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Old 11-02-2011, 08:58   #61
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"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do those things to other people and I require the same of them." (John Wayne, the Shootist)

Just so we all understand American attitudes....




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Old 11-02-2011, 09:15   #62
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Who recommends it? ...
Val Glinka, a self defense instructor at Sylvania Southview High School near Toledo Ohio.

Use Wasp Spray to Stop an Assailant as a Criminal Deterrent-Disputed!
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Old 11-02-2011, 10:00   #63
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I would put wasp spray in the category of use of last resort. It may be more effective than nothing, but less than totally effective. The blindness is temperary and may vary by the assalants health, resistance to chemicals, and the brand of spray used. They do have a longer range than most pepper sprays, and where it was recommended was in a dorm where the the potential victim was forbidden to possess any other form of defence, and the most common threat was rape, and the attacker only had to be delayed a few minutes before help would arrive. In that situation where the conflict would most likely be between a 90 pound female co-ed, and a 200lb drunk football player who is unlikely to want to escalate the violence, a non-lethal defence is very effective. And a spray gives better odds than a bat or other physical weapon, (In a match up between the Co-ed and the jock, I would place my money on the jock no matter what weapon she happened to have, a gun in that situation would just as likely ricochet through a few neighbors rooms as her attacker). In any other situation keep the weapon handy that makes the most sense for that situation. The best defence is a sharp mind, a light sleep, and a nose for trouble.
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Old 11-02-2011, 11:17   #64
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Air cargo

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<snip> pepper spray <snip> not transportable by air
Hi Jamu

Pepper spray is shipped by air under International dangerous goods ID No. UN1950, Aerosols Flammable, Class 2.1, Packing Instructions 201, Fiberboard box (Cardboard)

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Old 11-02-2011, 11:46   #65
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"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do those things to other people and I require the same of them." (John Wayne, the Shootist)

Just so we all understand American attitudes....




I really tend to not respect it when people employ the use of stereotypes. I'm a 22 year old 6ft, 200 pound Montanan who just happens to be professionally trained in Ballet. Never been in a fight in my life simply because I think its more "manly" to disarm a situation with words, or allow someone to rob me rather than fight for things that don't truly matter.

The line or me is when someone is immediately trying to harm me or someone I love, and I guess the only reason I was considering bringing something like pepper spray is because I had planned to sail with my girlfriend... and that worries me just a little bit.
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Old 11-02-2011, 11:49   #66
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Old 11-02-2011, 11:52   #67
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Raymond Davis case has snowballed into a major diplomatic row. Washington has threatened to throw the Pakistani envoy out if Davis is not released immediately. pakistanis are playing tough.
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Old 11-02-2011, 11:57   #68
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Have none of you watched James Bond?
An aerosol can and a cigar makes a lovely flame thrower, and nothing illegal about it (until you use it). Close range only, but effective.



ooopppss miss-spent youth coming out again.
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Old 11-02-2011, 12:16   #69
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Most countries take a dim view of any sort of personal defense weapon that has no use outside of such activities, Hence Tasers, pepper sprays etc tend to be banned. I fail to see why any boater would have one.


This type of justification is quite fallacious really. fire, which is quite a common and deadly occurence and personal protection which is an extremely rare requirement is a very dubious comparison.

Equally falling on your head, is a rare occurance, do you therefore wear a helmet, how about always wearing a lifejacket, being scalded by boiling water, so your wearing a protective suit. Sorry you are advancing "teh number of angels on the head of a pin" argument.

It worries me greatly , that there is a subset of cruisers that feel the need to bring potentially dangerous, offensive "weapons" into the cruising lifestyle. I would prefer if the paranoid just stayed at home thank you.

Dave
But honestly do you truly come from a place in you thinking where if someone doesnt have the same thought processes as you, and doesnt consider the same things to be a risk as you that they have no validity and shouldn't be boating? Seems to be a pretty scary stance to take.

A person might perceive falling to be more of a threat and wear helmets, or might have there life vest on all the time for fear of drowning, or maybe they worry bit about theft and carry some pepper spray. All in a logical way make perfect sense, and all are based upon the diversity of people coming to different conclusions. I just find the shooting others down so harshly for thinking differently than yourself to be a bit disturbing.

Honestly my curiosity about boat defensa could very likely just be rooted in the fact that as of yet I havent actually sailed and therefore dont know anything, and have made up worries in my head that when confronted with the real environment will evaporate. Just like when I lived in North Carolina, and then in Hawaii people were always asking me if I had to fight of bears in Montana. Even got asked once if I had to worry about Native Americans lol. But thats ok, it makes sense when a person has no experience in a environment to have fears that may or may not have any grounding in reality.

But sense others who do sail tend to share and understand the place my thought processes lead me to, it would be logical to think that my (slight) worries were not superfluous. Sorry for not staying on topic... was just kind of irking me a bit.
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Old 11-02-2011, 12:18   #70
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So I gather no one has purchased, tested, and compared the tool to competing products. If anyone has verified the item actually works, the user-friendliness, etc., please post.
This.
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Old 11-02-2011, 13:07   #71
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Honestly my curiosity about boat defensa could very likely just be rooted in the fact that as of yet I havent actually sailed and therefore dont know anything, and have made up worries in my head that when confronted with the real environment will evaporate. Just like when I lived in North Carolina, and then in Hawaii people were always asking me if I had to fight of bears in Montana. Even got asked once if I had to worry about Native Americans lol. But thats ok, it makes sense when a person has no experience in a environment to have fears that may or may not have any grounding in reality.
The majority of us out there sailing aren't in waters where security is a concern. Our safety is dependant on a well maintained boat and good knowledge of the sea and the waters we are sailing or cruising.
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Old 11-02-2011, 13:28   #72
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More power to you. Ballet is freaking hard work.
Especially for a 200 pounder!
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Old 11-02-2011, 13:29   #73
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Hahaha. Well I got down to about 165 when I was training, but still I was like 8 times bigger than most the other boys.
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Old 11-02-2011, 18:32   #74
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G'DAy all,

Some specific data: Pepper spray is prohibited in Australia, and will be confiscated by Customs when clearing in. Also Tasers and other electro-shock weapons. Also "flick-knives" (switchblades to us Yanks). Also (this is a bit silly IMO) slingshots or brass knuckles. From memory, a very similar set of prohibitions is in effect in NZed.

Now, many will point out that these items (exclusive of the deadly slingshot perhaps) could be hidden or disguised, and thus not be confiscated, and this is certainly true. But, should one then actually use such things in anger, one is definitely on the wrong side of the law, and severe penalties do apply. Likely worse than the penalties that would apply to a common thief ripping your boat off.

May be illogical to the American point of view, but it is how things are.

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Old 11-02-2011, 18:34   #75
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Here is an accident with bear spray that a poster to another non-sailing related forum (actually a hunting, fishing, trapping and firearms forum) had today.

After I got through wiping my tears from eyes from laughing, I got to thinking.... damn... that stuff probably works!
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