Missing 75´s.y. Lady Domina

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

There HAVE been EPIRB failures. Possibly the most well-documented was a batch of ACR's some years back, when the "TEST" button produced a green OK light, but the transmitter actually was not powered up at all.

A good reason to mistrust any EPIRB unless it is one of the newer ones that actually do a live test message through the satellite system, so you KNOW for a fact that it has transmitted.

Of course if the EPIRB is safely below deck and you are run down, it will never get a chance to surface and transmit anyhow. But if it is one deck, even in a commercial release, sometimes they leak (I've seen then with water in them) or get swept away.

Maybe, still no reason not to carry and use one and failures are rare enough. 737s have had a few failures!, I still use them!

dave

[hellosailor]

"Maybe, still no reason not to carry and use one"
Now why would you ever go and think that way, Dave?
No one said it wasn't a reason to carry or use one. One said it was a reason to MISTRUST one. And logically, the answer to that is either carry one that can be tested, or at least carry two of the dumb kind. One fixed externally in a breakway mount, one stowed below.

Unless of course you're relying on speed for safety, in which case you get all that heavy junk off the boat.

[Sand crab]

New sat phone = $500. Activation and minutes about $200. I can afford 4000 liters or gallons of fuel but no sat phone. Hmmmmmm
BTW Used sat phones are cheaper.

[goboatingnow]

One said it was a reason to MISTRUST one. And logically, the answer to that is either carry one that can be tested, or at least carry two of the dumb kind. One fixed externally in a breakway mount, one stowed below.

I see no reason to 2nd guess major manufacturers, The ones that test, dont actually use the COSPAS-SARSAT system , so its a somewhat moot point. but sure carry two, there are cheap. But I see no reason to go on about the 'failure' rate, show us teh stats , I mean everything including your heart has a MTBF!!.

dave

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

New sat phone = $500. Activation and minutes about $200. I can afford 4000 liters or gallons of fuel but no sat phone. Hmmmmmm
BTW Used sat phones are cheaper.

I have an iridum phone and an account with Marconi satcoms, They activate and deactivate my phone FOC, bill me in dollars and at approx $1 a minute. no prepaids for me.

BUT I agree with you, some people have their head up their ar%e


Dave

[Astrid]

In the case of the Grain de Soliel, she was a fin keel design and had recently undergone repairs according to one source (although frustratingly enough what the repairs were was not stated). If she lost her keel, she could have gone down quickly leaving little time for crew to abandon ship. The distress beacon may have been automatically activated rather than manually by the crew. Besides the debris spotted in the area, an orange object was observed from the air according to a French news article. Unfortunately it does not state what the object was or how big, but it might, in my opinion, have been perhaps an undeployed or partially deployed life raft.

[JPA Cate]

FoolishSailor,

Yes indeed to your story posted above! In fact, the reported absence of SSB (if correct) sort of suggests folks who wanted to feel how it is when it's just you and the sea; free to change destinations according to whim, no serious schedules. And when they finally (as I hope they do) show up SOMEwhere, they may even feel shocked and embarrassed to learn they were the objects of so much furore.

I guess one lesson in all this is that those of us who go out of sight of land for days or weeks at a time share a duty of kindness to let those who care about us know at least upon completion of a voyage. Maybe that's exactly the situation on the Lady Domina. They're still out there playing. And if they're not, there's not much more anyone seated at a computer in the US can do about that. People on the route from the Caribbean to the Azores were notified prior to 27 April to be on the lookout for her.

We've seen plenty of posts indicating that the overdue report was quite possibly made too soon. That happened to us once. We were on route between Bora Bora and Hilo, and had expected an arrival around 8 a.m. Cruisers who should have known better, IMO, phoned the USCG and reported us overdue at 10 a.m. Cruiser time really isn't like that. IMO, they should have at least waited for the next day, after our ham schedule. It was really embarrassing! All that had happened was the wind dropped out. Fortunately no SAR had been mounted. Let's hope were looking at a similar situation now.

Ann

[Boracay]

I have "cleaned up this thread as the subject was too important for it to be closed.

Please do not make personal comments and reread the "Be nice" rule if you are in any doubt as to what is acceptable.

If I have removed any important information either repost it or let me know.

[hellosailor]

Sand crab, how do you presume that if a boater NEEDS $5000+ worth of diesel fuel, that they will automatically have naother $700 on hand to buy a satphone?

