Seen various people say to never use a phone/tablet for navigation. Why?

[ks2cs2]

I have used Iphones, Ipads, Raymarine MFD's, etc. and my preferred way is the inexpensive Samsung Tab A7 (~$200) linked via bluetooth to a Garmin Glo 2 ($100) running Navionics. I'm an Ipad/Iphone guy, but the Tab A7 in the way I am using it is perfect for my use (my first Android and I am impressed). The tablet is not too big or too small for the cockpit and it is solely dedicated for navigation (I use my Iphone and Ipad for normal comms, emails, etc.). I have used a Bad Elf receiver and was not completely satisfied. The Garmin Glo 2 has been much more stable than the Bad Elf and, because it was so inexpensive, I bought another one as backup. I have chartered boats in multiple places (and own a Leopard 45 in Belize) and the system I have evolved to has worked quite well even in very remote, off the grid locations. In addition, it is completely portable and transferable to another vessel. The MFD's that I found on most boats do not appear to have the level of detail that I need to navigate. Navionics with the Sonar Chart mode turned on has given me the level of detail to safely navigate the very challenging reefs of Belize.

[PirateBarnabus]

I managed to get from Portugal to Gibraltar then to the Caribbean and South America using tablet and phone.
Using Android and Navionics.
No problem at all.

I also have a WiFi radar. It's a Furuno that works with an ipad mini. I bought 2 They both failed within a year.
For me, Apple is not it and Furuno never made the radar android compatible.

So the issue is really about where you can and can't trust Navionics rather than how you view the charts

For me it's great and I find out about chart issues before going to a new area to find out what can and can't be trusted.

[hgd137]

This spring I traveled the ICW starting by using a new ipad with an internal gps. I used the ipad since it was the only way I could use the Aquamap navigation software since it is compatible with Apple's IOS software. The AquaMap software is a must for transiting the ICW. I found that the gps in the ipads was very unreliable. Positional accuracy on the ICW is rather important because you are in narrow channels where 10s of feet make a difference. I completed the trip with my older ipad taped to my windshield, my new ipad plus my Axiom 9 with Navionics software, together, allowed me to quess where I was by interpreting the reported positions! Good Luck!!

[PirateBarnabus]

Originally Posted by hgd137

This spring I traveled the ICW starting by using a new ipad with an internal gps. I used the ipad since it was the only way I could use the Aquamap navigation software since it is compatible with Apple's IOS software. The AquaMap software is a must for transiting the ICW. I found that the gps in the ipads was very unreliable. Positional accuracy on the ICW is rather important because you are in narrow channels where 10s of feet make a difference. I completed the trip with my older ipad taped to my windshield, my new ipad plus my Axiom 9 with Navionics software, together, allowed me to quess where I was by interpreting the reported positions! Good Luck!!

Yeah, that confirms it for me. Apple sucks. They're OK for trendy man bun and beard types designing websites in a tree house in South America.
But I'd stick with Samsung if I were you.
(No hate mail please from Apple cult followers.)

[mcon12000]

I use multiple iPads and iPhones linked to a Garmin glo. Works great and I’m not day sailing I covered 3k miles in the last ten months. Screen brightness can be an issue and keeping an iPad charging at a rate higher than what it’s consuming can be a challenge.

I’m planning on buying a dedicated plotter this year so my autopilot and other instruments will be more effective.

[Linesledaft]

I have been using an iPad in a waterproof case with iNavX for the last year, including a couple 1200nm trips. No real issues. Sometimes if the screen gets too wet it can be hard to use, but I haven't came across a touchscreen yet that didn’t suffer this.

I also have an older iPhone down below running the same software as well. No issues.

Additionally I have a Garmin plotter running in the cockpit that hardly ever gets looked at.

I was told the same thing by a few people, but those same people also have spent thousands on plotters.

Eventually I will get a decent plotter, but my iPad and iPhone have been just fine so far.

