MOB safe options

[ChrisJHC]

Originally Posted by slipaway

One more thing about an AIS beacon. It also relies on your boat having AIS receive capability. If not, the MOB will only be visible to another vessel with that capability that is within the rather limited VHF range of the personal AIS beacon.

Consider also a Personal Locator Beacon. That transmits to the SAR satellite.

When offshore I have both.

[kayakerChuck]

Do not permit an opportunity to fall overboard. If alone, on deck, the person on deck uses a harness and a tether. Not ideal, and tethers bring up another set of problems, but (in my mind) it's better than nothing.

We regularly practice MOB stuff- to the point when my other half thought I was being ridiculous about it. Last week we were involved in a real SAR, very close to home, in busy waters. The MOB was recovered by divers several hours later. Stay on the damn boat.

Here's a link to Sheila's blog post about it:
https://sailingtwoflower.blogspot.co...fe-jacket.html

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by slipaway

One more thing about an AIS beacon. It also relies on your boat having AIS receive capability. If not, the MOB will only be visible to another vessel with that capability that is within the rather limited VHF range of the personal AIS beacon.



Consider also a Personal Locator Beacon. That transmits to the SAR satellite.

Plbs are body recovery systems.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by brenmuhl

Hi Cruisers,

I'm a new member with a 5 yr plan

my other half has put to me the fear of being in the water for a long period if she ever fell overboard while im asleep.

I've assured her that there are safe guards like tethers, eperbs, PABs, flares, but in my admitted limited experience got me to thinking, if the life jacket had a remote device which turned the helm say left so the boat went in a circle to return to the same place what would be the effect and would it be possible, and what would be needed to make it possible. and yes i know rule number 1 is don't fall off in the first place.

thanks for your thoughts

My wife freaks about this too.

Firstly the key is to ensure no one falls over on 35 years of sailing I’ve never fell off a boat.

Secondly if the person in the water is disabled then they are dead as the chances of a couple getting the other back onboard are minimal to non existence. ( especially if the man falls in )

A sailing boat cannot have automated controls as that is not possible with sails up. And single handed the remaining person ( if it’s the weaker wife , will struggle to depower the boat , get the sails away and return.

I would argue the key is to stop the boat. Not to turn it or go back simply to quickly prevent it leaving thd scene.

We do uses AIS mobs as these alert up on our chart plotter and any other ais vessel nearby.

Plbs are largely body recovery trackers as response times in many sea areas is way too slow and the Plb is useless as the boat itself doesn’t get tracking info. ( I have plbs but don’t use them anymore for crew)

So the key is don’t fall over the likelihood is you’ll drown.

[slipaway]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Plbs are body recovery systems.

As with any of these options it all depends on the circumstances and environment. PLBs used in a warmer climate with a MOB in a lifejacket offer a reasonable opportunity for rescue. In a cold climate or no lifejacket not so much. The PLB also can serve as an EPIRB should there be an abandon ship situation (the PLB and EPIRB are functionally equivalent the difference being battery length, antenna height). Then again, an AIS beacon in open water with few other vessels around only is useful if your boat can receive the signal. Each MOB tool has it's place. One of the most useful and "lowest tech" tools is a good whistle. In several sail races where someone went overboard despite having PLBs and AISs, they were recovered because someone heard the whistle!

As said, the trick is to not let it happen. So much is dependent upon the specific boat. Do you need to leave the cockpit to work sails? = higher risk; is it an open stern or low freeboard cockpit= higher risk. Do you use jack lines? Tethers? Or just develop good practices like wearing the lifejacket whenever you leave the cockpit, practicing what to do if someone goes overboard, etc. We can't eliminate the risk but we can reduce it.

[goboatingnow]

Be a bit silly to have AIS mob devices and not fit an AIS receive ability !!

The big issue is that in many countries responses to EPIBS are measured in hours , lots of hours .

For mob the best recovery asset is the boat you fell off. Hence AIS is better then PLB. the boat can simply also call in a MAYDAY anyway.

Plbs were largely developed for land based rescue .

[slipaway]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Be a bit silly to have AIS mob devices and not fit an AIS receive ability !!

Very true but happens all the time. Some of it is marketing and people wanting to get a "cool" tech gadget, some is just ignorance. And it is not limited to new recreational sailors. A few years ago a very experienced racer went overboard at night, had the AIS beacon but his boat (a very $$ and experienced racing boat) had no receive capability. What saved him was his whistle (and a crew that practiced what to do).

There is always going to be the discussion of PLB vs AIS vs.... Here is a good article that discusses it (from a marine safety expert):

https://www.soundingsonline.com/voic...-ais-satellite

[boatman61]

The only sail one really needs to get down/furl is the head sail in an MOB situation, then engine on and head back to the MOB..
Teach her how to furl the jib/genny, centre the mainsheet and start the engine then do a 180 and head back..
Worry about getting back on board when the above has been mastered

[thesaltytar]

I agree: don't fall off the boat. But this doesn't do much for the OP's wife's concerns, in fact I think it may rather cement them.

I've seen a few references to turning the boat in a circle (the "racetrack" maneuver) but not sure we explained to OP why this might not work. It works better on a powerboat or under motor, but even so, I can only imagine that falling off the boat immediately prior to being run over by it would only be rubbing salt in the wound.

