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Old 22-07-2017, 14:25   #76
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

"Below 40 degrees south there is no law.
Below 50 degrees south there is no god.
Below 60 degrees south there is no hope."

In my opinion, the Polar regions are some of the most fascinating places on earth, which I have visited several times for photography, science and military. Alas none by sail.

I would love to one day cruise them in my own boat, including rounding the caps. Probably not likely anytime soon given our current boat is not exactly suited for those conditions. (Lagoon 450).


incidentally, I fly out tomorrow for Svalbard and a ship north to the icepack for two weeks of Polar Photography. Several questions on this thread for what to wear. Here's what I use for that and similar trips.

Skin: Smartwool (Merino) underwear, Socks and Thermals. I swear by this stuff.
Fleece: Coreloft or similar by Arc'tyrex. Softshell by Marmot.
Mid: Coreloft Jacket and Pants if really cold. Arctyrex Kapa Jacket.
Shell: Expedition its Arctyrex Shell, On the water, Musto HPX or MPX.

Gloves: One of the following, depending on conditions.
- Narona. Windstop, water resistant wool and leather. Good grip on camera.
- Sealskins. Waterproof, but I find get a bit cold.

- But for really cold, nothing I've found beats HEAT 3 Gloves, by the Heat company. 3 layered system. Just excellent. HEAT3 Layer SYSTEM - Gloves - The Heat Company Onlineshop

NOTE: I'm looking at gloves where I can still handle an SLR or Medium Format camera. So tactile is critical.

Boots: Either.
- Muckboots Arctic. (in and out of Zodiacs, on deck, landings etc).
- Baffin boots for the really cold. - These are amazing.

Head:
- Smartwool neck warmer. This is prob one of the most critical pieces IMO. It blocks all air movement from the 'core' out the neck. For the very cold, replaced with a full balaclava which is windstop as well.

- Various headbands or beanie caps. When getting cold (below -10) hoods of mid layer and shell, plus Snow goggles to seal it all in.

In late 2018 I've got a shoot at an emperor penguin colony. That may require some gear modifications !


Regards

Mark.
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Old 22-07-2017, 16:40   #77
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

Yep.

All good takes on my drift. Indeed nothing ever seems as simple as it does as soon as we take a closer look at anything.

Back to the OP's intent though: my vote for gtx sea boots. I have used both the classic rubbery stuff and gtx/leather ones and the gtx ones simply beat anything else by such a huge margin.

I love rough seas / cold / snow as much as I hate being wet / cold and in result miserable.

Possibly also maybe some form of automated food heater makes sense, esp. when going solo. My homebrew method is to skip cooking and start baking (gas oven) as soon as it gets very rough. Maybe there are some electric devices that can make hot coffee in any conditions. Could be an asset.

Cheers,
b.
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Old 22-07-2017, 17:21   #78
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

You do not want to suffer severe frostbite. My fingers run a bit cold according to my Flir infrared. The right big toe gave up on regrowing the tip that kept sloughing off. No big deal. Now it almost aches at times.

Having purple/black fingers for a week was a trip in high school. Didn't have to do school work because I couldn't use my fingers. Hard to argue when they see skin sloughing off of purple/black fingers.

Hypothermia is the real deal. Easy to dress warmly. Not so easy to stay dry and have extra clothes that are dry.
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Old 22-07-2017, 17:59   #79
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

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You do not want to suffer severe frostbite. My fingers run a bit cold according to my Flir infrared. The right big toe gave up on regrowing the tip that kept sloughing off. No big deal. Now it almost aches at times.

Having purple/black fingers for a week was a trip in high school. Didn't have to do school work because I couldn't use my fingers. Hard to argue when they see skin sloughing off of purple/black fingers.

Hypothermia is the real deal. Easy to dress warmly. Not so easy to stay dry and have extra clothes that are dry.
I think I may have raynauds ( I'm going to see my doc about it this week ) as my fingers now start to 'burn up' after only a few minutes out in a dry 0*C....its a fair bit worse when they are also wet.... so I can see a pair of these Gloves - The Heat Company Onlineshop - The Heat Company Onlineshop in my not too distant future....
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Old 22-07-2017, 20:11   #80
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

I will second the artic muckboots. Used them last year in antarctica, Worked very well.

The wet damp cold at sea is far different from the dry cold ashore in Antarctica or the Arctic.
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Old 23-07-2017, 00:50   #81
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

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I will second the artic muckboots. Used them last year in antarctica, Worked very well.

The wet damp cold at sea is far different from the dry cold ashore in Antarctica or the Arctic.
Hola Ben,
where did you buy your muckboots??

This is turning out to be a very expensive weekend for me

This is the first year that the cold has really been bothering me.... part of the ageing process I guess....
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Old 23-07-2017, 01:25   #82
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

Ha, Antdiv WCO issue, unfortunately had to give them back... not sure I could afford to import them into australia myself. Surely someone can get you some of the dunlop thermo+ boots from the falklands? They are at least as good as the muck boots warmth wise, and probably better. But are a bit bulkier. What have you been using?
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Old 23-07-2017, 01:36   #83
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

I've been using white BATA boots with zero insulation all same you see the blokes around the fishmarkets and stuff wearing... about $10 from the COVEPA farmers' Co-ops in Montt ..... they have a good chunky tread for working with shore lines..

A quick look suggests about UKP70 for the Dunlop... UKP120 for the muckboot..... hmmmm

Summer is coming and we are heading to the Falklands in October so I may leave my money in my pocket and have a looksee when back in Stanley...

