Paper Charts or Just Electronic

[SV Windrush II]

haha this is the battle of the century.
I was trained on paper and had to pass some serious charting tests to get my Masters USCG Captains license. Before I crossed the Pacific I spent a ton of money on paper charts for the whole way. I planned my route with them in Seattle, put them back in the sealed tubes and never used them since. That was 5 years ago.
Never had my electronics fail but its nice to know I have them just in case I need them.

I kind of chuckle when people still insist that electronics is not dependable or accurate. When overlaid with Google earth images, they are more accurate than paper because you can actually see the bottom along with seeing the depth numbers.
When navigating shallow water and winding though reefs, you have no time to check your paper. By the time you figure out whats going on with paper you will be stuck on the reef. If you chart it in advance, you better be deadly accurate on paper. I would rather see what I am doing in real time and make corrections on the fly.
After single handed sailing through many reef passes and narrow channels, I have everything on, GPS Charts, radar, depth, and looking at the water color. No time to mess around with paper charts.
I have been though narrow channels at night that I would never try doing without electronics.
Just my 2 cents

[waterman46]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

You simply need to zoom in closer. It’s standard procedure, or should be, to zoom in close and double back over your entire course track to check for things like a “huge rock” before allowing the boat to track on auto pilot.

Your mistake... not the chart.

I know what you mean about the zooming in. And I usually do zoom in to a fairly close range on a regular basis, along and in general area of my intended course. Like radar, you need to use several ranges to get the full picture. When I get back to my boat in November, I will check again to see if that rock is more visible on a lower scale and not obliterated by text.

In any case, my experience has shown it is much better to use both electronic and paper charts.

[lordgeoff]

Originally Posted by Mike Banks

I carry both.

Do you use both...

[lordgeoff]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

We have paper charts of all the locations we cruise, but haven’t used them in over six years for navigation purposes, just for an overview, but less and less.

I’d be fine with just our electronic charts which has 12x redundancy will all the devices. There’s much finer detail on the electronic charts, especially the Navionics Platinum+, than on paper. I can’t see how anyone who uses both can possibly disagree on that point.

We toured a modern US Navy cruiser three months ago in So Cal.... only electronic charts aboard according the the officer giving the tour.

I zoom in to the max of the electronic chart along my route and insert a red alert on anything that is going to hole my hull or take out the keel or rudder Regardless of the zoom these markers remain visible so it makes it idiot proof to remember the points along my route that can cause me grief.

[IslandHopper]

Originally Posted by lordgeoff

Do you use both...

Well i do, is that supposed to be unusual or something.....?

[bensolomon]

I use paper charts for course and trip plotting as well as navigation because it is tradition and connects me to my sailing ancestors.

I also have an iPad with isailor as my chart plotter at the binnacle, though.

[donradcliffe]

Originally Posted by GordMay

The Navy uses a compliant Electronic Chart Display and Information Systems (ECDIS) for electronic navigation.
Are your plotters ECDIS compliant?
How does your screen size compare with theirs?
I’m not denying the utility of recreational electronic nav’ systems.
However, I don’t believe they’re comparable to Naval ECDIS systems.

If I was the US navy, I wouldn't be bragging about how much my ECDIS system cost. The USS Guardian hit Tubbataha reef a few years back, partly because the most detailed chart level was 8.000 miles off! I say partly, because when the lookout reported a flashing white light in a different direction than where the chart said the lighthouse was, they shrugged their shoulders and steamed on at 15 knots.

Electronic charts and Google Earth have made it much easier to navigate. I remember coming into Niuatoputapu knowing that the paper chart was over a mile off, and today I can look at CM93, NZ charts, and Google Earth and they are singing the same tune. I would still never go in there without overhead sun, however. I have dove the wreck of the Golden Dawn, which tried it near sunset.

All in all, paper charts need to go the way of the buggy whip. I haven't looked at one in over 10 years.

[Don C L]

Huh?
Now I gotta get rid of my buggy whip too?

