Missing 75´s.y. Lady Domina

[madsb]

Originally Posted by europaflyer

You came here asking for help, you got it. Blue Pelican reported overhearing VHF conversation on 2/3 May. Your Norwegian thread seems to imply that the VHF conversation has been confirmed by USCG?

"Venter fremdeles paa svar fra Even Vinge som ringte kystvakten paa Puerto Rico,og om de har bekreftet VHF kontakten med Lady Domina den 2/3 mai."

Translating to:

"Still waiting for a response from Even Vinge who called the Coast Guard at Puerto Rico, and they have confirmed VHF contact with Lady Domina on 2/3 May."

Edit: Missed Monstads post.

But this is via Google Translate, because none of us speak Norwegian. Trying to glean information from a thread in a foreign language only adds to the misinformation and confusion from people who know nothing about the incident. I might be guilty of this myself, but at least I was able to correct your fuel consumption estimate based on my knowledge of marine diesel engines, which is surely the sort of help you came here for? What more do you want?

This thread has provided you with the only real lead; the VHF contact 10 days ago, which if confirmed would prove that this whole thing is a storm in a teacup. Calling the people who you asked for help 'ignorant bigots' with a 'lust for entertainment' is perhaps a little rude.

While not being a native norwegian speaker, I'm fairly confident in telling you that this is wrongly translated. (As a native danish speaker I'm able to read norwegian pretty easily.) What it says is:

"Still waiting for a response from Even Vinge who called the Coast Guard at Puerto Rico, to hear if they confirmed having a VHF contact with Lady Domina on 2/3 May."

In other words they have still not been proven to be alive and well.

[europaflyer]

Originally Posted by Astrid

I am with Barnakiel on this one. It is about 2200nm from St Maartin to the Azores. If the captain maintained a relatively decent course and a 4 - 5 kt average speed, then 40 - 50 days would be a good ball park figure for such a trip. As has been pointed out before, lack of wind, or adverse winds might make it a longer trip still.

I agree. I think people have got a little carried away here. I've trawled through the Norwegian thread using Google Translate, and there's nothing there that there isn't here - misinformation, conjecture and lots of groundless concern. The best I can gather is that they are waiting for the USCG to review recordings of 3/4 May to conform the contact. Let's just take things down a notch or two until we get the news, and remember that every post we've seen here is just someone trying to help...

[gjordan]

It is a little embarrasing to tell of my first passage from Bermuda to the Virgins. I was headed the whole way and ended up in Antigua. I arrived during the charter boat show, and the lines for the only telephone in English Harbor were 20 people deep. My dear old mother went into a somewhat wine induced panic and called the CG and reported me overdue on a passage to the Virgins. Of course they did not call it over the radio in Antigua so I knew nothing about it. It was about 10 days before the lines went down at the phone, and I called home and found a frantic mother. I would not at all be surprised if a misinformed relative started this whole thing on unrealistic expectations. The ocean doesnt give a rip about arrival dates. I think ( I hope) it will all turn out OK. _____Grant.

[David_Old_Jersey]

So, no one onboard filed a decent Passage (Float) Plan with anyone onshore (not sure when folks ashore started getting worried - a week after departure? )

In which case, they were all (Skipper and Crew) saying to everyone ashore (freinds, family and officialdom) we will see ya when we see ya. TBH that is to me fair enuf on principle , the risks are of course that:-

a) they sink and no one presses the big red button for them, at least not in sufficient time to be of any use.

or

b) that someone ashore presses the big red button out of fear and ignorance - when they are perfectly happily floating around, or are on a Plan B involving a bar and some beer .

Whether it is prudent to have not done so is a matter of personal choice, and likely as much to do with how skittish folks are back home / how tied to the apron strings the folks on the boats are. For some "out of contact and lost" is within 5 minutes of a missed daily phonecall. and for them perhaps not mentioning the voyage at all may be the most prudent thing!

But the harsh reality is that even with a decent Passage (Float) Plan notified to folks onshore (in this case seems timescale of a couple of months, plus or minus a month ) that the odds are strong that by the time anyone has a genuine reason to be worried that folks will long ago have gone glug. Of course having a daily contact could change that radically, but nonetheless a simple loss of communication is not an unexpected possibility for reasons that might be a PITA but are not life threatening and IMO that is in itself not a reason to launch a full scale SAR operation "just in case"......whether it is possible to communicate that situation as to be expected and that it carries risk to folks ashore is a seperate matter. for some it probably won't be acceptable.

And of course for some being on a boat or away from shore is entirely about not marching to the drum of those onshore - could well be that is the case here, or could simply be little thought gone into the venture..........

[foolishsailor]

I can share a personal story involving some of our friends from South Africa and a misunderstanding that could be the same as what is happening with the Lady Domina...

When we were rebuilding our boat over a two year period in South Africa there were several other boats in the same process - we all became quite close and managed to finish during the same period within a couple of months. I was the last to leave.

We were all heading to Brazil via St. Helena.

So the first boat to leave goes off and it is a retired married couple - the guy is a RYA Yachtmaster Instrcutor and they boath have many many ocean miles so they were not inexperienced.

Basically they make it to St. Helena with no real problems - the usual low came off Namibia and gave em a bashing - but all is well. They then leave St. Helena for Rio. Their "float plan" is to tell their family and friends that they are sailing to Rio and emailed them on the day of their departure to let them know they were leaving. - to be honest most long distance cruisers that I know thats about all they really do re a float plan.