Thanks for the lead.
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Old 23-07-2017, 03:43   #84
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

^^Ping, geez mate, you're a tough old bugger, those boots have worse than zero insulation.. The Burke neoprene boots might be worth a look at, not as good as either the muck or the thermo+ and a stupid sole for going ashore with but cheap enough, and heaps warmer than those fishermans gumboots.

For years around here and across the tasman I wore a cheap pair of neoprene gumboots I bought from a budget outdoor store. Something like these but cheaper. Think I payed $30 for them.

http://www.raysoutdoors.com.au/Produ...MaAq6xEALw_wcB

Toasty feet, except the black soles left marks on white decks... Pretty good for the 40's and 50's but not quite Antarctic grade. Unfortunately they have now died, so I need to find a new pair of something similar.
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Old 23-07-2017, 04:22   #85
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

The Bekina Boots Thermolite look very similar to the dunlop thermo+ boots. Not sure what the falkland prices are like for the thermo+. The fishernans co-op had them and I was told in that thats what I needed, so thats what I got. I remember thinking how expensive they were, but never regretted the money spent when I had toastie warm toes.
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Old 23-07-2017, 14:10   #86
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

^^^^^ up 2

Maybe crazy.....
I used to have a pair of Musto boots with a liner ... warmish and comfy...but a slippery sole on rock and they fell to bits pretty soon after arrival in Chile. The same boot could be bought under the Dutch manufacturer's name for half the price.

Anyway that is when I bought the BATAs.... only used in running lines and on wet days. Otherwise I just wear shoes and socks... or Sorels if really cold.

I did once wear the BATAs on a daily basis for about 2 months straight... nearly crippled when I went ashore and took quite a while to recover... months not weeks...... which brings us to...

Burke... I would not touch Burke... my son wore a pair from NZ to Montt.. binned them on arrival because of what they were doing to his feet.

I think you can get away with cheap in a lot of areas ... some people even wear polyprop thermals and survive!! .. but not when it comes to your feet.

I checked out the Dunlops... steel toecap etc? all sounds very heavy..

I'll probably spring for the Muckboots.... its only money and if I don't buy them it will only end up being invested in slow horses and fast women.

PS .. going through my sock drawer earler... quite a few of my Icebreaker inner layers are 200/260..
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Old 23-07-2017, 14:29   #87
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

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Burke... I would not touch Burke... my son wore a pair from NZ to Montt.. binned them on arrival because of what they were doing to his feet.
Interesting, what was the problem? I notice the neoprene burke ones are quite tight around the calfs, so possibly trap moisture, but most of the neoprene boots are similar. Even the muck boots are pretty tight and get a bit damp inside over 4 hrs or so. My lovely lady has a pair and seems to like them for short tassie trips.
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I checked out the Dunlops... steel toecap etc? all sounds very heavy..
They are surprisingly lightweight. The polyurethane is sort of foamed up so it insulates and is very lightweight. The downside is the bulk. Initially they feel very clumsy but once you get used to them they are fine. I even used to do some long walks in them. They are quite stiff so the top of the boot stays open and lets moisture out. I could happily wear them all day and not get damp socks.
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Old 23-07-2017, 17:55   #88
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

Not sure exactly what the problem was with the Burkes ( it was quite a while back) but he was quite unhappy... and it wasn't a temperature related isse... was to do with the fit...

I've tracked these down.. Muck Boot Mens Arctic Sport Boot | Cotswold Outdoor

Au$170 plus Au$20 delivery compares quite well with the UK price of GBP110 including VAT.....

Not quite sure how these compare with the Pro but I don't need them for anything below about -5*C

One thing I have found upon research over the last little while is that none of the boots aimed at the 'yotting' market seem to be designed for cold weather.
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Old 23-07-2017, 18:01   #89
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

Quote:
Originally Posted by El Pinguino View Post
Not sure exactly what the problem was with the Burkes ( it was quite a while back) but he was quite unhappy... and it wasn't a temperature related isse... was to do with the fit...

I've tracked these down.. Muck Boot Mens Arctic Sport Boot | Cotswold Outdoor

Au$170 plus Au$20 delivery compares quite well with the UK price of GBP110 including VAT.....

Not quite sure how these compare with the Pro but I don't need them for anything below about -5*C

One thing I have found upon research over the last little while is that none of the boots aimed at the 'yotting' market seem to be designed for cold weather.
"Gunna buy me a yacht and see the Arctic." Not everybody says that?
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Old 23-07-2017, 18:42   #90
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Re: Sailing the Fierce 50's

Those look pretty good, and they appear to have a half decent sole on them unlike the burke's sole which is lethal on slippery rocks and picks up grit and stones in the narrow grooves. You probably don't need the arctic level of insulation for the channels but it is mighty nice having toastie warm feet. Though if they get too warm sweat is an issue.

Those plastic or rubber boots seem to have a negative insulation coefficient. I wore some regular seaboots to Antarctica on my first trip. Even with lots of thick socks and 10 mm foam inserts my feet suffered from nerve damage and loss of feeling for months afterwards. Putting the frozen boots on was a painful experience as the thermal mass of the cold boot sucked all the warmth from warm feet very quickly.

The muck boots we wore south last year had steel toecaps for cargo work. Feet still got slightly cold in the wee hours of the morning after four hours standing on an aluminium deck, but not badly enough to switch to the big baffin boots.
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