GPS jamming in Flordia

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by Chotu

All I can say is the next time you pass through the United Nations exclusion zone in the East River, take a close look. Take a close look at your screen. You will lose your fix. Just for a short time.

Not going to be arguing with people who don’t know anything about it and are just commenting off the top of their head. People with no experience whatsoever.

There are also patrol boats out there waiting for you most of the time as well. You would think as often as that river is used, somebody from this forum would have gone through there before. Definitely the guy putting up the biggest stink has never been anywhere near it. Because he has no idea what he’s talking about.

The entire thing is just a matter of fact. Has nothing to do with conspiracy theories or anything else. They don’t want you having perfect positioning very close to that building for some reason. Nor will they let you approach it at all from the water. If you’ve never been, you don’t know what you’re talking about End of story.

So I've literally flown over your nebulously described location in a Cast Guard helicopter at 100' that gave us a pretty prominent alert when GPS position info was lost. I'm someone who spent 20 years serving in the Coast Guard responsible for providing accurate Notices to Mariners for any navigation anomalies, my first two specifically working in aids to navigation. So I'm not sure where you get off saying I "have never been anywhere near it" and "has no idea what he's talking about"?
Is it unreasonable to ask why none of the CG small boats out there experience what you alleged? Is it unreasonable to ask you to provide some proof that this is something other than an EMI issue in your installation if you're going to alleged that the entire CG team at Sector NY is purposely violating the NTM rules that they all operate under? Or at the very basic level the actual location where you insist this is happening? A random dude on the internet insisting that because he loses his GPS signal in a given place it's being "jammed" but won't provide any details or proof while alleging there is this bizzare narrow band "jamming" signal that only occurs at some undisclosed position and only on the water but not 100' above it is not "a matter of fact". When you're libeling a whole bunch of professionals with an absurd accusation the onus is on you to support your position, not confrontationally insist that everyone believe you solely because you say so and bad-mouth anyone who dares question you.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by lestersails

Sorry if i was not clear - you made the statement that when you were in the "exclusion zone" that you lost GPS. I am asking you to be precise about where you were when this happened to you - security zone 1, 2, or 3?

I don't think GPS would be very important in that narrow river. I believe prudence is necessary. He is right, those security boats will warn someone off.
Anyone ever heard of them using force?

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

So I've literally flown over your nebulously described location in a Cast Guard helicopter at 100' that gave us a pretty prominent alert when GPS position info was lost. I'm someone who spent 20 years serving in the Coast Guard responsible for providing accurate Notices to Mariners for any navigation anomalies, my first two specifically working in aids to navigation. So I'm not sure where you get off saying I "have never been anywhere near it" and "has no idea what he's talking about"?
Is it unreasonable to ask why none of the CG small boats out there experience what you alleged? Is it unreasonable to ask you to provide some proof that this is something other than an EMI issue in your installation if you're going to alleged that the entire CG team at Sector NY is purposely violating the NTM rules that they all operate under? Or at the very basic level the actual location where you insist this is happening? A random dude on the internet insisting that because he loses his GPS signal in a given place it's being "jammed" but won't provide any details or proof is not "a matter of fact", sorry.

[mlydon]

chotu,

I cruise by the UN every year going to and from long island - never had any issues near the UN....can probably pull up my track showing me going right by it.

Matt

[Brewgyver]

Originally Posted by Cadence

I don't think GPS would be very important in that narrow river. I believe prudence is necessary. He is right, those security boats will warn someone off.
Anyone ever heard of them using force?

No, never heard of that happening, but if I keep reading this thread...

[Gypsyjon]

The Air Force does that fairly regularly here in the north Gulf of Mexico. Nothing abnormal.

A while back I noticed that the GPS time was off by 2 hours. I called the Coast Guard, they said hold on let me check. BTW, I was using 3 separate GPS recievers and they were all off by 2 hours. Coast called me back and said yes you are correct. They said USAF does lots of experimentation and rarely lets Coast Guard know about it.

[Poche]

I have heard that Loran might make a come back as GPS is vulnerable. Any news of that? Maybe another thread would be better for this but if anybody knows a quick link to an article.

[MVNightWatch]

When I was still using the RDF’s and Loran C units, the GPSs were just coming out, with a cautionary statement that the US government reserve the right to “Degrade” the signal in times of national emergency for military safety. Was built into the system.