[plittle2005]

I navigated using the old original Canadian charts for 6 cruises thru the North Channel of Georgian Bay, in the '90's.



Noted buoy numbers, counted islands, watched for surface ripples indicating rock piles.


Never hit nuthin'! Except a lot of nervous anxiety!


Then I got Navionics ($30) on my iPhone 7s. Wow!



So easy, it MUST be a tool of the devil!


So send me to hell, satan, but I'll have recorded the track getting there!

[Happ]

Originally Posted by Joh.Ghurt

Never use them is overstating it.

Phones and tablets have annoying limitations which can make it practically unusable. For other - like me - I can live with them. Here are the major problems:

• Phones and Tablets overheat if used in the sun for prolonged time. Leave your phone out in the sun with the app running and you can be certain, I'll go into thermal shutdown. This makes them a bad choice for navigation from the helm. Regular chartplotter have this solved.
• The screen of phones and tablets don't have much contrast. Try to read something on your tablet in bright sunlit. It just doesn't work. This makes them pretty unusable as a display at the helm. Regular chartplotter try to have extra-bright displays dealing better with sunlight. This explains partially why chartplotter are so expensive.
• Some of the software really sucks when interacting with the power-saving features of the OS. Nothing beats the OS deciding it needs to turn off the screen while app is running. Some provider solve this better and are quicker to fix their program when Apple or Google decide to implement yet another power-saving scheme to make the battery last longer.
• When you use the phone or tablet for navigation, you can't use it as a phone, update your Instagram or watch Netflix. Even if theoretically possible, in reality don't even consider it.
• Waterproofing. If you use your phone or tablet at the helm, you need to have it connected to the power outlet and the whole combo should be mounted and waterproof. This can add to a simple solution costs.
• Some people found the night mode on phones and tablets still too bright. For me, this wasn't an issue up to now.

Using a tablet (phone is too small for me) as the only chart plotter I found it ok that the tablet stays inside at the navigation desk and I don't have a display at the helm. This is in line with my 40 year old boat. It's important to have a WIFI providing NMEA-data to the navigation app. The ship GPS is a lot better than the internal GPS of the tablet / phone.

Also very important is to plan for a backup. Should the phone or the wifi fail, know how you navigate. Things like paper charts and the GPS-display and AIS on the VHF go a long way.

I have good friends who have been cruising for over a decade from South America to the NE. There backup is a 10yr old small screen chart plotter. They use Open CP on a computer at the Nav station and an iPad with Navionics on a bracket under the dodger. I spent a month onboard and it works fine.

[Bmorgan562]

Originally Posted by Duxa

Hey all,

I am early in the sailing journey, just finishing up ASA 101 and plan to charter a bunch of boats before buying my own (and take at least ASA 103, and probably 104 before then).

I installed OpenCPN (not a fan), and also got Navionics app for phone/tablet (am a fan).

Seeing how Id be sailing a bunch of different boats through the charter, and on the cheap low end Catalina 30's from mid 80's they dont even have nav equipment (or its non functioning). What should I use for nav?

Why are tablet/phone charts not trusted? Is it an issue with trusting the hardware to not fail in a marine environment? If so, then how can a laptop or Rpi be trusted? Those are definitely not IP6X like modern phones/tablets.

I am generally good as far as locating myself on a paper map, but having a GPS overlay update every second seems like it is always a better option (even if using a cheap Chinese tablet with poor GPS chip). Especially in an ocean with no landmarks.

So I am curious as to why people say to never use a phone/tablet for navigation. To me, as someone new to sailing it sounds alien, almost like someone telling me to never use my phone to navigate roads (driving directions).

40 years ago, when chart plotters came out, did ole sailors say not to trust a computer and use paper charts instead? If electrical fails you are screwed! Which is true for phones/tablets as well (once the battery runs out), but I think chart plotters are generally considered a trusted source for charting these days?