[a64pilot]

Years ago you used to see the Commercial pilots walking around in the airport with a big square suitcase, it was full of Jeppeson charts.
You haven’t seen that for years, they went fully electronic many years ago, just the workload of posting new changes to the paper charts every two weeks was ridiculous, electronic, hit update.

There will always be people who will refuse to convert, who will continue to navigate by the stars and maybe a DF, but some of us have gone over to electronic charts and GPS.

Of course logic would tell you to have more than one plotter, computer, IPad whatever for redundancy.

In fact I’d go so far as to say that the Nav Station has lost a lot of its usefulness.
I know I’ll get several upset with that comment, but what is a Nav station “needed” for? I bet my salon table is better for laying out charts.

[GrowleyMonster]

Both is seriously best. Electronic only maybe, if you are on a teeny tiny boat. You should also know how to construct a plot sheet for your latitude. And as for electronics, you need full redundancy. That means two machines each with different power source and or charging apparatus. I like my Samsung Note 3's of which I own four. A Raspberry Pi and a 7 inch screen with a USB GPS puck works great too. Got one of them all set up.

[Pizzazz]

Electronic only. Many benefits over paper charts. If you need a bigger size for passage planning, connect your favorite device (Android phone) to a large screen TV showing all the detail. If you are worried about losing power, carry a couple spare phones with electronic charts and fully charged batteries. The test, as with everything on the boat, is if you have not used them last six months, and they do not have dual purpose, get rid of them.

If you do not like this argument, consider commercial shipping. They have switched to all electronic. If it is good enough for them, it is good enough for me. But some people may feel differently.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

. . . In fact I’d go so far as to say that the Nav Station has lost a lot of its usefulness.
I know I’ll get several upset with that comment, but what is a Nav station “needed” for? I bet my salon table is better for laying out charts.

It depends on how you sail. We've discussed this a few times in the past.


If you do any actual navigation or passage planning, whether you do it with paper or electronically, it is immensely helpful to have a proper dedicated place to do it, especially if you have other people on board who may be relaxing or eating or whatever, while you're working. I sometimes spend a few hours planning a passage -- depending on the complexity of the waters.


If you just point and shoot and follow the dot on the plotter, then naturally you don't need a nav station. And I'm not being disparaging -- if you're just knocking around familiar waters, then point and shoot might be ok.


But I for one spend most waking hours not spent on deck, at the nav station. That's the nerve center of the boat, for me. For the kind of sailing I do, I could not manage without it. YMMV.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Pizzazz

. . . If you do not like this argument, consider commercial shipping. They have switched to all electronic. If it is good enough for them, it is good enough for me. But some people may feel differently.

Playing the devil's advocate -- commercial vessels are not using Android phones connected to TV's. Not all electronic charting is the same.



I am mostly electronic myself, but one has to keep in mind the limitations of vector charts on small screens (or TV's). In order to see all the detail you need to see to properly plan a passage, and avoid doing a Team Vestas or U.S.S. Guardian, you need a big screen, and you need either raster charts or you need to use vector charts carefully, zooming in to a sufficient degree along the whole route.

[a64pilot]

You really don’t need a large screen, or aircraft couldn’t be flown as they are usually restricted screen size to at least as small as many plotters.

Now back in the day to plan flights we would spread out sectional charts on the floor, tape them together, draw the course line and make lines 5 km to either side and note highest obstacles, highlight power lines, radio towers etc.

Then about 1990 or so we started “flying” the mission on a computer using I believe it was called Falcon View?

Anyway the laying out the charts exercise has good training value, but really isn’t necessary today.

We will continue to disagree of course, but it is the 21st Century now and had been for quite sometime, there are better ways.

Yep, it was Flacon View, never knew it was Ga. Tech though
https://youtu.be/dIZDR8h1fmA

[a64pilot]

This is a screen shot of a Motion tablet that I used to mount on my instrument panel on my little Maule, you can’t really tell there too much but it has every instrument approach plate, every sectional chart etc., and everything is Geo referenced, way better than charts, much, much better.
Snapfish is monetized now so the only way I can get my pictures is to screen shot them I guess