Twenty years ago satphones didn't exist and EPIRBs were beyond most budgets. But we still bought fuel and went to sea.

So they made a choice, for whatever reason. I know folks who'd simply tell you you're nuts for going offshore and going to sleep on a tiny boat in the middle of the ocean no matter HOW it was equipped. They remember the Morro Castle being sunk, the Titanic, a long legacy of ships and deaths and to go to sea on a tiny sailboat? They'd call you nuts no matter how it was equipped.

It's all relative, isn't it?

[dacust]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

Sand crab, how do you presume that if a boater NEEDS $5000+ worth of diesel fuel, that they will automatically have naother $700 on hand to buy a satphone?

Twenty years ago satphones didn't exist and EPIRBs were beyond most budgets. But we still bought fuel and went to sea.

So they made a choice, for whatever reason. I know folks who'd simply tell you you're nuts for going offshore and going to sleep on a tiny boat in the middle of the ocean no matter HOW it was equipped. They remember the Morro Castle being sunk, the Titanic, a long legacy of ships and deaths and to go to sea on a tiny sailboat? They'd call you nuts no matter how it was equipped.

It's all relative, isn't it?

Dang, there you go getting reasonable and tolerant. You're gonna ruin a perfectly good opinionated brawl.

I have more than once heard people in this very forum say they didn't believe in having an EPIRB or tracking device because they didn't want any SAR personnel risking their lives. They wanted to accept the risk on their own, and would feel terribly guilty if someone else got hurt trying to save them.

Now, I'm not saying I could be like that, but I respect another persons right to feel that way themselves.

Does this mean the Domina folks felt this way? No. But I think it does mean that it's silly to berate them and call them irresponsible because someone who has seen a photo of the boat has speculated that it might be possible that they may or may not have had an EPIRB.

-dan

[Capt Phil]

Well done, Boracay! Thankless job... Cheers, Phil

[hellosailor]

Dan-
I can respect that line of thought, "they didn't believe in having an EPIRB or tracking device because they didn't want any SAR personnel risking their lives. "
The only problem is, not carrying the gear is going to accomplish the exact opposite, it is going to cause more SAR personnel to be placed at risk on longer deployments chasing all over the ocean.
As I was told once when we asked "Do you put the life preserver on over or under your parka?" for 34F waters, you put it on anyway, and you put it on where it can be seen, so the poor SOB who is out there risking his life to find your body (which will be frozen and dead in minutes anyway) can find it quickly and then GO HOME.

If folks really don't want a SAR response, that's easy. Just make Real Damn Sure to put that in a float plan, file a copy with your next of kin and your home port, and make sure it is a proper legal document (witnessed and notarized) that says if you are overdue or in distress, STAND DOWN AND DO NOT RESCUE. Sort of a "living will" or a "do not resuscitate" to borrow a concept.

Now, the SAR guys will probably go out anyway because that's what they do, but at least if there's a written directive, you've given them permission to stand down. Of course if you've advertised for "friends" who are really illegal charters, their family and friends may have some other things to say.

Just saying "I won't hit the button" ain't gonna do it, unless there's no one waiting for your next landfall.

[foolishsailor]

Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate

I guess one lesson in all this is that those of us who go out of sight of land for days or weeks at a time share a duty of kindness to let those who care about us know at least upon completion of a voyage.

Perfectly said. Sometimes I think that those who travel extensively and are self sufficient are also self sufficient emotionally and frequently don't need the reassurances of contact with home. But we forget that the ones we love do need that contact with us. They need to know that we are alive and well.

[Cormorant]

A bit of good news from Juanpablo over in the Grain de Soleil thread (http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...-103218.html): ) :
[edited to reflect Juanpablo's clarifications]

"Some good news. The boat Team2choc and his skipper made it safely to the Azores island after being 40 days at sea.
I am not sure what happened to him during his trip, I will keep you all update.

Still looking for grain de soleil and lady domina.

Thanks,"

[Anne]

Re the VHF radio contact with a boat in the vicinity of Puerto Rico. A message was received from the USCG by the Danish Head of Operations in Aarhus that confirms there has not been any contact with our "Lady Domina." The only registration is a contact with a Lady Domina with a different registration number, which left San Juan on 5 April 13. The Norwegian link I refer to is Vet du noe om Lady Domina? - sorgenfri.com