Cruisers seeking humanitarian refuge in NZ

[bobnlesley]

Originally Posted by Americanrancher

Funny typos in this one! Haha "bait a septic" Ooh smelly!

Sorry, not typos.

[RaymondR]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

ROLF

These people truly believed everywhere is their backyard, eh?

An Indonesian fisher seeking refuge from bad weather in Ashmore gets his boat confiscated.

But a Kiwi cruiser in Minerva thinks he has some damn special rights.

Ignorance and impertinence of the whites knows no limits.

;-)
barnakiel

I actually worked at Ashmore reef for about seven months during the sixties and Indo fishermen were very common visitors. They were tolerated for decades more until a number if things happened.

The small family boats which were almost exclusively the visitors were replaced by larger professional fishers. Large sharks fin fishers started denuding the reefs in the area of the top predators. People smugglers became more prevalent. You dump a boat load of people on there, scuttle back the eighty or so miles into Indo waters during the night and the Australian authorities are stuck with them. The exploitation of offshore mineral resources has become more prevalent and claims of sovereignty based upon "traditional use" are becoming more common (A certain NE Asian country is becoming notorious for these types of claims in a certain sea and trepang fishing was common along the north coast of the Australian continent)

The intruders are no longer family groups but commercial ventures and burning the boats of offenders tends to destroy the profit and disrupt the business plan of the corporate miscreants behind the ventures.

[RaymondR]

Originally Posted by td0tz

The change in the world started 5 months ago. It's a plague. Strangers are more likely to be plague bearers than our neighbors.
Good governments exist to protect their communities, not some rando wanderers.

Please, it's not 1820 or 1920. Are we supposed to think that there are cruisers who have maintained ignorance for 5 months of the biggest health threat in a century?

They chose to cast off in the face of it. Bold choice, and this is how it's working out for them.

"rando wanderers", crossing oceans in sail boats, you must be a "pig boater".

[dgmyles]

Originally Posted by RaymondR

So if the virus persists in the outside world for years or even decades NZ will keep it's borders closed. Sounds like the worlds biggest prison camp to me.

Consider a hypothetical for a moment: The virus persists. Instead of declining in potency it evolves to become more deadly. However exposure to the early pre-evolved version provides protection.

Sweden is going to look very wise then NZ, Australia and the other "eradicators" are going to appear foolish then.

This things a long way from over and I have the feeling that the so called experts are not so certain of the eventual outcome.

I wonder if the families of the 5700 dead swedes would agree?

[RaymondR]

Originally Posted by dgmyles

I wonder if the families of the 5700 dead swedes would agree?

The great majority of whom were dying in the near future anyway.

Perhaps the swedes took cognizance of the old and said "Do you want to stretch your miserable, low quality life out to the greatest possible extent and leave your children and grandchildren with a ruined economy and massive debt or would you rather let nature take it's course and avoid burdening your descendants with these curses".

And.

The old replied "Bring it on Hughy, we know we've had a good run, let nature take it's course and we'll spit in it's eye with our expiring breath".

Magnificent folks them old swedes.

[NaClyDog]

Originally Posted by RaymondR

The great majority of whom were dying in the near future anyway.

W T F

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by RaymondR

The great majority of whom were dying in the near future anyway.


(...)

Well, we all are. Define near.



Furthermore, neither a newborn nor a centenarian know how much is left in the bank.


Everybody, no matter what age and condition, deserves respect and support. All the time to the moment the engine stops.


Saying "were dying anyway" does not show this respect.


ymmv



barnakiel

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by RaymondR

The great majority of whom were dying in the near future anyway.

Perhaps the swedes took cognizance of the old and said "Do you want to stretch your miserable, low quality life out to the greatest possible extent and leave your children and grandchildren with a ruined economy and massive debt or would you rather let nature take it's course and avoid burdening your descendants with these curses".

And.

The old replied "Bring it on Hughy, we know we've had a good run, let nature take it's course and we'll spit in it's eye with our expiring breath".

Magnificent folks them old swedes.

They leapt into coffins crying.. "I am a Viking"

What is not stated is the ethnicity% of the dead.. they have had a large BAME influx over the last couple of years and they are allegedly more vulnerable.

