Cruisers Forum
 


Closed Thread
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 22-11-2019, 16:51   #511
Registered User
 
Exile's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Land of Disenchantment
Boat: Bristol 47.7
Posts: 5,607
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Breaking Waves View Post
It would depend a lot on exact dates and details of the hypothetical forecast change.

But (in this part of the Atlantic) I would always prefer to be behind and to the west of any forecast track. I prefer to use slowing or stopping as a tactic rather than trying to 'outrun' a system. I would prefer to aim for the (forecast) center (or side opposite the TS) of a high-pressure system to use it as a shield. Sometimes none of that is available and all you can do is try to do is get on the 'navigatable semicircle' side of the TS and maximize your CPA.

Generic Maneuvering (eg without including details of the bigger synoptic systems) to avoid an imminent TS is well covered/documented in maritime literature.

You really should read Bowditch (one of the greatest collection of seamanship in existence - is dry reading and some of the electronics aids information is dated, but damn it contains knowledge all seamen should know by heart). You can skip to chapter 36 "Tropical Cyclones", which has a subsection "Avoiding Tropical Cyclones"

Attachment 203580

Attachment 203581
I understand the basics of trying to anticipate getting W or behind the storm, but I recall LV sailing in strong (prevailing) westerlies at the time. Given the uncertainties of the track, they obviously wouldn't want to try and get ahead of it, couldn't really backtrack into the wind, and putting on the brakes could have put them directly in its path. As someone else pointed out at the time, if they had left a few days later . . . . One of the risks that time of year I suppose.
Exile is offline  
Old 22-11-2019, 16:59   #512
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 1,365
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

[QUOTE=Exile;3021441] I recall LV sailing in strong (prevailing) westerlies at the time. [QUOTE]

You can (or should be able to) always make some progress to windward. So, perhaps going NWly, even if slowly, would have put them on the right side and further away?

The details do matter. If you want to go back and pick out a specific date I would be happy to look and discuss.

This TS was always forecast to be relatively compact, so you did not need to clear it by much.

But, Yea, it is still hurricane season. They do happen in November. We got brushed by one (lenny I think) in Antigua in November. and sometimes there is just not much you can do if you are there.
Breaking Waves is offline  
Old 22-11-2019, 17:30   #513
Registered User
 
Exile's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Land of Disenchantment
Boat: Bristol 47.7
Posts: 5,607
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

[QUOTE=Breaking Waves;3021446][QUOTE=Exile;3021441] I recall LV sailing in strong (prevailing) westerlies at the time.
Quote:

You can (or should be able to) always make some progress to windward. So, perhaps going NWly, even if slowly, would have put them on the right side and further away?

The details do matter. If you want to go back and pick out a specific date I would be happy to look and discuss.

This TS was always forecast to be relatively compact, so you did not need to clear it by much.

But, Yea, it is still hurricane season. They do happen in November. We got brushed by one (lenny I think) in Antigua in November. and sometimes there is just not much you can do if you are there.
Right. Which is why some are concerned that LV is there. On the other hand, early to mid-June is a popular time to sail from the US e. coast to Bermuda, and from the Carib to the US e. coast, but June 1st marks the beginning of the hurricane season. Maybe even more rare than Nov. but still the season. Maybe more prudent from mid-April through May.

For US e. coast sailors leaving the mid-Atlantic for Bermuda/Carib in the Fall, Nov. 1st is typically the earliest their insurance cos. will allow them to leave. But Nov. 1st also marks the (unofficial) beginning of the often unpredictable N. Atlantic gale season, and so the focus is usually not on potential TS's which are usually more predictable in advance.

No guarantees of course, there is always inherent risk. But many manage this risk by never sailing during the storm season. For them, there is enough risk inherent with offshore sailing generally, and so what might seem like bravado & courage to some is viewed as mere foolhardiness by others. Perhaps this explains some of the concerns & critiques with LV's decision more than anything else.
Exile is offline  
Old 22-11-2019, 18:21   #514
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 1,365
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

As i tried to say, I get it.

I get the opinion that this is an undue risk.

But I also get the opinion that it is a great challenge, cause and /or business opportunity.

I am comfortable with the fact that intelligent informed people can hold either opinion.

I think both opinions have been expressed adequately here, and I think intelligent informed mature people should be willing to agree to disagree and move on.

I personally don't much care about the question. I'm interested in what can be learned from the sailing.
Breaking Waves is offline  
Old 22-11-2019, 18:45   #515
Registered User
 
Exile's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Land of Disenchantment
Boat: Bristol 47.7
Posts: 5,607
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

A short video of Greta and (presumably) her father boarding LV at the start of the trip.

