Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 26-06-2014, 08:15   #31
Registered User
 
colemj's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Presently on US East Coast
Boat: Manta 40 "Reach"
Posts: 10,104
Images: 12
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
What's the EC?
English Channel - I'm lazy. Now my fingers hurt…

Mark
__________________
www.svreach.com

You do not need a parachute to skydive. You only need a parachute to skydive twice.
colemj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 08:52   #32
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 30,775
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

[QUOTE=Robin3;1572517]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
So the Med, as a superprime charter destination, is awful.



Because The French in Southern Brittany Biscay anchorages are mostly on charter boats, with smallish anchors and string rodes?



We always said mobos that went places were fine, the ones who just 'day blasted' out and back from the home marina much less so.

I was brought up thinking in terms of 3:1 scope on all chain and 5:1 on rope was a good starting point for normal conditions. We usually set the anchor on 3:1 on all chain and based on the expected HW depth plus an extra allowance for the bow roller height then ease the anchor in under Engine, gradually increasing engine revs to full astern whilst watching transits. Oft times because we would be anchoring at less than HW we would therefore be doing the initial set on a greater scope . If we expected stronger winds later we would let out a bit more rode too , but we always added a nylon snubber line with a wound- in rubber mooring compensator 'dog bone' included in it to take snatch out of the equation as the boat swings, IMO snatch loads are a top cause of dislodged anchors. Most of the time over 50 years of anchoring in UK Channel/ Biscay waters we avoided anchoring in strong streams and rarely did the anchor release and need to re-set itself on turn of tide, it either just carved it's way round in situ OR we even laid for a while on the weight of the chain and with the anchor in it's existing set orientation. We took great care to avoid locations with strong currents especially if wind direction blowing against current were possible or predicted later. Location Location Location!! WE could always find somewhere that was out of the main stream and sheltered from the wind as much as possible. we are starting a new learning curve here in the USA but will start off as we began over there and adapt if as and when we need to. With our now 36 footer, We have a 45lb genuine Delta on 150ft of of 3/8 HT chain ( with more warp available if needs be, but in the skinny waters round here we should be on all chain most of the time). We also have the inherited 'Dock Queen's' polished S/S claw with chain /warp we could add to the mix if we feel we need to, but do not want to complicate things by Bahamian moor techniques or fore/aft stuff. We live overlooking a popular passage anchorage on the ICW and I naturally watch the people using that area with interest. Mostly nobody drags, at least not obviously, but some take a few attempts to do their initial set but thereafter some wander around a long way on their very long string rodes, whereas those on chain alone seem much more considerate of space usage and remain in a smaller area with any changes of current or wind.

But South Brittany is not in the Channel!

But anyway, the rest of this post proves my point. I never knew a U.S. sailor who would ever consider a 3:1 scope to be enough; but this was commonly taught in the UK and still followed by many. I'm not saying it's wrong; obviously Robin's experience proves that it can work in the right hands. So it's hard to tell where people's anchors are around here -- they might be on anything from 3:1 to 8:1.

Enjoy the skinny Florida waters, Robin! The main thing there is not to run aground! Do you have Boat U.S. or Towboat USA insurance? Highly recommended!
Dockhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 09:00   #33
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 30,775
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

Quote:
Originally Posted by colemj View Post
English Channel - I'm lazy. Now my fingers hurt…

Mark
Ah, I see. We don't use that abbreviation. Around here it's either "The Channel", or "La Manche, you ignorant Rostbiff!", depending on what side of it you come from!




P.S., that last is a joke, playing only to our own anglospheric prejudices -- the French sailors are exceptionally friendly.
Dockhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 09:16   #34
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Atlantic ICW 29N/81W
Boat: Beneteau Oceanis 36CC, now sold
Posts: 823
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

[QUOTE=Dockhead;1572538]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin3 View Post


But South Brittany is not in the Channel!

But anyway, the rest of this post proves my point. I never knew a U.S. sailor who would ever consider a 3:1 scope to be enough; but this was commonly taught in the UK and still followed by many. I'm not saying it's wrong; obviously Robin's experience proves that it can work in the right hands. So it's hard to tell where people's anchors are around here -- they might be on anything from 3:1 to 8:1.

