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Old 18-07-2018, 05:12   #16
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

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Originally Posted by ArmySailor View Post
I'd hate to waste a day and $$ rigging an ad-hoc solution for something not necessary, if possible. -Gene
What? how long will it take to drive down to West Marine, pick up a harness and some jack lines for about $100.

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Old 18-07-2018, 05:24   #17
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

Studies indicate the only MOB system with 100% success is NOT GOING OVERBOARD,
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Old 18-07-2018, 05:42   #18
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

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Studies indicate the only MOB system with 100% success is NOT GOING OVERBOARD,
[Pendantic mode on] Surely a MOB system would have a 100% failure if it resulted in not going overboard.

Bit like calling IRPCS "collision regulations"
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Old 18-07-2018, 05:47   #19
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

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Okay, I'm going to go against the grain here. The Chesapeake is a fairly busy waterway, and this time of year the water is relatively warm. If you make sure to always wear a PFD when you are sailing, or out of the cockpit, and do not do any sailing at night, then I think the risk is low enough that you can get by without being tethered.


I would be certain to have a good whistle on the PFD (not the cheesy ones that usually come with them), and would seriously consider also keeping a handheld VHF (waterproof, of course) or a PLB attached to it.


Good luck, and have fun, whatever you decide to do.
It depends on how far down he comes.

When I crossed from Kiptopeke the other day, I saw maybe 3 sailboats at a distance of at least 7 miles away and a few guys fishing and not a lot else. This on a Sunday

I sailed west to center up (get on the ending longitude and to catch the tide) which puts me pretty much in the middle with 10 or so miles from land all around. It's easy to miss a swimmer.

North of where I was it gets to almost 30 miles wide up near Reedville-Tangier-Onancock with most of the traffic to the West which means if the wind is prevailing SW and he wants to sail he could end up on the far Eastern side on his starboard tack

Also, If you get near the bridge (CBBT) check the tide. I had to motor away from it on Saturday the tide was so strong going out. Wind was maybe 8 knots ....carrying me downwind

http://www.charts.noaa.gov/OnLineViewer/12280.shtml
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Old 18-07-2018, 05:49   #20
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

If you're alone, tether. At night on coastal, our rule is dual tethers. The cost is trivial. We have the personal AIS beacons and whatnot but even though most our longer trips are 4-up with a dedicated, quite strong and relatively experienced crew, we would battle to get a 105kg crewman man back onboard in a seaway. The best MOB strategy is no MOB. Never, ever. That's our baseline.
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Old 18-07-2018, 06:01   #21
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

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Originally Posted by denverd0n View Post
Okay, I'm going to go against the grain here. The Chesapeake is a fairly busy waterway, and this time of year the water is relatively warm. If you make sure to always wear a PFD when you are sailing, or out of the cockpit, and do not do any sailing at night, then I think the risk is low enough that you can get by without being tethered.

All depends on where you are on the Bay. Last week I sailed from Norfolk to Annapolis on a weekday. Bottom half of the Bay was essentially deserted and it’s pretty wide til you get to the Patuxent.

A PLB strapped to a PFD pretty well ensures your survival.

The more you single-hand the greater your developed awareness for suitable caution will be. For example if your motoring and need to go forward for something quick, shift into neutral.

Evans brings up a good point about the dangers of tethers. When in rougher weather I rig my jack lines in case needed but may clip in only on hard points at the mast or bow with my 3’ lead.

Safety largely comes down to awareness and being deliberate when moving around the boat. Don’t ever just “run to the bow” without focusing on the trip forward.

A few years ago I was leaving a harbor in winter under power. Morning, no wind, dead calm. I was in a long channel out with the AP on, at the time an Alpha with manual engagement. I went forward to clean up dock lines and fenders. The AP pin disengaged, the boat veered slowly out of the channel and bumped over a bar. I was *almost* thrown over the side into 38 degree water a mile from shore and the boat would have kept going. Ergo the shift into neutral advice. Experience keeps learning us!
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Old 18-07-2018, 06:18   #22
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

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[Pendantic mode on] Surely a MOB system would have a 100% failure if it resulted in not going overboard.

Bit like calling IRPCS "collision regulations"
well,to be precise
is Pedantic not Pendantic
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Old 18-07-2018, 06:20   #23
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

"First off, I know the answer to the question is YES, in an ideal world all sailors everywhere in every situation should be tethered to the boat - even during evening cocktails in the cockpit - amen."


Others would say "PFDs, always."


I believe, in my sole, that both are lazy, false positions. There are times when a tether works and a PFD is useless (cold water and solo), there are times where a tether is useless and a PFD is better (boat that can capsize), and there are times when neither helps (boat capsized with you in the cabin) or are needed (this depends on the sailing, the boat, and the people).


They should be available functional, and donned before needed. Thus, jacklines should be permanently installed (IMO) and PFDs should be in the top of a locker, available in no more than a few seconds. When solo, I generally wear the harness, place the tethers on the lines, but only clip when it feel necessary.
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Old 18-07-2018, 06:29   #24
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

Slightly off topic but if you get down to near Cape Charles/Kiptopeke keep an eye on those tankers. Sunday there were 19 of them anchored out there

A month or so ago I was North of them coming down and just assumed in my head that they were all anchored and would stay that way.

