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Old 03-01-2012, 13:26   #16
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Re: Which spare anchor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by akio.kanemoto View Post
Thank you very much for all the replies!

As for storage, the stock of the FX-37 appears to be over 1m long (!) so storage on the rails/lifelines just can't happen.

I think I will have to store it disassembled in it's own bag which WM also appears to sell.

Thanks again!
Yeah, if your boat is configured such that storing it on the bow or stern rails doesn't work then that's going to be a problem. On our boat, the FX-37 stores easily hanging on the outside of the stern rail with the stock hanging down below deck level and secured with a bungee cord up against a roller.

As others have mentioned, they store well in a bag. Harder for scoundrels to make off with it in the night too.....
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Old 03-01-2012, 13:32   #17
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Re: Which spare anchor?

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Originally Posted by akio.kanemoto View Post
I think I will have to store it disassembled in it's own bag which WM also appears to sell.
I suspect that there are more cruisers with an FX-37 stashed away than there are without one.
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Old 03-01-2012, 13:46   #18
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Re: Which spare anchor?

With anchors size matters.
The Fortress is great second anchor if you can possibly fit the FX-37 it will be the better, but if not the 23 will be adequate.
If you are getting a new primary anchor I would think about a larger alternative than you have,. Tandem anchoring is very hit and miss, particularly with differing types of anchor. It is difficult to get both anchors to set .If the wind shifts will they stay set ?. If the forecast increases will you lift a well set single anchor to attach the tandem anchor? Then there is the problem of recovering them if they drag. What is easy in 25Knots becomes a nightmare in 50Knots. All these problems are avoided if you upsize the anchor.


It is also worth considering when you would deploy the tandem anchor. The strongest winds I have had at anchor was when the forecast only predicted Force 7 (30Knots).

A larger primary anchor provides protection 100% of the time.

If your windlass can handle a larger weight why not deploy a larger primary anchor each time ? If your windlass cannot cope will it be OK in storm force winds with 2 anchors?
Just my thoughts. Get a Fortress as a great Kedge, stern anchor, and second anchor if you loose your main anchor, but the the primary anchor should be able to cope without considering a tandem option.

Ben Lexan designed some great, and lightweight boats. but 20kg is still small for a long distance 40 foot crusing boat
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Old 03-01-2012, 13:59   #19
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Re: Which spare anchor?

With the caveat that I haven't used a fortress anchor per se, I will say that our boat (a similar style / weight / age IOR 40) came with a similar style (Danforth) anchor, that was relatively easy to stow, but bloody useless in anything other than perfectly sandy "ideal" anchoring conditions. Since we got rid of the Danforth and replaced it with a plough / CQR style anchor (of the same weight), we have never dragged, including in an anchorage with gusts of over 60 knots and including in achorages where, previously, the Danforth had been almost impossible to set.

Additionally, and without meaning any insult and without intending any offense, I'd suggest that on a typical IOR 40, if you can't find stowage for a second anchor, you maybe need to rethink your gear...
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Old 03-01-2012, 14:00   #20
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Re: Which spare anchor?

I find your choices of Fortress models a bit skinny I have both the FX-85 and the mean big FX-125. The last one in parts in the bilge. Better than an insurance policy. The FX-85 however is easily handled by me alone incl. putting it out with the dinghy and even retrieving with the dinghy.

The FX-125 I only dare to set by hand in shallow water where I can stand.

cheers,
Nick.
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Old 03-01-2012, 14:06   #21
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Re: Which spare anchor?

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The FX-125 I only dare to set by hand in shallow water where I can stand.
Nick, is that so you can dig it out after it buries itself? - C
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Old 03-01-2012, 14:09   #22
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Re: Which spare anchor?

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Nick, is that so you can dig it out after it buries itself? - C
Yes, it's so big that it will be very hard to get out. I believe it would work when deployed as primary with the roller and windlass etc. but I'm not gonna try it.

I did use it once and set it close to a beach when nothing else was available to tie to.

cheers,
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Old 03-01-2012, 14:19   #23
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Re: Which spare anchor?

