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Old 08-06-2020, 14:20   #76
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

I made my cones from ripstop nylon, 7oz with polymer backing. The binding on the forward opening is done after the cone is made and the binding reinforces the cone so it will not tear. I tried to tear a cone and just couldn't.
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Old 08-06-2020, 21:44   #77
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

Quote:
Originally Posted by StoneCrab View Post
Ocean Brake uses two different materials for the cones.



The cones for the nylon drogues are made from a 7oz polyester with a synthetic backing



The new cones, for HMPE drogues are made from Duradon[emoji768] Light, which is a roughly 12oz cloth made by British Millerain

Cool, thanks for the info. So I have most of my cones as standard nylon and 9 from the stronger material for my UHMWPE rode. If ever deployed for real it will be interesting to compare the cones afterwards.
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Old 12-06-2020, 08:31   #78
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

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Originally Posted by fxykty View Post
From the reports when originally testing the JSD and the subsequent designerís notes it looks like a JSD allows the boat to initially move with the breaking wave as the catenary reduces and drag increases, then slows the boat and pulls it back over the top of the wave before it starts to surf.

Usage reports donít suggest that there are immense wave strikes. They do report waves making their way onto aft decks and into the cockpit, but not with a lot of force.

Itís a good point though. While thereís certainly more hull surface in modern sterns the strength of the hull itself should be plenty. Itís the binnacles and rail mounted BBQ and outboard motor and solar panel arch, etc, thatís at risk.

The original report suggests to reinforce the cockpit, including the companionway doorway, since wave strikes are a risk with the JSD. The forces are immense according to the designer notes. Subsequent use in real-life and practice video on youtube seem to support this problem.

One should always assume wave strikes are going to occur regardless of storm drogue or para-anchor deployed. Many boats handle wave strikes better at the bow, instead of the stern. Some boat designs can take weather on both the bow and stern.

We would have to agree ďthe hull strength should be plentyĒ.
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Old 06-10-2020, 05:58   #79
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

Thanks for a great thread.

Could anyone please inform me of the length of a single piece of tape? We are gathering materials.

From my tabletop guesstimates, using ĺ” tape:

Overhand knot plus remainder: 3+1” = 4”
Bury : ? 1”
Therefore 5” before exiting line to cone. Using the Sailrite dimensions of 9” for the aft portion, that would leave around 4” of “free tape” behind the cone, and around 10” forward. Using Marylin Lange’s dimensions, this would be quite a bit less. I haven't seen these lengths discussed, but may have missed it.

Does anyone have a length for the tapes to report?
Thanks for any replies.
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Old 06-10-2020, 06:44   #80
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

From Jordan's USCG drogue report...
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Old 06-10-2020, 08:41   #81
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

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Originally Posted by wsmurdoch View Post
From Jordan's USCG drogue report...
Thanks wsmurdoch, I have seen that, but ....
Does this diagram mean the ends of the tape are where it enters the line? So, add, say, 4Ē to each side? Or have folks been using this diagram as a cutting guide? Adding 8ď x 175 x 3 makes quite a difference in what we order, about 360í, hence the question.
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Old 06-10-2020, 18:00   #82
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

I think I used the Jordan figure as the cut length with the cones spaced 20 inches apart and a gap between one cone's tapes and the next. But, don't rely on my memory; years have gone by. I looked in my computer folder where I at the time collected drogue information and I notice that Sailrite in their "Make Your Own Series Drogue, Drogue Kit Downloadable #861310" has a 30 inch cut length for their tapes. I'm just not sure what I did, and my boat is 7 hours away.

I do know that my unanswered question was whether the cone seam should be laid out parallel to the warp/ filler or on the bias. It makes a difference in the stretchy feel of the cones and makes some difference in the load carried by the stitching.

The experiences of others since I made mine have lead me to think that my 1.5 oz cones are too lightly constructed and that UHMWPE would be a better line than my PET. I have never used mine.
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Old 06-10-2020, 18:05   #83
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

Thank you for those details. That is all helpful.
We are (going to be) using 6.6 oz fabric and UHMWPE.
We hope to never use ours in anger also, although we just might drop it if we get into some gnarly weather that doesnít really need the drogue, just to understand it better.
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Old 11-10-2020, 06:03   #84
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

This was a trial of seven types
https://www.pbo.co.uk/gear/which-dro...-you-buy-25543
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Old 11-10-2020, 06:32   #85
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

For those folks that have used Dyneema, how did you secure the tape? We have found that polyester tape going through UHMWPE is a slippery combination.
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Old 11-10-2020, 16:05   #86
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

With uncovered Dyneema rode (8, 10, and 12mm) we lead the tapes through twice, then knitted each tape with a figure-8 knot. Pulling the rode tight before pulling the tapes to their knots seems to work to keep the knots from pulling through.
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Old 11-10-2020, 16:11   #87
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

This was the template I made to mark the rode. Measurements are for the Ocean Brake cones that we bought, with a cone every 50cm.

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The cones we bought two years ago are lighter than the cones for Dyneema that they sell now. I donít know the exact fabric weights, but both the material and tapes are heavier for the new cones. If we ever deploy for real weíll find out whether the heavier cones are needed as we will now have both types on our drogue.

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Old 11-10-2020, 16:43   #88
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

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Originally Posted by fxykty View Post
This was the template ....

Thanks muchly for all the info, fxykty.

Have you used your JSD yet? Any issues?

I worry also, that the polyester tape will undo the figure of 8 knot if the drogue is more at rest. We have considered using a hotknife to lock each knot.

Thanks again for your input. [emoji120]
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Old 12-10-2020, 01:17   #89
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

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Originally Posted by BigNut View Post
Thanks muchly for all the info, fxykty.

Have you used your JSD yet? Any issues?

I worry also, that the polyester tape will undo the figure of 8 knot if the drogue is more at rest. We have considered using a hotknife to lock each knot.

Thanks again for your input. [emoji120]

Havenít tested it yet as we havenít been far enough offshore for it to be deep enough since finishing putting it togetherWeekend after next weíre heading down south to take a look at White Island and should find plenty of deep water on the way.

I really jammed the knots. I havenít considered that the tape knots could come undone. Hmmm.
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Old 22-10-2020, 18:29   #90
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Re: Jordan Series Drogue in Dyneema

I have not read through this entire thread, but there is a lot of incorrect information and thinking here. First, if Dyneema had been around when Jim Jordan designed the Drogue, he would have used it and years later, he mentioned that. The design of the Drogue has evolved since the original with heavier cloth for the cones and improved attachment points. The biggest issue is how to attach the JSD to the boat with adequate strength. Most production boat cleats are most likely not designed for the loads that could be experienced with a rare breaking wave (again, this is discussed in the link below).

Iíve added two websites that go into great detail. Anyone who has questions or interested should research.

https://www.jordanseriesdrogue.com/D_5.htm
Website explains a lot in the JSD design and has a link for the USCG report.

https://dragdevicedb.com/drogues
Website has numerous personal experiences with using the JSD on various boats. You can filter the search in the left column to find the boat you have or one similar.
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