[MVNightWatch]

And… Isn’t that the space force doing this now?

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by Poche

I have heard that Loran might make a come back as GPS is vulnerable. Any news of that? Maybe another thread would be better for this but if anybody knows a quick link to an article.

Loran is only good coast wise. I don't think shore stations will be rebuilt. It was great in the day.

[wayne.b]

Originally Posted by lestersails

Sorry if i was not clear - you made the statement that when you were in the "exclusion zone" that you lost GPS. I am asking you to be precise about where you were when this happened to you - security zone 1, 2, or 3?

===


Several times in prior years we have lost GPS tracking approaching zone 2. On one occasion we were stopped and challenged by a heavily armed coast guard vessel as we approached zone 2 from the north. They told us that the UN General Assembly was in session and instructed us to stay on the eastern side of the channel, which of course we did. This is very much a real thing.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by wayne.b

===


Several times in prior years we have lost GPS tracking approaching zone 2. On one occasion we were stopped and challenged by a heavily armed coast guard vessel as we approached zone 2 from the north. They told us that the UN General Assembly was in session and instructed us to stay on the eastern side of the channel, which of course we did. This is very much a real thing.

It kind of makes you wonder why in this day and age. Close proximity would be unneeded. I guess being curious is the best approach.

[Zanshin]

Most here probably don't remember the cold war days when GPS kinda-sorta-almost worked accurately most of the time. It was called "Selective Availability" and the GPS values would be distorted in a pseudo-random way and only devices with the special decoding hardware would remove the "randomness". The US Military can and does still turn on SA in special circumstances.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

So I've literally flown over your nebulously described location in a Cast Guard helicopter at 100' that gave us a pretty prominent alert when GPS position info was lost. I'm someone who spent 20 years serving in the Coast Guard responsible for providing accurate Notices to Mariners for any navigation anomalies, my first two specifically working in aids to navigation. So I'm not sure where you get off saying I "have never been anywhere near it" and "has no idea what he's talking about"?
Is it unreasonable to ask why none of the CG small boats out there experience what you alleged? Is it unreasonable to ask you to provide some proof that this is something other than an EMI issue in your installation if you're going to alleged that the entire CG team at Sector NY is purposely violating the NTM rules that they all operate under? Or at the very basic level the actual location where you insist this is happening? A random dude on the internet insisting that because he loses his GPS signal in a given place it's being "jammed" but won't provide any details or proof while alleging there is this bizzare narrow band "jamming" signal that only occurs at some undisclosed position and only on the water but not 100' above it is not "a matter of fact". When you're libeling a whole bunch of professionals with an absurd accusation the onus is on you to support your position, not confrontationally insist that everyone believe you solely because you say so and bad-mouth anyone who dares question you.

Until you transit the area several times when there is an event going on, I'm not going to entertain your nonsense.

You speak from the armchair, having never once been through the area by boat.

Don't get your panties in such a bunch over things you are guessing about from afar.

It's been going on for decades in which time I've had 3 boats in that area. "My installation". Lol. Ok.


It's something that happens. People on here have experienced the same. All the babbling in the world isn't going to change that. You aren't from the area. You don't know what you're talking about flying above. It's local and in the East River. Definitely a GPS deadzone very often in the security area near the UN.

Just because you don't like it and want to go on an internet war about doesn't make it stop happening.

And you're telling me to furnish proof? You need to get a job. Or maybe I need your job and to not build my new boat because I'm not sure where you're finding the time for all of this nonsense.

Chotu, out.

[Checkswrecks]

Generally I'm going to agree with Redneck that intentional GPS jamming is not something done, especially by the Govt, and where it is there are NOTAMs for airplanes and Notices to Mariners for boaties.

However, I have done some investigations into unintentional EMI/HIRF and there are knuckle-heads who illegally use jammers to prevent their bosses from tracking them. Example: https://www.cnet.com/news/truck-driv...ewark-airport/

It wouldn't surprise me to learn that some knuckle head used one of these daily to take a break in a favorite spot, like near the UN. There are a lot of people in New York City.

Car thieves have learned to use these to beat the Lojack style tracking devices. Used near cars with automated driving features it makes them go into full driver mode.
https://www.thesignaljammer.com/prod...PS-Jammer.html

Bottom line is that a loss of signal can happen and be both sudden and unexpected.