HRO Sea Recovery Watermakers

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by ixtlan22

Might also check out- Cruise RO Watermakers...developed by cruisers for cruisers, powered by a Honda 2000e.
...

Have not used one of their units, but have bought supplies (membrane) from them. They are responsive and their prices are good.

HRO & Spectra are wildly expensive -- Cruise RO seems to be bucking that trend. Good for them!

[Matt Johnson]

Originally Posted by Dev0n60

We have a Seafari Escape 200 Modular. HRO Sea Recovery calls it a '200 SEM'. Check to see what kind of pump they supplied. If it is a 12VDC diaphragm style pump then I am afraid you will have problems. If this is the case and the unit is still 'newish' I would go back to the vendor and ask for something else (another type of pump: hydraulic CAT pump) to drive the system or some type of free extended warranty.... like 3-4 years. The problem with the CAT pumps for DC systems like ours, is they use twice the power. Hope this helps out.

Dang... I was hoping you weren't talking about the Clark pump in the escape model. Do you try rebuilding the pump? I heard it's just standard hydraulic seals.

[Celestialsailor]

Glad you posted this DevOn60. I haven't broken down yet and bought an H2O maker. But Sea Recovery will not get my business. I hope when people Google Sea Recovery, they find this thread. Maybe it was a privilege for the owners brother to talk to you but it is our privilege to post our findings. It will be interesting to see the effects on them.

[Tellie]

I'm a bit confused, normal for me, exactly which pump has gone bad? The SEM units use the energy recovery pump along with a low pressure feed pump. Plunger pumps were used on the SEC units. A part number would help. The HRO and Sea Recovery business thing is a bit crazy, same with VM and Parker Racor.
OK rant time again. I go through this all the time, buying a watermaker is not something you do without a lot of informatin first. The problem is getting the right information to fit your needs. I cringe everytime I hear, see, or read someone giving advice about buying a watermaker based on the cheapest price, what their well meaning dock buddy uses and recommends, marketing hype, salesmen, the small marine companies that deal in watermakers as a side line, or the quick advice they get on the Internet. (This forum of course being the exception to the rule. Very big<grin>) These things are not a cheap $100 hand held VHF. They are expensive for most avearge cruisers. Please, please, ask a lot of questions first. If you're making your watermaker decision based on a 15 minute conversation with anyone you haven't asked all the right questions nor have you been asked all the right quesions.

[Dev0n60]

Originally Posted by funjohnson

Dang... I was hoping you weren't talking about the Clark pump in the escape model. Do you try rebuilding the pump? I heard it's just standard hydraulic seals.

I'm not sure what the "Clark Pump" is. The Seafari Escape 200 SEM from Sea Recovery uses what they call and ETD (energy transfer device) and a High pressure feed pump. The pump I am writing of is the diaphragm style HP feedpump supplied with these systems. Without a reliable pump the ETD and the rest is useless. The Sea Recovery people have been careful to not allow the manufacturers of their system components sell directly to customers: Shurflo will not talk to us about the specs or parts for our failing HP diaphragm pump because of a written agreement they have with Sea Recovery. Hope this helps.

[Dev0n60]

Originally Posted by Tellie

I'm a bit confused, normal for me, exactly which pump has gone bad? The SEM units use the energy recovery pump along with a low pressure feed pump. Plunger pumps were used on the SEC units. A part number would help. The HRO and Sea Recovery business thing is a bit crazy, same with VM and Parker Racor.
OK rant time again. I go through this all the time, buying a watermaker is not something you do without a lot of informatin first. The problem is getting the right information to fit your needs. I cringe everytime I hear, see, or read someone giving advice about buying a watermaker based on the cheapest price, what their well meaning dock buddy uses and recommends, marketing hype, salesmen, the small marine companies that deal in watermakers as a side line, or the quick advice they get on the Internet. (This forum of course being the exception to the rule. Very big<grin>) These things are not a cheap $100 hand held VHF. They are expensive for most avearge cruisers. Please, please, ask a lot of questions first. If you're making your watermaker decision based on a 15 minute conversation with anyone you haven't asked all the right questions nor have you been asked all the right quesions.

Awesome post! Thank you. I agree that investigating before investing is big.... otherwise one risks giving their hard earned $ away.
The Sea Recovery agents we bought our machine from in SanDiego were/are personal friends who had a WaterMaker business at the time. They have sold Sea Recovery, Spectra, Village Marine and other systems. We bought the Sea Recovery system based on their recommendation. Unfortunately, they are no longer in the biz and when we bought the system they had not had a lot of experience themselves dealing with Sea Recovery in an 'after the sale' capacity... read: Support. Sea Recovery are really bad at this. If our friends were still selling these machines today they would no longer be selling/recommending Sea Recovery, I suspect.
Anyway... we thought we had made a good decision and got taken advantage of.
To respond to the 'confusion' part:
Sea Recovery calls their energy recovery thing an 'ETD'. Energy transfer device. I think that is what you meant?
The ETD is supplied by a diaphragm pump made by Shurflo. Shurlfo will not sell or offer advise on the pump because they have an agreement not to do so directly with customers. One must go through Sea Recovery. The Shurflo pump is a 110psi pump but I have not been able get other specs as Shurflo cannot give them. It is easy enough I suppose to find out by simply hooking it up and watching/measuring, etc....
This is all sort of beside the point: who wants to buy $11,000.00 worth of machinery only to find out later that they have to go through all this? The thing should have NO surprises. Period.
To find out after the fact that Sea Recovery knew about the inadequacies of the diaphragm pumps in this application but sold them with their systems anyway is just deceptive and dishonest. The Shurflo pumps have synthetic Nylon/Plastic components that will degrade and distort over time with usage. Chris Rollins from Sea Recovery said so himself as did their agent Mike Harris. If they knew this why didn't they tell people before the sale?? And 250 hours usage is just not that much time! A BIG omission I suspect!
Anyway... water under the keel..... The forum has been really great because I think we have found a solution based on recommendations posted above by other members: getting a non-Sea Recovery supplied pump that will work with the Sea Recovery PCB/controller. If it works out I will post it.

