Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

[ElGatoGordo]

This is such a stupid thread. I'm stunned at the number of people that are actually fine with illegal dumping. I'm pretty extreme in my opposition to government spending and interference, but this is way beyond the law.

I'm a composter because pumps are gross to me. But if you choose to use a holding tank and traditional system...fine...but my God...you dump in the Marina???? Sick. Plain sick. You were born few hundred years too late I guess.

The fact that there are far worse polluters is a red herring and a foolish man's argument. Your momma should have taught you that "2 wrongs don't make a right" and "you can't justify bad behavior with bad behavior". Let's fix OUR issues AND make these municipalities fix theirs.

[Richard_W]

Originally Posted by Dsanduril

Know anyone who goes hiking/backpacking in wilderness areas and carries out their pee? I know some (a very few) who carry out their #2, I know none who carry out their #1 (yes, I'm sure somebody here can point me to the one saint who does). Most I know step behind a tree or a rock...

This is a 3 mile analogy not relevant to what I was referring to. I was talking "camping site" which is the marina or near shore analogy.

Besides ... yes, responsible mountaineers and climbers take care of their own s##t. You carry it down from the rock, but you do not have to carry it out to neutralize it responsible way. You can read up on this on hiking sites.

[Matt sachs]

Originally Posted by boatsail

no scooter...fins....using a rebreather as opposed to scuba tanks... google "marine recon diver" on google images. requirements are 500m underwater in 15 min or less...my times with fins were 11-11.30 minutes. this time was important for underwater navigation to factor tides and currents prior to going underwater, so that you could simply follow your compas for predetermined times and change course to new direction...for example, 1k is a 22 min time, but hten figure for current too coming from side, front or back. the school for that was in panama city, fl. Was a really interesting thing to learn. being able to trust your compass while you have vertigo and hitting a pier and doing it every day (once in morning and once at night...you and your dive buddy had to switch who was navigating) really gave faith in the gear. 4 hours of 02 time in a 24hr period. the physics of it were really awesome and i'm really thankful that I got to go to that school....learned a heck of a lot about diving and myself! that was back when panama city fl was the spring place to be and i was about 22 yrs old! great times!

i would probably guess i pissed in my suit at least twice a day, more if i could muster up enough piss! lol

We,(my instructor and I), did a 3 hour navagation on our rebreathers. I got it to within 100 yards of the goal. Thats way off by your standards, but I was pretty dang happy with it. Of course national security was not an issue.

[donradcliffe]

Somebody can correct me if I'm wrong, but the US Clean Water act DOES fund pumpout stations. AFAIK, the states administer the federal money, but it covers over 90% of the initial and operating cost of the pumpout stations. That is why the cost of a pumpout at a funded station is supposed to be less than or equal to $5.00 You can usually get a list of the funded pumpout stations from your state's department of environmental quality or equivalent.

So I would say the Clean Water act is a working example of the US government assuming the bulk of the cost for the public good of cleaner water. It isn't perfect, but maybe other nearby governments can learn from this example.

[Me-and-Boo]

I have enjoyed reading the thread. As a start I will state that it is illegal to discharge in to US territorial waters and the whole of the Great Lakes. That is by local, state and Federal (big F) laws and regulations.

That includes standing in your pulpit and peeing in to the wind.

Rather than break down who is wrong and where, please re-read my opening statement. You can discharge outside the 12 mile limit without problems.

If you go to the federal register and search for Marpol annex you will find a section asking for comments. You should give your comments.

As for those who do follow the laws and regulations without someone standing over you, thank you.

A final thought from your boring regulator. It takes real brass balls to state in front of everyone reading, including those you probably do not know, that you break the laws and regulations of the US. Even more brass to give your location.

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by Me-and-Boo

Rather than break down who is wrong and where, please re-read my opening statement. You can discharge outside the 12 mile limit without problems.

So, the effects of poop are limited to 12 miles from shore? - and they only float one way

[Dsanduril]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

So, the effects of poop are limited to 12 miles from shore? - and they only float one way

So there's another interesting one. Before additional legislation got passed, it used to be that there were a couple of "donut (doughnut?) holes" on the Inside Passage in southeast Alaska. Places that were just over three miles from all land and therefore legal points of discharge of untreated sewage, but in essentially land-locked waters. Turned out that every single cruise ship passing through the Inside Passage dumped in exactly the same place, because it was (no longer is) the only legal place to do so. Perfectly legal (at the time), but ethical?

www.dec.state.ak.us/water/cruise.../faqcruiseshipsforweb7_06.pdf

[Therapy]

This has been a most interesting thread.