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Originally Posted by s/v Jedi View Post

The FX-125 I only dare to set by hand in shallow water where I can stand.

cheers,
Nick.
Nick, an FX-125 that thing is huge. (Do you often hear This ) I am laughing. That means it is the right size.
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Old 03-01-2012, 14:49   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noelex 77

Nick, an FX-125 that thing is huge. (Do you often hear This ) I am laughing. That means it is the right size.
I always tell people to keep an eye on my 125... when I start assembling it, there's something scary on the way

When I found that beast in the bilge (didn't find it during the survey...) I was very happy.

cheers,
Nick.
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Old 03-01-2012, 15:00   #25
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Re: Which spare anchor?

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Originally Posted by noelex 77 View Post
Nick, an FX-125 that thing is huge.
Big in size but small on weight, its only 69lb
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Old 03-01-2012, 16:36   #26
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Re: Which spare anchor?

I stow my fortress in the lazaret but I noticed that where it came into contact with a stainless steel ladder, I got a significant spot of corrosion. Has anyone had that problem when mounting to the pushpit?
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Old 04-01-2012, 09:29   #27
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Re: Which spare anchor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by akio.kanemoto View Post
As a quick update, I looked up the Spade and it looks like it will cost $800 to ship it from the UK to Australia, so will have to count that one out of my list.

Any other collapsible ploughs? Or is the Fx-37 enough to do the job while waiting for a replacement if the Rocna turns into a pretzel?

(I wish I had a bigger boat.... storage is a nightmare!)
The FX-37 is plenty for a 40 footer, and your plan to have six metres of chain and then nylon rode in tandem with a bridle is excellent. Keep in mind that the Fortress is a Danforth-style, but not a Danforth. I have a 10 kilo hi-tensile steel Danforth as well and they operate differently in my experience. If you compare the two side by side, you can see how the geometry of the flukes and the entry differ.

If you are in Australia, I would seriously investigate the Sarca Excel as either a replacement for the Rocna or as a backup primary. I certainly wouldn't order a Spade from the UK when there's a Sarca nearby. I only wish they distributed to North America.

I like the new Mansons, too.
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Old 04-01-2012, 09:33   #28
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Re: Which spare anchor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by s/v Jedi View Post
I always tell people to keep an eye on my 125... when I start assembling it, there's something scary on the way

When I found that beast in the bilge (didn't find it during the survey...) I was very happy.

cheers,
Nick.
"Didn't find a FX-125"? I question the eyesight of the surveyor. That beast is bigger than my 10-year-old. It's like what Goliath uses to shave.
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Old 04-01-2012, 21:58   #29
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Re: Which spare anchor?

Thank you for all of the replies. Firstly, I put in the order for the FX-37, so it's on the way and should arrive in a fortnight assuming WM have it in stock...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zydeco View Post
Yeah, if your boat is configured such that storing it on the bow or stern rails doesn't work then that's going to be a problem. On our boat, the FX-37 stores easily hanging on the outside of the stern rail with the stock hanging down below deck level and secured with a bungee cord up against a roller.

As others have mentioned, they store well in a bag. Harder for scoundrels to make off with it in the night too.....
When I get it - I'll assemble and have a look for opportunities on the rails, but I think chances are pretty slim. It would have been really nice to have it ready to go on the rails though!



[QUOTE=noelex 77;851975]
Quote:
With anchors size matters.
The Fortress is great second anchor if you can possibly fit the FX-37 it will be the better, but if not the 23 will be adequate.
Well, the FX-37 will definitely fit while bagged, so assuming that the deployment is "planned", everything should be fine.

Quote:
If you are getting a new primary anchor I would think about a larger alternative than you have,. Tandem anchoring is very hit and miss, particularly with differing types of anchor. It is difficult to get both anchors to set .If the wind shifts will they stay set ?. If the forecast increases will you lift a well set single anchor to attach the tandem anchor? Then there is the problem of recovering them if they drag. What is easy in 25Knots becomes a nightmare in 50Knots. All these problems are avoided if you upsize the anchor.
Unfortunately, there is a limit to what I can upsize. Being racing boat, it didn't even originally come with a bow roller... So I had to have a roller fabricated.. but the bow, being very narrow, meant that I had to have a VERY long bow roller (approx 1.2m/4ft).. and all through bolted etc etc... and had to incorporate the forestay chainplate as well... all in all, my bow roller alone weighs 25kg.