Enjoy the skinny Florida waters, Robin! The main thing there is not to run aground! Do you have Boat U.S. or Towboat USA insurance? Highly recommended!

Us (ex in my case)Channel based yotties got our experiences and subsequent opinions of French anchoring antics in Brittany or 'darn west' in the UK when the French visited us.

Bearing in mind with the greater tidal height ranges over there a 3:1 scope at theoretical HW depth applie when arriving at LW or half tide would be a much greater scope st the time of setting, you develop 'feel' for the right angle of pull and if i old faithful skips even an inch just let out a tad more chain . 'feel' more important than numbers alone?

WE lived on a trawler Mobo for a year prior to my stroke and moving back on dirt, and that mobo had < 5ft draught, rather less than the 7ft of our last UK sailboat but I had quite a few missed heartbeats in the ICW watching the depthsounder readings plummet We joined Towboat US before we left the dock first time out in the mobo, but haven't had to use them yet and we renewed the subscription again for our now 5.3ft draught Beneteau which has a winged keel that is vaguely reminiscent of a flattened Rocna so maybe we will have another anchoring option with that and no scope at all needed!
Robin3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 09:48   #35
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 98
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

At anchor here in Mljet Croatia we had 30 knots last night and sure enough saw a 450 charter catamaran come off its anchor to the great consternation of the downwind boat. I do think some of the charter companies are to blame: skitty little anchors and hardly any chain.

We apply the full engine test before putting on the bridle, but still find it hard to sleep soundly when the wind is gusting high. Anchor alarm app helps a bit, haven't set it off so far, except when forgetting to unset it and leaving an anchorage!

Ange
AngeW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 09:49   #36
Registered User
 
montenido's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Lying La Paz, BCS
Boat: 1991 Californian 52CPMY
Posts: 388
Images: 4
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

As one who anchors in Mexico quite often, I don't see many cases of someone anchoring in 10' of water with 200' of rode out. In fact, I often don't have any other boats in the same anchorages, which is sweet.

I'm sure there are bone-heads down there, but I have yet to run into them. BTW, I have an 80# Manson Supreme on all chain. I drop it in, let the wind put some tension on the chain, let out 4:1, and back down with the engine. Once set, I apply my snubber using a rolling hitch, and let out another 30 or so feet. So far so good.

Cheers, Bill
__________________
M/V Ansedonia
'91 Californian 52 CPMY
Lying La Paz, BCS, Mexico
montenido is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 09:52   #37
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Atlantic ICW 29N/81W
Boat: Beneteau Oceanis 36CC, now sold
Posts: 823
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
Ah, I see. We don't use that abbreviation. Around here it's either "The Channel", or "La Manche, you ignorant Rostbiff!", depending on what side of it you come from!




P.S., that last is a joke, playing only to our own anglospheric prejudices -- the French sailors are exceptionally friendly.
Absolument mais les allemands ......

Joke also, unless they beat USA in Brazil, right now on half time!
Robin3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 10:13   #38
Senior Cruiser
 
skipmac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29° 49.16’ N 82° 25.82’ W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 15,395
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin3 View Post
Absolument mais les allemands ......

Joke also, unless they beat USA in Brazil, right now on half time!
Germany just scored. 1-0. $#!#$#!@$^%%$^!!!
__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
Sometimes it's necessary to state the obvious for the benefit of the oblivious.
Rust is the poor man's Loctite.
skipmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 10:15   #39
cruiser

Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Pangaea
Posts: 10,856
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

Quote:
Originally Posted by colemj View Post
Actually, we call them "bitch wings" - I wrote it wrong.

Mark
We had a guy pull this on us a couple of days ago, we called him "fender boy" because of the 30 fenders he had deployed on his 45ft sailboat. When the knucklehead had finally had enough of us ignoring him, he pulled up his 350-400ft of light chain, moved and spent the next hour or two bothering someone else. Depth here in Soller is around 25ft in a crowded anchorage.
Kenomac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 10:18   #40
Nearly an old salt
 
goboatingnow's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 14,472
Images: 3
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

several things

Firstly I f%^king hate anchor nazis. You'll see it occasionally in the med, some guy ( usually an anglo type) will arrive early and try to claim massive swinging circles in a popular days anchorage.

