Genuine Dyneema or fake, how can you tell the difference

[dfelsent]

I happened to wander into the lanex storefront about 6 years ago. The owner at the time, Jan Trousilek, was a wonderful story teller. We bought new jib sheets from him and never regretted it. The distributor ship has since changed hands, but I suspect is still a good place.

[dlj]

My analytical mind comes out and makes me wonder if a very simple, powerful and ancient analytical technique, PLM (Polarized Light Microscopy), could distinguish the differences in these different suppliers. This technique, while little known, is still very much used in many labs. US Customs uses it in their labs analyzing imported products, especially fabrics to makes sure that the labels are correct. They can look at the fibers in the fabrics and know exactly what they are made from. Pretty amazing.

dj

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by pbmaise

The keywords on Aliexpress are UHMWPE rope

https://www.aliexpress.us/w/wholesal...7d3e7a23OWKJQX

Many of the options have no protection at all. Some have a polyester jacket which sounds like a good idea.

Notice that the weaving on a lot of them looks very loose.

The weaving on this one...looks good but it comes in 100 meter long spools.
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256805989492536.html

Thank you.
Looking for a proven supplier where you already got good stuff, so i get good quality with protection which is needed as halyard.
There is so much crap out there and trusting fotos on aliexpress and what you get is often different too.

Don't mind getting 12mm in 100m spools =200m if price and quality fits. Having 50m spare is always good.

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I'm using some "fake" dyneema I was turned on to by SeaworthyLass. It is Timm Acera Amundsen, and it is made by a major manufacturer of cordage for professional use (shipping and fishing).


I have not tested it, but coming from such a reputable source I suppose it must meet the specs, which are identical to dyneema.


The stuff is excellent in every way, and very pleasant to work with due to the good coatings -- indistinguishable from the better grades of the real stuff and much better than the uncoated or poorly coated types. And it only costs about 1/3 what "real" dyneema does.

Can you use acera amudsen as halyards?
They have no cover so how well are they doing with the stoppers?

[fxykty]

Of course you can, though uncovered they are prone to chafe at the masthead and need additional treatment to work with clutches.

For chafe protection, add a Dyneema cover for the portion that exits the mast at the top and goes through whatever fairleads and blocks you’ve got before attaching to a sail.

For hard clutches, you will need to bulk up the bare Dyneema (generically it is UHMWPE - ultra high molecular weight polyethylene) with an inserted line that is 50% of the Dyneema line diameter. Do this for far enough so that you have a good overlap of the clutch. You will also want a chafe/grip cover on the clutch part of the line, overlapping further than the insert, and sewn to keep it in place.

Alternatively, change to soft clutches - those work with bare Dyneema.

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by fxykty

Of course you can, though uncovered they are prone to chafe at the masthead and need additional treatment to work with clutches.

For chafe protection, add a Dyneema cover for the portion that exits the mast at the top and goes through whatever fairleads and blocks you’ve got before attaching to a sail.

For hard clutches, you will need to bulk up the bare Dyneema (generically it is UHMWPE - ultra high molecular weight polyethylene) with an inserted line that is 50% of the Dyneema line diameter. Do this for far enough so that you have a good overlap of the clutch. You will also want a chafe/grip cover on the clutch part of the line, overlapping further than the insert, and sewn to keep it in place.

Alternatively, change to soft clutches - those work with bare Dyneema.

In short not useable or the mods cost me more then i would go to a fake covered one.
Main hailyard its 2:1 and because of reefs and block nearly all of the rope needs a cover...

[dlj]

Thinking further along the lines of my post #17 - if anyone here has interest, and has a short piece of line they can send me, I have the PLM equipment at home and would be interested in seeing if in fact there are measurable differences in these various manufacturers products. Anyone interested, send me a PM and we can discuss.

dj

[CaptainRivet]

Anyone used this D2 racing rope, 10mm 3$ and 12mm 3,8$
https://www.knotandrope.com/collecti...40743976861796
They even claim it’s dyneema 78

[CaptainRivet]

And Samson is now producing the Amsteel 2 plus which has a double braided cover with coating. Can you use that as halyards?

https://www.go2marine.com/amsteel-ii-plus-coated

Should be possible as cover with protects and works in clutches and stopper, here the 3/8 means 10mm for 2,08$

[Benz]

Originally Posted by CaptainRivet

Anyone used this D2 racing rope, 10mm 3$ and 12mm 3,8$
https://www.knotandrope.com/collecti...40743976861796
They even claim it’s dyneema 78

I use it all the time: that's a Marlow product, and the SK78 core is standard in that rope.

[Benz]

Originally Posted by CaptainRivet

And Samson is now producing the Amsteel 2 plus which has a double braided cover with coating. Can you use that as halyards?

https://www.go2marine.com/amsteel-ii-plus-coated

Should be possible as cover with protects and works in clutches and stopper, here the 3/8 means 10mm for 2,08$

This can be used as halyards.

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by Benz

This can be used as halyards.

What do you expect is better D2 racing or amsteel plus as halyards?

[Benz]

Originally Posted by CaptainRivet

What do you expect is better D2 racing or amsteel plus as halyards?

Marlow makes a lot more high-end offerings than Samson, and is far more common on both racers and cruisers out here. It's like Samson dropped out of the cruising game for a while, and not a lot of places carried it. Still, I'd be perfectly comfortable with either. I've never seen a bad Samson product. Use the one you can get the best price on, and know that you're buying quality either way.

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by Benz

Marlow makes a lot more high-end offerings than Samson, and is far more common on both racers and cruisers out here. It's like Samson dropped out of the cruising game for a while, and not a lot of places carried it. Still, I'd be perfectly comfortable with either. I've never seen a bad Samson product. Use the one you can get the best price on, and know that you're buying quality either way.

Thanks Ben, appreciate it. Indeed the amsteel plus is very hard to find, especially if you don‘t wanna buy a whole spool.
So it will be most likely be D2 racing, their rating is also surprisingly high and above the amsteel 2 plus.
Do you know a different supplier then knotandrope for the D2 racing? Maybe for europe?

[Benz]

Originally Posted by CaptainRivet

Thanks Ben, appreciate it. Indeed the amsteel plus is very hard to find, especially if you don‘t wanna buy a whole spool.
So it will be most likely be D2 racing, their rating is also surprisingly high and above the amsteel 2 plus.
Do you know a different supplier then knotandrope for the D2 racing? Maybe for europe?

Here on the US east coast, you can't throw a brick without hitting two or three Marlow dealers; I'm one myself, though I don't carry a lot of inventory beyond loop-making materials.
There should be lots of them in Europe, since it's made in England. They'll have a dealer finder on their website that will have the closest one to you.