Then there's the windlass @ 30kg... Then there's the rode... 70m of 8mm (5/16") chain... @ 110kg... and then the anchor...

So including the anchor, I have added about 200kg of weight to the bow, which didn't exist before... and the boat is definitely down on it's lines at the bow already.. :\

When I replace my primary rocna - I could conceivably go to 25kg (or perhaps a 22kg Sarca excel? Or 25kg Manson Boss?) ..but not much more than that.

What weight were you thinking anyway?

The other thing is that the bow roller was fabricated to fit the rocna 20kg perfectly... I REALLY hope the Manson/Sarca/something else also fits... :\

Quote:
It is also worth considering when you would deploy the tandem anchor. The strongest winds I have had at anchor was when the forecast only predicted Force 7 (30Knots).
Last night at my mooring, I had 30kn for a few hours, which was quite impressive.. my first time and this is definitely making me think about this issue.

The other thing is that the boat sails around at anchor, so there is some side load as welll..

A larger primary anchor provides protection 100% of the time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weyalan View Post
With the caveat that I haven't used a fortress anchor per se, I will say that our boat (a similar style / weight / age IOR 40) came with a similar style (Danforth) anchor, that was relatively easy to stow, but bloody useless in anything other than perfectly sandy "ideal" anchoring conditions. Since we got rid of the Danforth and replaced it with a plough / CQR style anchor (of the same weight), we have never dragged, including in an anchorage with gusts of over 60 knots and including in achorages where, previously, the Danforth had been almost impossible to set.
Just out of curiosity - what weight is your plough?

Quote:
Additionally, and without meaning any insult and without intending any offense, I'd suggest that on a typical IOR 40, if you can't find stowage for a second anchor, you maybe need to rethink your gear...
Volumetrically, there's space. But from a "space allocation" perspective - there isn't. Sure, I still have some spare underneath the settee etc... but they're too small for a non-collapsible anchor.

I've devoted one quarterberth and a double berth (both racing style muzzle-loading bunks) for storage, but I don't have a nice "lazarette" or even a bilge to lash it down in.

As for rethinking gear.. we've divided the boat fore/aft. Wife gets "fore" for daily requirements/food/clothes etc.. and I get "aft" for boat stuff. I have enough tools/equipment to basically rebuild the boat. Call it paranoia.


Quote:
Originally Posted by s/v Jedi View Post
I find your choices of Fortress models a bit skinny I have both the FX-85 and the mean big FX-125. The last one in parts in the bilge. Better than an insurance policy. The FX-85 however is easily handled by me alone incl. putting it out with the dinghy and even retrieving with the dinghy.

The FX-125 I only dare to set by hand in shallow water where I can stand.

cheers,
Nick.
That's big. Wow.


Quote:
Originally Posted by S/V Alchemy View Post
If you are in Australia, I would seriously investigate the Sarca Excel as either a replacement for the Rocna or as a backup primary. I certainly wouldn't order a Spade from the UK when there's a Sarca nearby. I only wish they distributed to North America.

I like the new Mansons, too.
Yes, in Australia. What are your thoughts about sizing in that respect?

Also - the reason for the Spade was that it's collapsible, storing another plough type of anchor as a backup is not easy to do unfortunately.
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Old 04-01-2012, 22:19   #30
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Re: Which spare anchor?

Quote:
Including the anchor, I have added about 200kg of weight to the bow... and the boat is definitely down on it's lines at the bow already.
I feel your pain. We're similar size, with a 25 Kg Rocna and a chain-rope rode (only 30M of chain). I'd rather have all chain, but it would be awfully heavy. And 5 Kg of anchor holds better than 5 Kg of chain.
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