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Old 25-04-2020, 02:30   #1
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Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

It’s getting close to Winter in New Zealand and I’m thinking of sailing in rainy weather and getting a new jacket. My old goretex jacket that had space shuttle technology and the latest fabric bells and whistles gets saturated fast and then takes forever-ever to dry.
Lots of new choices that offer breathable blah blah...
But I can’t see any of them lasting more than 2 or 3 seasons before becoming useless.
I recall having oilskin and pvc jackets as a kid that kept me 100% dry...
Why wouldn’t returning to woollen under-layer and a good pvc or oilskin jacket be a sensible option?
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Old 25-04-2020, 03:12   #2
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

We used Mustang Exposure suits, kept nice and toasty. Wore pair of shorts and T shirt underneath. Stood out in howling wind horizontal rain and hail, if working the winches you develop a sweat so easy to undo a zip to let in breath. https://www.defender.com/product.jsp...098&id=4419203
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Old 25-04-2020, 03:41   #3
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

I use the thickest black PVC jacket I can find, and cut the hood down into a high collar. Instead of the hood I use a Grunden's sou'wester. That way my vision is not 50% hood insides. For bibs, I don't use PVC--I prefer whatever decent brand (musto, etc) I can find at the secondhand shop, also black or gray. It's more flexible in places where I bend, and I can sleep in it. For boots I use Muck. Meant for cold-weather dirt-grubbing, but excellent for use at sea.
If you need it all to match, I recommend kitting out with Grunden's.
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Old 25-04-2020, 03:57   #4
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

Yep, PVC certainly works. There are several companies that make stuff that will last, Grundens being one. This is what ALL the commercial fishermen use in my area. They wear the bibs all day long every day, and the jackets when required.

My personal experience is this stuff is comfortable with a good polypropylene or wool underlayer. Wearing cotton under starts to feel like a wet rag.

The PVC will definitely shed the rain and spray all day long.
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Old 25-04-2020, 04:18   #5
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

I think you are onto something. This is the way to go. This is what I do. I have all the most high tech jackets and stuff, but they are nothing. They’re not worth it. The best thing you can possibly do is use layers. That way you can adjust your clothing for the weather.

A PVC outer layer for rain is perfect.
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Old 25-04-2020, 04:19   #6
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

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Originally Posted by Sparx View Post
Yep, PVC certainly works. There are several companies that make stuff that will last, Grundens being one. This is what ALL the commercial fishermen use in my area. They wear the bibs all day long every day, and the jackets when required.

My personal experience is this stuff is comfortable with a good polypropylene or wool underlayer. Wearing cotton under starts to feel like a wet rag.

The PVC will definitely shed the rain and spray all day long.
My grundens failed miserably after 2 years. The company Did Not stand by their product. I highly do not reccomend grundens
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Old 25-04-2020, 04:24   #7
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

www.kaiwakaclothing.co.nz
Plenty of kiwi fishermen wear this. Not cheap but good gear, well made and they repair it for free.
When I get my next pair of leggings I’ll buy this. The jacket is good, if a bit bulky.
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Old 25-04-2020, 04:26   #8
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

Thanks people. I’m surfing the web looking for the solution but haven’t found it yet.
One thing about the commercial pvc jackets is they don’t seem to have the high front collars for keeping the face out of the weather. Must be one somewhere though...
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Old 25-04-2020, 09:31   #9
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

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Originally Posted by nzmal View Post
It’s getting close to Winter in New Zealand and I’m thinking of sailing in rainy weather and getting a new jacket. My old goretex jacket that had space shuttle technology and the latest fabric bells and whistles gets saturated fast and then takes forever-ever to dry.
Lots of new choices that offer breathable blah blah...
But I can’t see any of them lasting more than 2 or 3 seasons before becoming useless.
I recall having oilskin and pvc jackets as a kid that kept me 100% dry...
Why wouldn’t returning to woollen under-layer and a good pvc or oilskin jacket be a sensible option?
If your GoreTex(tm) jacket is getting saturated and taking an age to dry then it is either dirty or the water repellent coating has worn off or both. Before you ditch it try washing it on the delicates cycle in a machine with soap flakes but NOT A DETERGENT. Lux flakes, Dreft or any good handwash soap. Then rewash it with a reproofing agent such as Nikwax TX Direct or Grangers equivalent. Allow to dry as per the garment care label and you should find the rain beads up and runs off, the fabric stays dry and you stay comfortable as the breathability returns.