In these anchorages, most people do not anchor overnight, so I drop a "lunch hook" , short scope etc. Then when all the day trippers leaves I re anchor for the night "properly"

During the day, if I drag or they do, hey so what, put out the fenders, and offer them a glass of wine, you''re going to be neighbours for a while.

PS if you read "hinz" in shallow waters you need 8-10:1 scope.

As for people with "bitch wings" that tends to bring out my Gaelic side and exacerbates my tourretts syndrome !!!

dave
__________________
Interested in smart boat technology, networking and all things tech
goboatingnow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 10:20   #41
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 30,775
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

[QUOTE=Robin3;1572556]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post


Us (ex in my case)Channel based yotties got our experiences and subsequent opinions of French anchoring antics in Brittany or 'darn west' in the UK when the French visited us.

Bearing in mind with the greater tidal height ranges over there a 3:1 scope at theoretical HW depth applie when arriving at LW or half tide would be a much greater scope st the time of setting, you develop 'feel' for the right angle of pull and if i old faithful skips even an inch just let out a tad more chain . 'feel' more important than numbers alone?

WE lived on a trawler Mobo for a year prior to my stroke and moving back on dirt, and that mobo had < 5ft draught, rather less than the 7ft of our last UK sailboat but I had quite a few missed heartbeats in the ICW watching the depthsounder readings plummet We joined Towboat US before we left the dock first time out in the mobo, but haven't had to use them yet and we renewed the subscription again for our now 5.3ft draught Beneteau which has a winged keel that is vaguely reminiscent of a flattened Rocna so maybe we will have another anchoring option with that and no scope at all needed!
You've not used Towboat US even once???? That's incredible. I never used them less than once a year, often twice, and maybe more than that (but I ain't tellin'), during the years I was cruising in SW Florida in a boat with 4.5ft of draft.
Dockhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 10:24   #42
Nearly an old salt
 
goboatingnow's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 14,472
Images: 3
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

PS, just did a delivery of a Mobo with 1000HP, we could drag the anchor all over the place at will !


dave
__________________
Interested in smart boat technology, networking and all things tech
goboatingnow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 10:54   #43
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Atlantic ICW 29N/81W
Boat: Beneteau Oceanis 36CC, now sold
Posts: 823
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

[QUOTE=Dockhead;1572600]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin3 View Post

You've not used Towboat US even once???? That's incredible. I never used them less than once a year, often twice, and maybe more than that (but I ain't tellin'), during the years I was cruising in SW Florida in a boat with 4.5ft of draft.
Alarm set at 10ft! I like round figures , specially ones with a Florda tan..
Robin3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 10:56   #44
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Atlantic ICW 29N/81W
Boat: Beneteau Oceanis 36CC, now sold
Posts: 823
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

Quote:
Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
Germany just scored. 1-0. $#!#$#!@$^%%$^!!!
Not really deserved but the USA do get through to the final 16, beats England anyway, so I still have someone to cheer on
Robin3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2014, 10:57   #45
Nearly an old salt
 
goboatingnow's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 14,472
Images: 3
Re: You are setting your anchors badly and then blaming the anchors

Quote:
Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
Germany just scored. 1-0. $#!#$#!@$^%%$^!!!
Congrats on getting to Round 16

dave
__________________
Interested in smart boat technology, networking and all things tech
goboatingnow is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
anchor

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
For Sale: Anchors , Anchors and More Anchors MermaidLil Classifieds Archive 11 19-01-2012 10:28
Posting Allowed, then Not, then Again ? Target9000 Forum Tech Support & Site Help 2 22-10-2011 09:51
Blaming 'The Wife' Livia Families, Kids and Pets Afloat 53 26-06-2010 13:08
How Badly Do You Really Need Bottom Paint? off-the-grid Construction, Maintenance & Refit 24 17-10-2009 08:26

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 19:04.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.