Exile is offline  
Old 22-11-2019, 19:10   #516
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Minneapolis MN
Boat: Delphia 37
Posts: 221
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Breaking Waves View Post
I personally don't much care about the question. I'm interested in what can be learned from the sailing.
Me too! Thanks you for all your post in this thread, please keep them coming as Iím really valuing the education from watching this passage in real time with the weather and routing discussion.
marty9876 is offline  
Old 22-11-2019, 21:10   #517
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: UK
Boat: SeaDog 30
Posts: 32
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

Quote:
Originally Posted by sebbiep View Post
As this thread has been debating (albeit from afar) the safety decisions made by the LaVag crew, here's a couple of small factual corrections to previous posts:

The LaVag team stated that they spent 7 days preparing the boat - i.e. not the 3 days being quoted throughout this thread.
On Day 3 Elayna wrote that "A week ago we were cruising the Chesapeake, thinking we had a month to get down to Charleston for the winter"
https://www.instagram.com/p/B46qezyh_wc/

Looks like a contradiction to me. It may also suggest that a bit of colouring was used now and then.
OldKetch is offline  
Old 22-11-2019, 21:24   #518
CF Adviser
 
Pelagic's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Van Helleman Schooner 65ft StarGazer
Posts: 10,280
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherod View Post
Pelagic ,, where have you been ????????
Pulling my masts for safety check and painting.......I'm too old to enjoy that from a Bosuns chair.
Pelagic is offline  
Old 22-11-2019, 23:42   #519
Registered User
 
Sojourner's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: On the boat!
Boat: SY Wake: 53' Amel Super Maramu
Posts: 885
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

Quote:
Originally Posted by daletournier View Post
What rubbish, the fact is on rather short notice they undertook a passage into a active hurricane zone, on a schedule that's just a fact...Taking unnecessary risks like out of season passage making is not good seamanship regardless of the course, this was a unnecessary voyage. A nice happy ending and a good story dosent make it a wise decision....Are you saying sailing in a active hurricane zone on a schedule with a very small child and a not so small child is wise? answer the question honestly.
I agree. Once you decide to have a child, good parents forfeit the right to make decisions purely selfishly, which is why the three of us are, and will always be, child free....we would not wish to give up the ability to live as we please in all ways just for a kid, so no kid. Easy decision.

I am a vocal spokesperson of doing as you please in life according to the sentiment: Enjoy yourself and be kind. But this implies agency, something an infant does NOT have. As long as it is consensual adults, knock yourselves out, literally if you must. Taking a child into a fairly uncertain situation is not good seamanship, or parenting. They should absolutely have left the kid with the grandparents and done the sail.
Sojourner is offline  
Old 23-11-2019, 01:15   #520
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: NZL - Currently Run Aground Ashore..
Boat: Sail & Power for over 35 years, experience cruising the Eastern Caribbean, Western Med, and more
Posts: 2,129
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Breaking Waves View Post
I think both opinions have been expressed adequately here, and I think intelligent informed mature people should be willing to agree to disagree and move on.

I personally don't much care about the question. I'm interested in what can be learned from the sailing.
In case it was missed, I think this is Breaking Waves' way of politely suggesting (for the 3rd or 4th time) that the discussion moves back on topic to the sailing, the weather, and the routing...

Let's respect that and move on.

jmh2002 is offline  
Old 23-11-2019, 01:18   #521
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: UK
Boat: SeaDog 30
Posts: 32
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

Quote:
Originally Posted by sebbiep View Post
As this thread has been debating (albeit from afar) the safety decisions made by the LaVag crew, here's a couple of small factual corrections to previous posts:

The LaVag team stated that they spent 7 days preparing the boat - i.e. not the 3 days being quoted throughout this thread.
Factual correction to the factual correction:

According to Elayna's post on Day 3 "A week ago we were cruising the Chesapeake, thinking we had a month to get down to Charleston for the winter." https://www.instagram.com/p/B46qezyh_wc/

Difficult to see how they managed to squeeze in 7 days of preparation into 3 days.
OldKetch is offline  
Old 23-11-2019, 01:31   #522
Registered User

Join Date: May 2017
Location: Scotland
Posts: 873
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

Stil the middle of the night for them and winds have fallen considerably , but still showing 7 knots of speed in 12 knots of wind , I gues the sea state is somewhat smoother than previously . Looks like some period of relative calm ness for a while
Cherod is offline  
Old 23-11-2019, 03:16   #523
Registered User

Join Date: May 2017
Location: Scotland
Posts: 873
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exile View Post
A short video of Greta and (presumably) her father boarding LV at the start of the trip.

fairly somber realistic atmosphere , look well geared up for the voyage
Cherod is offline  
Old 23-11-2019, 03:21   #524
Registered User

Join Date: May 2017
Location: Scotland
Posts: 873
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

as of 11 am gmt , prob around 5 ish with them , now headed due N,, prob seeking out a bit more wind
Cherod is offline  
Old 23-11-2019, 03:25   #525
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: UK
Boat: SeaDog 30
Posts: 32
Re: La Vagabonde's crossing

Sorry, did not want to send twice the comment above. Thought it got lost in cyberspace. Don't see an option to delete the duplicate.
OldKetch is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Big Splash of La Vagabonde new Outremer 45' Red Herring Multihull Sailboats 14 25-04-2017 13:57
SV La Vagabonde new ride Jadam79 Multihull Sailboats 184 24-10-2016 04:46
La Vagabonde - Hopeful Charity help in Pacific. gypsyvagabond Flotsam & Sailing Miscellany 1 12-12-2015 12:35

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:58.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.