typically SLOOOOOWWWW so they want faster LOL

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Suijin

I'm hoping you can clarify your specific position about hull speed which may have gotten a little lost in all of the back and forth through the thread.

Is it your position that a displacement boat cannot ever exceed it's theoretical hull speed in flat static water (no current, no wind driven surface current, no waves), no matter the wind speed, point of sail, displacement, etc.?

Or is your position that theoretical hull speed can be exceeded but Dockhead's (and other's) claims of specific speeds they have experienced on their boats in excess of hull speed are not credible?

The discussion has moved to another location in cyberspace. Engage!
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ml#post2540920

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Me too and as a supplementary but related question what is the difference between Micron 66 and Micron 77?

Can't see 66 listed on the EU Internationals Paint website, perhaps it is too dangerous for use in the United States of Europe with all those nasty chemicals in it.

https://international-yachtpaint.com...ling/micron-77

Nice website Pete. Thanks!

Right off the top I can see Micron 77 is geared toward “professionals”, whatever that means. It’s also says it’s is good for salt and fresh water. Isn’t Micron 66 only for salt?

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Nice website Pete. Thanks!

Right off the top I can see Micron 77 is geared toward “professionals”, whatever that means. It’s also says it’s is good for salt and fresh water. Isn’t Micron 66 only for salt?

Yup, just for salt water..

[georgec]

Micron 66 is unique in that it does not ablate by the motion of the boat thru the water. It ablates by reacting with the salt ion. That’s why it is only for use in salt water. If the boat goes into fresh water for more than a couple of days the paint will fail by flaking off.

[ggray]

I may have missed someone saying this earlier, but as far as Micron 66 flaking off after being exposed to freshwater, Interlux finally told me it would not happen until the boat was hauled out. And that is precisely what happened to our boat.

We went way up the Pocomoke River where I learned that it was flushed by a major artesian aquifer. So the paint was exposed to fresh water for perhaps up to 24 hours. The paint was effective for the rest of the season and the next, but after it dried out on the hard, there was significant flaking.

So if you haul only for bottom painting, maybe not quite so bad, but there will be some extra work and you lose the paint.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by Simi 60

It'd want to be good.
$79/litre for the 66 vs $45/ litre for the Altex sea barrier 3000 we have had on for 18 mths.

https://marinetradesupplies.com.au/?...-micron-66-10l

https://marinetradesupplies.com.au/?...3000-10l-black

Once again, what makes it so good to justify its pricing?
What is the active ingredient?