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17-05-2012, 13:35
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Boise, ID
Boat: Trawler
Posts: 40
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Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
Found this interesting article today.
Google is going to track track AIS signals from satellites and make them available on Google Maps (and Google Earth, I would assume).
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17-05-2012, 13:46
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#2
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Nearly an old salt
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Lefkas Marina ,Greece
Boat: Bavaria 36
Posts: 22,801
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And we worry about the government !!
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Interested in smart boat technology, networking and all things tech
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17-05-2012, 15:05
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Boise, ID
Boat: Trawler
Posts: 40
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
That's funny because I was particularly amused by the section:
Quote:
Google has talked to representatives of 50 navies worldwide about their new technology and has discovered it tracks ships better than their own commanders can. "I watch them and they can't see themselves," Jone said. "It angers me as a citizen that I can do this and the entire DoD can't."
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It took private enterprise to do something our government couldn't.
But on the other hand, any group, be it government, corporation, or individual with this much power and information could be scary in the future.
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17-05-2012, 15:30
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#4
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2008
Location: cruising SW Pacific
Boat: Jon Sayer 1-off 46 ft fract rig sloop strip plank in W Red Cedar
Posts: 21,151
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
In this case, evading the black helicopters is pretty easy: turn off your AIS transmitter!
What's the worry about?
Cheers,
Jim
__________________
Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II, lying Port Cygnet Tasmania once again.
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17-05-2012, 15:41
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Seattle, Wa
Boat: Soon: Vision 444
Posts: 65
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
Very cool. I wonder if in the future, they can then transmit those collected AIS back to earth to allow ships at sea to pick up the signal and have over the horizon AIS capabilities.
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17-05-2012, 16:09
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere in the Caribbean
Boat: Beneteau First 38
Posts: 313
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
__________________
As I sit, a swirling sea of passion gives it's poems in waves underneath me.
The whispers of the sun in my eyes, a silence within.
Rhythm of the surf, drums of the sea. Thoughts tumble and toss about the deep blue abyss inside me, where the love of you dwells.
I'm fighting currents to get back to you, listening to the flow of your liquid language as you beckon me, "Come Play"
Mariners Cove, CI. Anonymous.
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17-05-2012, 16:49
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#7
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Brisbane Australia
Boat: Multihulls - cats and Tris
Posts: 4,859
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
So Google is going to have VHF receivers on a satellite. If thats true then why cant we have VHF transmissions world wide?
I also note that they say that the images are weeks old!!! I am not sure the authors of the article understand how AIS works.
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17-05-2012, 17:26
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#8
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Nearly an old salt
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Lefkas Marina ,Greece
Boat: Bavaria 36
Posts: 22,801
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
currently there is already pilot satellite AIS worldwide monitoring. There are some issues with data overloading, but its being worked on.
I dont believe google is using any of its own resources. it just tapping into others. as to what they say bout AIS and navies is just laughable,
I also suspect the IMO will have a lot to say about the process of dissemination of worldwide real time AIS.
In most countries there is a clause in your radio license pertaining to the secrecy of communication, i.e. if you hear a message not for you , you are not supposed to act union it and are required not to divulge it. AIS would qualify under that. So it remains to be seen what the legal position will ultimately be.
Quote:
So Google is going to have VHF receivers on a satellite. If thats true then why cant we have VHF transmissions world wide?
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You do, its called, "Iridium"
Dave
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Interested in smart boat technology, networking and all things tech
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17-05-2012, 18:22
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#9
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Eastern Tennessee
Boat: Research vessel for a university, retired now.
Posts: 10,406
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
Is that right? There are satellites sensitive enough to read AIS signals from space? VHF antennas are not aimed upwards...especially the higher gain antennas. Some of an antennas RF is going to point above the horizon, but it still has to go through a lot of atmosphere and an even greater distance before it reaches space where attenuation and where signal strength is inversely squared to the distance, is even more of a factor.
I'm just trying to get my head around how this might work.
If it works, it would be tremendous for search and rescue.
__________________
David
Life begins where land ends.
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17-05-2012, 18:38
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#10
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Nearly an old salt
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Lefkas Marina ,Greece
Boat: Bavaria 36
Posts: 22,801
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
Quote:
Originally Posted by David M
Is that right? There are satellites sensitive enough to read AIS signals from space? VHF antennas are not aimed upwards...especially the higher gain antennas. Some of an antennas RF is going to point above the horizon, but it still has to go through a lot of atmosphere and an even greater distance before it reaches space where attenuation and where signal strength is inversely squared to the distance, is even more of a factor.
I'm just trying to get my head around how this might work.
If it works, it would be tremendous for search and rescue.
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Yep . its coming out of test phase deployment into full usage
Satellite AIS
Norwegian AIS satellite? - Kongsberg Maritime
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Interested in smart boat technology, networking and all things tech
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17-05-2012, 18:56
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 476
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
I would say this is 10% good and 90% evil.
Navies around the world might want to warn boats within 5 miles to stay away, but I doubt they want some cyber warriors in some foreign country to monitor the exact location of every boat in the fleet. I guess subs are the only ones exempt from this...(that is if Navy ships around the world have to use AIS)
It makes sense for airplanes, not for small boats who are trying to anchor out by uninhabited islands.
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17-05-2012, 19:01
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#12
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Nearly an old salt
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Lefkas Marina ,Greece
Boat: Bavaria 36
Posts: 22,801
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
well, Sundevil, you can just turn it off.........
DAve
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Interested in smart boat technology, networking and all things tech
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17-05-2012, 19:04
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,076
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
Also, the satellites are about the size of a toaster, they are not some hugely complicated and heavy thing...
see also AIS
and Nanosatellite - Google Search
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17-05-2012, 20:18
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 476
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
Quote:
Originally Posted by goboatingnow
well, Sundevil, you can just turn it off.........
DAve
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You can turn off this generation...and it is voluntary to have and operate one for personal boats of a normal length.
I know that it is unlikely, but what if Florida decides that to travel in it's waters that you need to have AIS and have it turned on. Running dark will raise big flags with the coast guard/customs/local sheriff. Or, alert them that you are trying to anchor out in a zone where that isn't permitted anymore, because now a computer can tell them which boats are anchored out there overnight and charge each boat for it.
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17-05-2012, 20:35
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Pacific NW, sailing the Columbia River, USA
Boat: Gemini 105MC 34 ft hull#753
Posts: 951
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Re: Google to use Satellites for real time worldwide AIS tracking
Quote:
Originally Posted by SunDevil
You can turn off this generation...and it is voluntary to have and operate one for personal boats of a normal length.
I know that it is unlikely, but what if Florida decides that to travel in it's waters that you need to have AIS and have it turned on. Running dark will raise big flags with the coast guard/customs/local sheriff. Or, alert them that you are trying to anchor out in a zone where that isn't permitted anymore, because now a computer can tell them which boats are anchored out there overnight and charge each boat for it.
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Normal length ?? All the CG needs is simple digital radar to tell where boats anchor and how long.
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Wind in my hair and a nice catamaran
Phil & Elaine
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