So...they never arrive.

Time passes and they never arrive.

People start to get worried - time passes...

No contact, they have SSB and Epirb - but no contact.

...alot of time passes...

SAR is launched - nothing is found. Cruisers from SA in Rio and surrounding areas are asked to look for them - nothing.

We are all now in mourning it has been months - I knew their grown kids and we all basically thought they were dead - likley run over by a ship.

So...more time passes and they suddenly arrive in Salvador, Brazil - 3 1/2 months after they were expected.

They had decided to head up to the Azores after they left St. Helena - and didnt think to tell anybody - and then sailed into Salvador instead of Rio.

edit: uggh meant Ascension not Azores - always mix the two names up...

One of their kids still wont speak to them after years now. I bumped into them and some other cruisers in Ilha Grande in Brazil once I arrived and asked him, "WTF?"

He just shrugged his shoulders and didnt think it was a big deal.

Different strokes, different folks I guess.

[Sand crab]

Isn't this a steel boat? Those pieces look like FG. Apologies if someone already commented on this.

[Blue Crab]

Even the "ignorant bigotry" I reserve for the EPIRB system doesn't include the folks back home. What is awful about this story and others like it is that it's all so avoidable these days.

[whitenail]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

Isn't this a steel boat? Those pieces look like FG. Apologies if someone already commented on this.

the boat is fiberglass, with an iron keel to withstand collisions with containers.

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by foolishsailor

He just shrugged his shoulders and didnt think it was a big deal.

Different strokes, different folks I guess.

Many years back I used to spend extended time (6 months plus) down in SEA (sans boat!), usual MO was to jump on a plane with an open ticket and some unspecified plans (countries and timescale) and maybe send a postcard back "home", but usually not .

That worked fine for me over several years and I thought also for everyone else (the less yer know the happier yer be ). But one year Father made the comment that if I dissapeared he would have one helluva time when he came down to try and discover what fate had befallen me......that intention was a bit of a surprise to yours truly!, but was also a surprise to him when I explained that perhaps better of not going down to turn over any stones as whatever trouble I had gotten myself into was very likely to have been hard earned and self inflicted , and a fair to middling chance that enquiries would not be entirely welcomed......

......obviously all that a bit different from the usual boat related stuff , but nonetheless I guess goes to show that assumptions (on WTF those "at home" will do when left to own devices ) should not be made. Of course the one time I later actually left him my telephone contact number he used it - never answer the phone at 3am, it's never good news .

[hellosailor]

"Looks like there is a liferaft in a canister on the davits"
I would note that liferafts in exposed places, typically on a foredeck or at the mast, have often been reported washed off in a storm. One exposed up on the davits could be easily expected to break away in a storm or if a boat went down, so the absence of a life raft found at sea, suggests it is still on those davits and presumably on the boat, still afloat somewhere.

Some years ago I missed a trip from the USVI back to Beaufort and since I couldn't make it, held the float plan. Trip was estimated at 10 days, with 14 being "overdue" and on the 13th night my friend's wife called to ask if I'd heard anything yet. We started preparing for a SAR call but at noon on Day 14 she got a phone call. They had had adverse wx, early alternator failure, etc, and wound up in the only convenient port they could make. Jacksonville, FL, well off course and rather late, but safe and sound.

It's a boat. Boats go overdue. If they go without comms and sails...Worry may be in order but the bigger question is probably how much food and fresh water they had on board, in case all propulsion broke down and they're simply adrift someplace.

[Cormorant]

Much more troubling is the fact that Grain de Soleil is still missing, after activating their EPIRB on April 27.

Team2Choc seems to be more in the Lady Domina category -- no one exactly sure when he left and when he's due.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Cormorant

Much more troubling is the fact that Grain de Soleil is still missing, after activating their EPIRB on April 27.

well given the wreckage found , it doesn't look good for Grain de Soleil,

Dave

[Cormorant]

I thought that the families of the Grain de Soleil crew said the wreckage doesn't match the boat? (Though they're both sky blue. . . .)

Also, they were thought to possibly have taken to a life raft . . . which implies they had one.

And the first EPIRB transmission was 4/24, the last 4/27 -- so it wasn't some instantaneous disaster that took down both vessel and life raft in one fell swoop.

Pretty scary to think that with an EPIRB and a life raft, in a fairly well-traveled area, rescue is not always possible.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Cormorant

I thought that the families of the Grain de Soleil crew said the wreckage doesn't match the boat? (Though they're both sky blue. . . .)

Also, they were thought to possibly have taken to a life raft . . . which implies they had one.

And the first EPIRB transmission was 4/24, the last 4/27 -- so it wasn't some instantaneous disaster that took down both vessel and life raft in one fell swoop.

Pretty scary to think that with an EPIRB and a life raft, in a fairly well-traveled area, rescue is not always possible.

well I dont know

heres a picture of teh original yacht,

[hellosailor]

There HAVE been EPIRB failures. Possibly the most well-documented was a batch of ACR's some years back, when the "TEST" button produced a green OK light, but the transmitter actually was not powered up at all.

A good reason to mistrust any EPIRB unless it is one of the newer ones that actually do a live test message through the satellite system, so you KNOW for a fact that it has transmitted.

Of course if the EPIRB is safely below deck and you are run down, it will never get a chance to surface and transmit anyhow. But if it is one deck, even in a commercial release, sometimes they leak (I've seen then with water in them) or get swept away.