No More Passage Planning on New Garmins?

[clearsea]

My question was about simplicity and expense of setting up for passage planning using a laptop to plan, and a chartplotter at the helm to navigate under way in my particular low-cost small-boat situation. To summarize, presuming I've got all this right now:

• Many people appear to be satisfied with the passage planning they can do directly on a Garmin chartplotter, and do not feel the need to plan on a laptop.
• Whether or not a person uses a laptop to plan, being able to set up new waypoints or look at the intended track ahead on the fly is important, and the Garmins allow that.
• Garmin makes excellent hardware and echarts. We just bought a Nuvi for the car, and I love my old 76C. The new chartplotters are very attractive, but my personal preference is to find a way to simplify passage planning using a laptop (call me quirky).
• If a person really wants to passage plan with a laptop and cannot get preloaded charts from a chartplotter to laptop, they can make their waypoints and routes on alternative software and a second set of echarts on the laptop, and transfer the waypoints and routes to a Garmin chartplotter. That facility has always been there in Garmin products, to my knowledge, and is still there now.
• C-Map offers an alternative solution that seems to allow a mechanism for using the C-Map echart cartridge on a laptop to passage plan, and then upload the waypoints and routes to the C-Map chartplotter using a blank C-map cartridge. The total cost of this option is not that low relative to Garmin options, is not as slick as USB transfer, and requires transfer using cards that have to be plugged in and out, and carried to and from the boat.

Thanks everyone, very helpful. To each their own, and best wishes to those trying to deliver this technology for us. Fair winds.

[Joli]

not sure if anyonme mentioned it but you could slave your laptop to a sunlight readable weatherproof monitor. ~$1k

[Badsanta]

I looked into a slave sunlight readable weatherproof monitor and the whole chartplotter was half the cost or more, and not even close to the $1k closer to $3-5K monitor.

[Amgine]

Well, depends on the size and the quality.

The TT-840, for example, is 2300 CDN, but it's nearly bullet-proof, runs on 12v, and is also a touch screen. The Sanyo weather-proof monitors start at about $3k, but that's a 32" screen. I don't think I've got a spot for that in my cockpit.... I suspect someone out there has a less-than-military-grade weather-proof sunlight readable monitor for less than either of these, but I'm not going looking for it. I know that for a slight ethical cost there's a tool available via torrent which can unlock Garmin charts.

[Badsanta]

Much better price. The one I found was $3k for a 12 inch. I just stoped looking. Thanks

[Badsanta]

Originally Posted by Amgine

Well, depends on the size and the quality.

The TT-840, for example, is 2300 CDN, but it's nearly bullet-proof, runs on 12v, and is also a touch screen. .

That thing is $2295 for an 8" ! Ill just buy a chartplotter.

[Lancerbye]

Two years ago I got a Garmin 2010c Chart Plotter for $1500CAD. I have the Blue chart software and a Garmin 60cs as a back up. I do play and plan on the lap top with Mapsource or nRoute. I have the ability of planning on the laptop and transferring maps, waypoints, and routes via a card reader /writer for the Garmin 2010. The reality, though I had intended to do my planning on the laptop I usually plan on the plotter making up short routes that can be linked. Then I adjust the waypoints on the go.

[Amgine]

Yah. ::chuckles:: I got the full quote for the unit; comes to a touch north of $2500 Canadian. The benefit is it's a full resolution touch screen in your cockpit that's bright lit - so, brighter than just daylight viewable. And anything you can do on your computer can be done on this screen - with my software I can run AIS/radar/GRIB overlaying my charting software/GPS plus instrumentation, or I could pop in a DVD, video game, e-mail, or surf Cruiser's Forum. Heck, video conference back home, assuming I have a broadband connection and a digital camera.

So, there are a few benefits to this unit over just a chart plotter.

Price isn't one of them. The company builds to purpose, so they build a custom unit just for your application. They have little 12v DC PCs that can be mounted to the screen, including a fanless unit that is *almost*, but not quite, sealed. I spoke with them about the possibility of a sealed weather-proof computer they're working on, but it's not quite ready for real-world testing in such challenging environments as the ocean yet. The fanless guy almost got me - I could mount it below and just slave it to the monitor, and have a regular flat screen monitor below, but I don't actually have a dedicated navigation space to put it in.

The point is, it's *almost* realistic and affordable to have a weather proof monitor in the cockpit, a weather proof computer either also in the cockpit or below. And maybe for someone in a slightly bigger tax bracket it is possible. It's something to keep in mind for the near future.