[noelex 77]

Originally Posted by Dev0n60

I'm not sure what the "Clark Pump" is. The Seafari Escape 200 SEM from Sea Recovery uses what they call and ETD (energy transfer device) and a High pressure feed pump. The pump I am writing of is the diaphragm style HP feedpump supplied with these systems. Without a reliable pump the ETD and the rest is useless. The Sea Recovery people have been careful to not allow the manufacturers of their system components sell directly to customers: Shurflo will not talk to us about the specs or parts for our failing HP diaphragm pump because of a written agreement they have with Sea Recovery. Hope this helps.

My understanding of how the low energy, or energy recovery watermakers like spectra work is that their is a feed pump that generates prsessures of around 80psi, this feeds to the Clarke pump which raises the pressure to about 800-900 psi.

It sounds like it is feed pump that is defective. These are relatively simple pumps that are just modified water pumps its hard to imagine it costing anything like the amount you were charged.

[noelex 77]

A replacment Spectra feed pump for my system is about $290 for the complete pump (or $160 for just the pump head)
I don't know how HRO justify $2150

[Dev0n60]

Originally Posted by noelex 77

My understanding of how the low energy, or energy recovery watermakers like spectra work is that their is a feed pump that generates prsessures of around 80psi, this feeds to the Clarke pump which raises the pressure to about 800-900 psi.

It sounds like it is feed pump that is defective. These are relatively simple pumps that are just modified water pumps its hard to imagine it costing anything like the amount you were charged.

Regarding the pump options: more of the deception part I mentioned previously from Sea Recovery. See my response to 'Tellie' posted above.
Thanks to you and some others who have posted we are looking into a pump (a NON Sea Recovery feed-pump) that should interface with the Sea Recovery PCB/controller. It is inexpensive and we can buy parts for it too (valve and diaphragm kits): these are very cheap relatively speaking.
I will poste later with the results.
Thanks for taking the time to write.

[Dev0n60]

Originally Posted by noelex 77

A replacment Spectra feed pump for my system is about $290 for the complete pump (or $160 for just the pump head)
I don't know how HRO justify $2150

I know how they justify it: its called rationalizing abhorrent behavior..... they sleep just fine. I asked Chris Rollins almost the this very question regarding justification. He wrote to me: "we are in business to make money".......

Thank you for sharing the info. Sea Recovery will not sell just the pump head for the Shurflo pump. Shurflo will not sell it direct. Sea Recovery will sell me a new (and doomed) Shurflo pump for $350.00 that will last another 250 hours....

[noelex 77]

Originally Posted by Dev0n60

Regarding the pump options: more of the deception part I mentioned previously from Sea Recovery. See my response to 'Tellie' posted above.
Thanks to you and some others who have posted we are looking into a pump (a NON Sea Recovery feed-pump) that should interface with the Sea Recovery PCB/controller. It is inexpensive and we can buy parts for it too (valve and diaphragm kits): these are very cheap relatively speaking.
I will poste later with the results.
Thanks for taking the time to write.

Do you need the electronics. Spectra also make automated systems, but for small boats like mine when you are living aboard I don't see the need.
The only electrical supply, or electronics, to my Spectra system is 12v to the feed pump, which simply starts the pump like any motor.

It would be easy any cheap to replace the automated valves etc in your system with manual ones.

The system is not complicated.
Switch the pump on after the first 2L ( which are saltier) I switch a valve to divert product water into the tank. When the water tank is full I switch 2 valves to flush the system with fresh water for 3mins.

The high pressure Clarke pump requires no electronics or even electricity supply it controls it's own pressure.

[Matt Johnson]

Originally Posted by Dev0n60

I know how they justify it: its called rationalizing abhorrent behavior..... they sleep just fine. I asked Chris Rollins almost the this very question regarding justification. He wrote to me: "we are in business to make money".......

Thank you for sharing the info. Sea Recovery will not sell just the pump head for the Shurflo pump. Shurflo will not sell it direct. Sea Recovery will sell me a new (and doomed) Shurflo pump for $350.00 that will last another 250 hours....

So, the pump they charged you $2100 for is just the feed pump? If so, they total ripped you off! You can replace it with a lot of other options.

The Clark pump is the ETD. It's the same as Specta uses, but I have heard it can fail. This pump I could see being $2100, but I think you can replace the seals for a lot less.