Thanks all.

PS I have a lot of comments but I don't know how to multi-quote (though some have tried to tell me) so I just won't say anything cuz I don't want to leave anybody out.

[sabray]

Originally Posted by Therapy

This has been a most interesting thread.

Thanks all.

PS I have a lot of comments but I don't know how to multi-quote (though some have tried to tell me) so I just won't say anything cuz I don't want to leave anybody out.

Therapy just used his holding tank. If his opinion tank was full and the opinion pump out boat could not be raised and he was full of it would he: A) have opinionate himself, B) opinionate in the bilge, C) opinionate off the rail.
If you got that then you might realize even us greenies get common sense. Problem is all these I can do this and that's what I've done before so its okay opinions. .
Information changes and I hope we all use best information and then do our best. If your best information says **** in my pool always, whenever you can I don't like you.

[boatsail]

Originally Posted by ElGatoGordo

This is such a stupid thread. I'm stunned at the number of people that are actually fine with illegal dumping. I'm pretty extreme in my opposition to government spending and interference, but this is way beyond the law.

I'm a composter because pumps are gross to me. But if you choose to use a holding tank and traditional system...fine...but my God...you dump in the Marina???? Sick. Plain sick. You were born few hundred years too late I guess.

The fact that there are far worse polluters is a red herring and a foolish man's argument. Your momma should have taught you that "2 wrongs don't make a right" and "you can't justify bad behavior with bad behavior". Let's fix OUR issues AND make these municipalities fix theirs.

I'm with Gordo. I have a composter for many reasons, but main one was all that pump out stuff is nasty...composting is a simple solution to a crappy problem

[Richard_W]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

So, the effects of poop are limited to 12 miles from shore? - and they only float one way

No, but at least you give nature space and time to deal with it before it hits the marinas, public beaches, and affect sources of drinking water (upstream Hudson River for example).

The resolution to poo and related waste problem is to manage it using nature to the extend possible. We, as the society, make great efforts on land to protect water from contamination. From large efforts like elaborate municipal waste management systems, expensive domestic septic and leaching systems, paid for RV and camping facilities, to small efforts like outdoors rules not to pee and poo x feet from creeks, streams and rivers.

And then there is boating and shipping culture that seems to think in medieval terms of open gutter mentality, and expects everybody else to follow and wade in their own s##t. Go figure!

[capngeo]

Coming soon to a marina near you..... Manatee Diapers! Yes you too can help corral the average 60# of feces the West Indian Manatee deposits in your local waters each and every day........ BUT WAIT; THERE'S MORE!

Order today and we'll include a set of Perch Pampers for free!

[Richard_W]

Originally Posted by capngeo

Coming soon to a marina near you..... Manatee Diapers! Yes you too can help corral the average 60# of feces the West Indian Manatee deposits in your local waters each and every day........ BUT WAIT; THERE'S MORE!

Order today and we'll include a set of Perch Pampers for free!

I guess we can shoot them all to make more space for human waste ...

[Blue Crab]

Originally Posted by boatsail

no scooter...fins....using a rebreather as opposed to scuba tanks... google "marine recon diver" on google images. requirements are 500m underwater in 15 min or less...my times with fins were 11-11.30 minutes. this time was important for underwater navigation to factor tides and currents prior to going underwater, so that you could simply follow your compas for predetermined times and change course to new direction...for example, 1k is a 22 min time, but hten figure for current too coming from side, front or back. the school for that was in panama city, fl. Was a really interesting thing to learn. being able to trust your compass while you have vertigo and hitting a pier and doing it every day (once in morning and once at night...you and your dive buddy had to switch who was navigating) really gave faith in the gear. 4 hours of 02 time in a 24hr period. the physics of it were really awesome and i'm really thankful that I got to go to that school....learned a heck of a lot about diving and myself! that was back when panama city fl was the spring place to be and i was about 22 yrs old! great times!

i would probably guess i pissed in my suit at least twice a day, more if i could muster up enough piss! lol

Yeah man, great times! I like this guy but I hate this kind of post. So many of us are/were tough guys, underwater guys, badass mofocos. It troubles me when some young stud comes along and talks this sh*t. Like he invented it. Kinda like Fstbttms invented bottom cleaning, and is the be all/end all of bottom paint wisdom. Meh.

[fstbttms]

Originally Posted by Blue Crab

It troubles me when some young stud comes along and talks this sh*t. Like he invented it. Kinda like Fstbttms invented bottom cleaning, and is the be all/end all of bottom paint wisdom. Meh.

Yeah, but I ain't wrong.