[Highlander40]

Computers and boats are great for a while--- and buying the first gen unit NO WAY. My last chart plotter was a Northstar 961. It had a remote computer driving the display. Over 9 years of use , replaced the motherboard and hard drive and finally the GPS part got flakey and it couldn't allways get a fix. Don't get me wrong, the concept was great and they were a decade ahead of everyone else BUT the reliability is not the same as a single purpose one piece unit.
The other problem with a full-on computer that is used for a lot of tasks is system stability. Don't even bother to say that they have improved sooo much. As the hardware gets better the apps get harder to run and computers are still shakey for navigation.
At least Northstar, 10 years ago had the smarts to lock the system so it's only job was to run the nav software.
Good luck!

[clearsea]

Update: Apparently Garmin has released "HomePort", software that allows a user to passage-plan on a PC without having to purchase a second set of electronic charts. However, I am not sure how that would work with a Garmin chartplotter that comes preloaded with BlueCharts. This page says one can simply download them to an SD card: https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?pID=64242

[Not Sure]

Originally Posted by Tempest245

The Op asked a technical question of how to transfer routes from a laptop to a chartplotter which is a valid question, and a challenge given the proprietary nature of todays charting software and hardware I, for one, am interested in how people have solved this.

The argument for or against electronic route planning, or paper vs electronics has been explored in great detail on the site. Route planning is just that a Plan, whether it's done on paper charts, on a laptop, or chartlotter. Just because someone chooses to plan on a laptop, doesn't mean they blindly follow that plan or turn on the autopilot and take a nap. An electronic plan, just like any other plan can be adjusted to the conditions. I don't think anyone expects their plan to work like clockwork all the time regardless of the tools used. Electronics are robust planning and tools that have firmly established themselves in navigation, in a similar way that CAD has established itself as the standard in design and construction. Except, in electronic charting we have proprietary hurdles to jump.

Garmin is well-known for locking it's users into expensive proprietary formats that can't easily be moved to other devices, except to other 'compatible' Garmin devices. Other manufacturers of late aren't much better. The solution as I see it is to withhold $$$ from those companies by refusing to purchase their products as much as possible, and instead use the readily available free/open source solutions and free (in the USA) downloadable NOAA maps that your tax dollars already pay for (which are sold to Garmin et al, and simply repackaged and sold back to you at high prices).

SeaClearII works great on laptops and netbooks, for example. There are other solutions and software out there free for the downloading. All that is required is your own initiative.

[RaySea Lady]

Originally Posted by clearsea

Update: Apparently Garmin has released "HomePort", software that allows a user to passage-plan on a PC without having to purchase a second set of electronic charts. However, I am not sure how that would work with a Garmin chartplotter that comes preloaded with BlueCharts. This page says one can simply download them to an SD card: https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?pID=64242

Don't know which plotter you have, I have a 5212 and the recent update to version 5.3 software (you can download for free on the garmin site) gives me the option to download maps from the plotter to SD cards. That option is under User Data. I beleive that is the way that you will transfer your maps and G2 vision data to your laptop to use with homeport.

[Highlander40]

Having been through the software / hardware jungle involved with route planning offsite, I found that the whole thing is better when the chart plotter on the boat is large enough and good enough to do all the waypoint and route creation onboard. A 10 or 12 inch screen is great. Save some money, put it into a chart plotter that you WANT to use and forget the extra cost of software /hardware that will become obsolete in no time.

One thing that I do find to be a wonderful tool at home or work is active captain. Totally web based with charts, sat. photos, maps and user reviews of anchorages and marinas. Use from any computer.

[RaySea Lady]

Originally Posted by Highlander40

Having been through the software / hardware jungle involved with route planning offsite, I found that the whole thing is better when the chart plotter on the boat is large enough and good enough to do all the waypoint and route creation onboard. A 10 or 12 inch screen is great. Save some money, put it into a chart plotter that you WANT to use and forget the extra cost of software /hardware that will become obsolete in no time.

One thing that I do find to be a wonderful tool at home or work is active captain. Totally web based with charts, sat. photos, maps and user reviews of anchorages and marinas. Use from any computer.

Not sure if I would agree with that.

For me, there is no comparison as to the time required to do a 50 point route. It can be done in about 10 minutes on the computer but would take over an hour on my 12" plotter. All my routes, tracks, points etc... are stored on an 8gig SD chip (as well as all my garmin maps now) and the only inconvenience is to copy it down to the chip before I shut down the plotter and take it home with me. No biggy, and whenever I have the time to work on routes or dream about trips I don't have to go to the boat to do it, I can do it at home or even on the road on my laptop.

Just a convenience and preference I guess, and yes, active captain is a great resource.

[Highlander40]

I guess that's why I don't have a garmin. The menu structure is a bit clunky. On my old Northstar or the new Raymarine, a 50 point route is 10 or 15 min. It's really more to do with work flow and efficient use of key strokes. Ten years ago I did have a Garmin, they still haven't figured it out.