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by RaymondR

The great majority of whom were dying in the near future anyway.

Perhaps the swedes took cognizance of the old and said "Do you want to stretch your miserable, low quality life out to the greatest possible extent and leave your children and grandchildren with a ruined economy and massive debt or would you rather let nature take it's course and avoid burdening your descendants with these curses".

And.

The old replied "Bring it on Hughy, we know we've had a good run, let nature take it's course and we'll spit in it's eye with our expiring breath".

Magnificent folks them old swedes.

Raymond... what a very good idea... as you suggested it... you get to go first....

[El Pinguino]

Restricted entry of yachts into NZ has nothing to do with keeping Covid out.... its all about the money...

An exemption process has been announced, led by NZ Marine and focusses on the exemption criteria of delivering a yacht to a New Zealand business for reprovisioning, refuelling, repair or refit; there is a suggested threshold for applicants of $50,000 expenditure.
https://occwebsite.azurewebsites.net/newsitem/1365/

Of course being NZ$ aka 'South Pacific Pesos' $50k isn't that onerous....

[alctel]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

I ask again - what would you have done if you had actually been out sailing???

Well, in my case we turned around and went back to Mexico, as did several other boats that were only a few days out. Left the boat on the hard and beat it back to Canada asap.

Most of the other ones that were further along diverted to Hawaii. Luckily the border closure happened right at the start of the crossing season, any later and there would have been a lot more stranded boats (including me!).

[Scotty Kiwi]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

Restricted entry of yachts into NZ has nothing to do with keeping Covid out.... its all about the money...

An exemption process has been announced, led by NZ Marine and focusses on the exemption criteria of delivering a yacht to a New Zealand business for reprovisioning, refuelling, repair or refit; there is a suggested threshold for applicants of $50,000 expenditure.
https://occwebsite.azurewebsites.net/newsitem/1365/

Of course being NZ$ aka 'South Pacific Pesos' $50k isn't that onerous....

It appears to me that this is not policy, it's a proposal, probably one of many.
Quite different from an announced exemption process.

That said, there has been a general exemption process that is open to all to apply - but few applications get accepted (so far) and the Government seems to obfuscate the decision criteria. James Cameron (Avatar) and film crew passed that bar a while back - by generating 000's of jobs.

I still can't see the Govt allowing yachties in before, or even shortly after the general election 19th September. The public would go ballistic if an infection arrived on a yacht. I can't see Govt taking the risk of losing 00,000's of votes from political fallout for the benefit of practically no extra votes. I can't see them being allowed to self isolate under any circumstances. I can't see the humanitarian argument begin strong enough to offset the perceived risk (and there is no appetite for taking those risks).

But yeah, sure, exempting crew's on a case by case basis when they can afford to stay in a supervised hotel isolation facility, can comply, and help keep the economics of the marine industry going ... I can't see many folk successfully objecting to that - and there's 0000's of votes in it at least around Auckland and North.

[El Pinguino]

Have a Captain Cook at this......
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political...of-year-ardern

[Scotty Kiwi]

If it takes nearly 5 more months to arrange travel between NZ and Cook Is, then my strong view ... that the average S.P. cruisers are stuffed for the cyclone season ... just got a lot stronger.

Hmmmm interesting. Such damn slow progress though ... another 5 months? The Cook's don't have a Covid case - NZ hasn't had a community case for over 100 days. And the two countries easily follow the same protocols.

Where's the risk in speeding it up? Or more accurately were's the risk that cannot be 100% mitigated?

[El Pinguino]

A thought... most of the boats in the South Pacific are probably in French Polynesia... I have several friends up there just now. They don't really have a problem... esp if they have an EU passport.... no visa restrictions and the boat is good for two years...
So all they have to do as liveaboards is head up to the Marquesas for the austral summer.
This https://www.bwsailing.com/cyclones-in-french-polynesia/ seems to back up my thinking on this..
That leaves the boats west of there... I would think the ones in Vanuatu/Fiji/NewCal should/would/could be looking towards Qland... so all we are left with is boats between FP and Tonga

A quick look at MarineTraffic just now shows 12 yachts running AIS in that area .... a rough guide for sure.... but I don't think NZ would be looking at the hundreds of boats and thousands of people suggested by some....