Under sail (on a randomly given point of sail) simple turning in a circle might not help the situation much. If I were below decks and got the MOB alarm, I would much rather know that the MOB is somewhere on a reciprocal track. It will give the best fighting chance to get back to that person.

I have been involved in two MOBs and both had happy endings. One was at a standstill in front of some locks when we tried to launch the tender and the entire davit ripped out of the deck and took a sailor with it. Thankfully the ripping out of the davit had the effect of launching the tender so our recovery operation was already half way complete.

Another time was sailing between Gloucester and the Isles of Shoals when a chap went forward to relieve himself over the side of the boat. It was one of those eerie moments when I just KNEW he was going to topple over the side before he even started his business but that's hardly grounds to tell him to stop. Instead I just repositioned myself to the windward side, over he went, and I fished him out as he bounced down the side of the hull. I didn't even have to change course or slow down for that one.

There are a lot of different circumstances for a MOB so it's good to become familiar with them. All of this training serves (and demands) to increase the level of technical skill and boat handling by all involved, so there's nothing lost and some confidence to gain.

Sailing on a beam reach on a calm day? Well that's the easiest. Throw in a Williamson turn (pictured) and stay a few boat lengths downwind. Then (knowing your boat) turn up into the wind rather like picking up a mooring ball under sail. I'm not a huge fan of dropping all sail for a MOB because it takes time and effort. Once you turn into the wind you can turn on the engine and let the sails flog, they won't do anything but make noise unless you get a cross gust, but this goes back to knowing the situation you're in. Would I drop sail in other circumstances? Sure.

Picking the person out deserves its own conversation that I think is important and we should all have. As someone said earlier a MOB operation isn't a single action, it's surprisingly complex with lots of steps involved, each one with technical complications, and it can be argued getting someone out of the drink can be the hardest part.

[TrentePieds]

The OP joined us very, very recently and has made but the one post. He did start a valuable conversation, but I fear he may have decided that the answer he was hoping for is not forthcoming :-).

Still, it may very well be that there are other novices, perhaps not quite so "novice", that will find the conversation useful.

So as a gesture to any such let me add: The first thing a landsman has to learn if he wishes to transist to being a seafaring man is what to do with his body when aboard ship, and most particularly what NOT to do with it!

It's simple really: Man has four limbs. When moving about ship and particularly when working on deck, only ONE limb should be "airborne" at any given time: One hand can be airborne if the other hand and BOTH feet are securely "planted". One foot can be 'airborne" if the other foot and BOTH hands are securely "planted".

It takes a while to learn to do the tasks you need to do while following that rule rigidly, but it is in following that rule that safety lies. Harnesses and tethers and jack lines and all the other "safety stuff" are BACK-UPs that come into play only if you mess up following the basic rule: Only ONE limb airborne at any given
time!

Cheers

TP

[sailingharry]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Be a bit silly to . . . not fit an AIS receive ability !!

Making your statement just a touch more general. Many people tout the limitations of AIS, but implementing receive only is an extremely high return on investment. A newer VHF, for a couple of hundred dollars, and a two conductor wire between the VHF and the chartplotter. You will see every freighter out there. You will see every sailboat that has ever done an offshore race (most races require transmit anility these days). You will see a large number of miscellaneous pleasure craft. And you will see every MOB device. Arguments about transmit ability are not as strong, but receive ability is a must-have on any significant boat.

[requiem]

Much of the MOB practice I've done has been under sail; dropping sails, apart from taking additional time (and taking eyes off the MOB), has the potential to make a mess of the deck/cockpit. I've also been surprised myself at how easily going through the practiced maneuvers puts the target into the expected location.

Regarding AIS devices; I have one fitted to my PFD but not all the boats I sail on have receive capability. For your own boat I strongly recommend fitting AIS.

In the US PFDs seem to lack lifting strops, and I'm not sure why. I've fitted the "MOB lifesavers" to the harness hardpoints on mine, so that someone aboard can reach it with a boathook and rig a hoist even if I'm incapacitated. Hoisting is probably the one thing least practiced, but I don't see why the weaker partner can't manage it if they've given thought to an appropriate system in advance.

[TrentePieds]

Requiem sez: "... I don't see why the weaker partner can't manage it if they've given thought to an appropriate system in advance."

A solid argument in favour of having a proper running topping lift in a cruising boat :-). These days, with every fall taken to the cockpit and winches available, a running topping lift makes a crane boom out of the main boom. The boom permits the MOB to remain clear of the hull while being hoisted so he doesn't get injured by slamming into it, and it permits him to be hoisted high enuff to clear the life lines.

Because of such a rig's efficacy it also permits help to go in the water, e.g if the MOB is already unconscious or even dead, since once the victim is back aboard, the crane permits the helper to be hoisted back aboard before he, too, becomes a victim.

All stuff to used only in extremis, of course. We are back to prevention being better than cure :-)!

TrentePieds

[hjohnson]

So when or with my partner, who’s 4’10” and probably weighs 100lbs soaking wet, I treat it like I’m out single handed. At most, I’ve managed to teach her how to bring the boat to a stop and to hit the distress button on the radio.

I basically treat it like I’m single handing, so I do everything in my power to avoid falling over the side. The boat is setup so that I never have to leave the cockpit while underway, and if I do have to leave the cockpit, I’m tethered to the boat. If it’s anything other than perfectly clear weather, I have at least one jackline rigged.

[slipaway]

An interesting article regarding MOB: https://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2...-mob-recovery/