I have a 25 year old GoreTex jacket that still performs as well as the day I bought it. Been washed a number of times and reproofed almost as many.

This also applies to all the other waterproof/breathable fabrics out there. Once the water repellent coating gets dirty rain no longer beads up so it soaks into the fabric, which in turn reduces the effective breathability and can make you think the jacket is leaking as the moisture from you can't escape and you feel damp.

Go on give it a wash and see what happens. If it doesn't improve then yes think about a replacement but remember PVC is 100% waterproof both ways, from outside in and inside out. You will sweat inside it and get as wet from that as you might from the rain, even with all the technical fabric layers or woollies you like underneath. I'm not saying don't buy PVC for emergency "oilies" but seriously consider your comfort over a longer period of time. Also whatever you buy never ever wear cotton underneath it. Cotton absorbs moisture and will feel damp, takes an age to dry and will chill you.

And yes I worked in an outdoor sports shop and did the full GoreTex Technical Sales training and the Nikwax Fabric Treatments training.
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Old 25-04-2020, 09:32   #10
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

Sweat is your answer, there is no were for the warm air mist to get out and therefore soaks back onto the skin , we all should know that water transfer s hear much faster that air so a wet skin will remove heat from the body very quickly , hence why we sweat
Man made materials are better to wick away the moisture, wool and cotton are a big no no for this .
Depends how you sail if you ain't going to sweat and do much work it might work for you , if you are working to create sweat you will get cold
The reason for your tech fabric wetting out is because it might be dirty or the replant has worn off, give it a technical wash and re proof it you will find it works wonders
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Old 25-04-2020, 09:53   #11
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

A sheet of plastic wrap is 100% watertight and inexpensive. It is, unfortunately, also 100% uncomfortable.


A proper gtex parka lasts 10 years easily, more if you use just for sailing. Sure, price is $$$.


A 3-ply laminated jacket dries in no time. Get polyester shell, not nylon, if quick drying is a priority. Nylon dries longer, but Nylon is more pliable and has less bulk too.



My take, get one top shelf sports jacket every 10-15 years, skip anything less able.


My ex Mammut one was about USD 500 around 2000. Lasted about 15 years. USD 30 per year to keep me dry and comfy on countless snowy and rainy days. Good deal.



My experience is mixed: climbing and sailing. Last 17 years mostly sailing though.


If you only sail now and then, sure get a sheet of plastic instead.


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Old 25-04-2020, 10:10   #12
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

Interesting thread. I was once out in rain on passage for 20 hours with almost new goretex jacket and bibs. Stayed dry for about 12 hours. I was really wishing for an impermeable PVC or similar rainsuit after the 15th hour when hypothermia began to set in. Luckily, the weather improved not long after and I had several cups of hot coffee. Also, it was in the tropics. Next trip I will have the impermeable layer, if only to go over the goretex. The bibs did okay, I have to say.
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Old 25-04-2020, 10:19   #13
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

It's ok with me.
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Old 25-04-2020, 10:28   #14
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

Think about how you hang them up. Most jackets begin to leak in the shoulders due to hanger wear. Kinda obvious. Either hang them by the loop or fold them over the hanger, like bibs. Or pad the hanger.
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Old 25-04-2020, 10:31   #15
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Re: Why wouldn’t I just buy a 100% waterproof pvc raincoat?

A layered approach is always better. We had a 29 footer and no dodger, Northern CA coast, going north, lots of green water over the bow, constant bullets of cold spray. Never liked the heavy outer gear that contained liners and would not dry, since the outer layer was not truly waterproof. Some kind of fabric, not plastic.



Got smarter, then got a set of Helly-Hanson bulletproof plastic gear. Single layer, no liner, but just bone dry always, underneath. You get the same kind of gear probably under new names, from Fisheries Supply here in the Northwest. Underneath your single layer waterproof shell, you control how much insulation you need for any particular temperature, by wearing your chosen amount of polypro underwear, wool or poly sweaters, etc.



And when the wind dies a bit and the spray and rain clear up, you shed that one simple layer and you still have the warmth of your insulating layers w/o having to find a lighter more comfortable jacket to replace that wet multiple layer one.



BTW Gortex is not as good in a marine rain/spray environment. It is better for mountaineers.



Look what the commercial fishermen wear. It is not the high end yachting gear with the multiple liners, zippers and pockets.
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