Of course having redundancy is very important, but this almost solves itself, unless you are single handing, everyone has a phone. Some have a phone AND a tablet. And even if single handing the low barrier of $50 for an Android device allows you to throw an extra one in a Pelican case with some silica in case you need it.

Looking forward to the discussion. Thanks!

I have no treasure trove of sailing experience , but I know of several people, Andy of 59 north for one who utilize IPad with the program navionics, but he also is proficient in celestial, so to answer your question , I believe what you are hearing from people is to not solely rely on an a ipad, tablet, chart plotter etc. have redundancy. My favorite rule when you can’t remember the rules of the road…. Just don’t hit anything.

[Leo Ticheli]

At the helm, I have an Axiom, which I use for Radar, AIS, and to insure that my iPad running Aqua Charts & Navionics are in agreement with the Axiom. We also follow along with paper charts. Under the Bimini, even as far south as Cuba, I've never had a problem with screen brightness, nor a failure of any kind. On the Atlantic ICW, I rely on Bob423's tracks on Aqua Charts on the iPad.

For dire emergencies, which we have yet to experience, we have GPS on the VHF, a hand-held Garmin, a second Raymarine below, a spare iPad, and a couple of iPhones with charts.

I actually prefer the look of the charts on the iPad screen to the Axiom.

Fair winds.

[CaptnKen]

My 2 cents....
I currently have a Samsung Tab A which is my primary. I use it for nearly everything. My AIS connects with wifi and my in reach connects with bluetooth. I keep it plugged in continuously. It is well protected from weather however if need be I will wrap it in saranwrap. I've used this configuration for years with no problems.
And on another note: on a delivery several years ago the charging system went out. So for low voltage navigation we used a cellphone.
Bottom line for me is backup backup backup.

[Bluechart]

Always have multiple sources or navigation.

I use chartplotter, and IPad, and computer with a GPS puck plugged into USB port, and paper charts of the area.

Lightning will likely fry the chart plotter, we put the iPad and computer in our ocean when we are in the vicinity of lightning.

Once when we were on another boat, whose chart plotter got “hung up”, it was not updating our position , we navigated to a harbor, and thru the breakwater in dense fog using an iPhone!

An iPad and IPhone will also display AIS targets using MarineTraffic or other AIS app.

[betwys1]

Originally Posted by BillKny

You gotta love the internet..

This is 100% wrong if you are using a REAL navigating charting application. No internet connection is required. Navionics, iSailor, and many others.

If you are navigating on the water with google maps, well, you get what you pay for.

I am not a fan of a tablet as my primary navigation tool, but this is making up issues that just do not exist.

In the flight context, an iPad and moving map application can serve well, remembering the solar input on the windshield will cut the display on a hot day and be miserably inadequate under direct sunshine. I prefered a remote GPS bug to a STRATUX ADI-in to display via WiFi (some) air traffic on possible conflicting tracks & altitudes. These are the same issues I see facing marine navigators, without the marine corrosion element.

[sv_pelagia]

Originally Posted by ks2cs2

The MFD's that I found on most boats do not appear to have the level of detail that I need to navigate. Navionics with the Sonar Chart mode turned on has given me the level of detail to safely navigate the very challenging reefs of Belize.

I can't speak about Navionics' "Sonar Charts" in Belize, but here in British Columbia waters, the sonar charts are mostly garbage, not based on any reality (being interpolations from more widely spaced soundings on official CHS charts).

[CAVOK]

Over the last few years I’ve used everything that is available. I have 2 chartplotters that are excellent, but I back them up up with a simple Navionics Premium package on my iPhone & iPad. I have Windy and and a simple Anchorwatch App on my phone. Even carry a larger scale planning chart.
My basic understanding is that GPS accuracy is below 10 metres and recently is closer to 2-3 metres regardless of your unit. Galileo is even better.
Just use what makes you happy and allows you to sleep at night.