I was wrong.

One came right out of the middle of the group headed North and I had to tack, then another was coming down from the North on the Eastern side.

On Sunday I dealt with 4 ships in both channels..............the ship coming down and going out the Northern Channel (Chesapeake Channel) was flat out moving .....big bow wave. This after I sailed just ahead (more SE) of the 6 South Eastern most ships in the main group

http://goldenwestway.com/Live-Marine-Traffic.php
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Old 18-07-2018, 07:11   #25
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

If going overboard implies a game over scenario then you are tethered. Full stop. Or it is your game over. Full stop.

If others depend on you (e.g. your crew) then you are also tethered. Or do you want more lives lost than just yours?

Look at people working on high scaffoldings - how many of them ever unclip?

I think a smart solo sailor is clipped in full time - already before they leave the cabin.

I think a smart skipper and his crew are clipped in any time their going overboard could create more serious trouble to the boat and her crew.

If you have a terminal cancer and you sail solo then you may opt out and sail without a tether.

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Old 18-07-2018, 08:37   #26
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

Probably get some bad comments on this..but:
in two circumnavigations, and many other ocean crossings I do not use a tether. I take a turn around the deck at least 3 or 4 times every 24 hours, and I prefer all my halyards etc at the base of the mast.
I find tethers restricting and confining. I always keep one hand for the ship and one hand for me.

But I become very familiar with my deck and rigging.

Also I do not swim.
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Old 18-07-2018, 09:31   #27
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

I never wear a PFD inflatable or otherwise unless it is looking BAD. I rarely clip in unless it is again looking BAD.

Also if it is looking really BAD I keep my ass off the foredeck and generally have set the boat up ahead of time for the anticipated weather. (Side note, I generally throw at least one or two reefs in when the sun goes down so I don’t have to do it at 3am)

For one thing in good conditions, when running up and down on a jack line, the worry is tripping or snagging which could lead to serious injury. I’ve done it which was one of the reasons I stopped doing it.

If you do an informal survey of fellow Chesapeake sailors I think you’ll find the same behavior :-)

That being said a few months ago I was cruising into Georgetown and dropped the hook just off of Hamburger Beach. It was HOT with a very light breeze.

A few hours later couple dropped anchor next door. Both were kitted up with inflatable pfds and clipped in.

They both looked beyond miserable.

Disclaimer-if you are concerned at all wear everything and do not listen to irresponsible idiots like me! :-)
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Old 18-07-2018, 09:55   #28
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

Quote:
Originally Posted by denverd0n View Post
Okay, I'm going to go against the grain here. The Chesapeake is a fairly busy waterway, and this time of year the water is relatively warm. If you make sure to always wear a PFD when you are sailing, or out of the cockpit, and do not do any sailing at night, then I think the risk is low enough that you can get by without being tethered.


I would be certain to have a good whistle on the PFD (not the cheesy ones that usually come with them), and would seriously consider also keeping a handheld VHF (waterproof, of course) or a PLB attached to it.


Good luck, and have fun, whatever you decide to do.

Not during the week. I'm quite certain you could be several days, even longer if it rains.


---


If snagging or tripping is a problem, practice more and redesign the system until it is not. Some of my early attempts were troublesome. Now I set up systems that are not and know how to use them without snags. A jacklines system should not be an add-on, as most are--it should be an important part of the deck layout. And it must be used in fair weather in training so that it functions in foul weather without distraction or much thought. Clipping and moving should be habitual.


That said, learning to move well on a rowdy boat without aids is also a very valuable skill. Hiding in the cockpit does not fine tune it.



Consider that a climber or construction worker is continuously tethered. Like working with gloves on, it is a skill.
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Old 18-07-2018, 10:01   #29
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

When I sail alone I always have my harness even when it’s just a short trip. I don’t ever want to see my boat sailing away, as I’m treading water. When you use a harness frequently it’s not a bother and you get use to moving on deck with it.
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Old 18-07-2018, 11:00   #30
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Re: To tether or not, that is the question

Yes, tether. AND - use one of the newer "Y" tethers, so you clip on one side before unclipping the other - so you are never not connected (especially if no jackline). These tethers also have use indicators to tell you if they have been stressed. These tethers are now required for construction workers at heights in may jurisdictions, and the reasons are the same as apply to sailors. They also have "double action" release on the snap clips, so they will not come unclipped if twisted on a cleat etc. (as happened earlier this year to a sailor who went overboard and was lost). Also - remember that ultra-violet rays ( bright sunlight) will degrade the strength of the tether over time. A well known Asian 'singlehanded sailor was lost off his tri in the pacific - when inspecting his boat when recovered, they found the end of the tether still clipped to the pontoons jack line, but ripped off due to weakness from UV degradation.
But in the end, it is your call.
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