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Old 18-10-2009, 09:28   #1
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Rocna Doesn't Fit . . . Do I Go with Ultra or Delta ?

I have determined with the prints supplied that the Rocna anchor will not fit my boat. I am looking at a 35 to 40 KG anchor.

I am down to either a Delta or an Ultra that will fit that opening.

This is part of an email I have received from Ultra comparing the two, but Delta just refers me to WM.

Does all this make sense to you guys?

There are several features about the Ultra Anchor that make it have higher holding power and set quicker than the Delta Anchor which ultimately makes it a better choice. The Ultra anchor was engineered from the beginning to be made from and use the benefits of being manufactured from Stainless Steel.
The Delta Anchor was made of galvanized material and then copied in stainless steel.

Holding Power:
The Delta Anchor is an aerodynamic plow shape (there is a reason there is a point on the bow of our boats). This shape allows soil to flow across its face. The holding power of the Delta can be defined as the resistance to friction of the soil on the steel face of the anchor. The Ultra Anchor is a concave shape that builds a plug of soil on the surface of the anchor. This plug of soil stays on the face of the anchor in a pyramid shape and for the Ultra Anchor to move soil must shear soil on soil. The holding power of the Ultra Anchor can be defined as the resistance to friction of the soil against soil. Soil on steel (Delta) can be equated to sliding on glass versus sliding on sand paper (Ultra). For the same cross sectional area, a flat or concave anchor(Ultra Anchor) will have 30 to 40% higher holding power than a plow shape (Delta Anchor) depending on soil conditions


Setting ability:
The Delta Anchor has a high center of gravity and is designed to lay to its side before it catches on the sea floor and begin to penetrate. Any time an anchor must lay to its side there is a potential for the anchor to begin to slide on any grass, weeds or other difficult to penetrate substance. It typically takes 3 or 4 anchor lengths for a Delta to penetrate to developed its holding power. The Ultra Anchor is built with a very low center of gravity. The shank of the Ultra Anchor is hollow, the base is filled with lead. The bouyancy in the shank places the center of gravity when submerged practically at the point of the anchor fluke. The reverse curved chisel tip and low center of gravity of the Ultra Anchor causes the Ultra Anchor to penetrate and developed its extremely high holding power with in its own length without laying to its side. Digging deeper and quicker, the Ultra Anchor will set within its own length. The Ultra Anchor will set with a 2.5 to one scope with or without anchor chain to assist.

Reverses of direction:
With its low center of gravity and reverse wings the Ultra Anchor will stay buried and rotate below the soil surface keeping itself buried. The Delta has to roll out and reset on reverses of direction based on the mechanics of how it is designed to set which potentially leads to dragging conditions.

Materials:
We use only 316L Stainless steel and hand polish to a beautiful finish. The Delta uses only 316 stainless steel and is electro polished to a smooth sheen not the high luster of the Ultra.

Warranty, trade ups and other many other features that make the Ultra Anchor the best anchor for your vessel. Including but not limited to the following
features:

1) A lifetime warranty on workmanship and materials. It will not bend, break, fracture or rust.
2) If you ever decide to purchase a larger anchor and you are the original purchaser you may return your anchor to Quickline USA for full credit and pay the difference to the retail price of a larger anchor.
3) We give you 90 days to test the anchor, if you are not happy you may return the anchor to us for a full refund.
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Old 18-10-2009, 10:31   #2
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Is it the thick part of the Rocna shank that doesn’t fit....or because of the roll bar?
I would exhaust all possibilities of making it fit before changing to another anchor design.
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Old 18-10-2009, 10:34   #3
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You want to spend $3,000+ on an anchor?
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Old 18-10-2009, 10:37   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James S View Post
Is it the thick part of the Rocna shank that doesnít fit....or because of the roll bar?
I would exhaust all possibilities of making it fit before changing to another anchor design.
Primarily the roll bar, the shank would be sticking up at 45 degrees on the bow.

What I currently have is a 35lb CQR with 200 ft. 3/8 chain. Very difficult to get it to set.
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Old 18-10-2009, 10:39   #5
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Originally Posted by GordMay View Post
You want to spend $3,000+ on an anchor?
I want the quickest setting and best holding anchor that will fit my boat without modifications, and, I want to make sure I don't have to change twice.
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Old 18-10-2009, 10:53   #6
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I donít want to sound like a smart ass, I really am not! But what is the cost of the modifications compared to the value of the boat?

For me its an area not worth scrimping on.

Mine didnít / doesnít fit well either but I will modify accordingly because I think its worth it to have the best hold I THINK I can get.

I just posted this pic on another thread so forgive me if you already saw it.
You can see that the anchor shank hasnít dropped like it shouldÖIíll have to cut out the cross piece on the top and re-install one thatís a bit higher
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Old 18-10-2009, 11:09   #7
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Some of what I read in their response is BS. The Delta Anchor has a high center of gravity and is designed to lay to its side before it catches on the sea floor and begin to penetrate. BS, I have snorkled and watched from deck a Delta many many times in clear water, they almost universally orient themselves on the bottom in the correct position not on their side, in fact the low center of gravity is their claim to fame vs the CQR! I really dont get their "engineered for SS" comment either. Steel and SS are roughly the same strength and either can be made a lot stronger depending on how the fabrication is done. Frankly, who worries about the strength of the material if there was much difference? Are you worried about your anchor breaking form the force of the sand?? However I have heard good things about the Ultra. The Delta is a great anchor, but will pull out if the there is a major strong wind shift. Never had a Delta drag even with a high windage Catamaran and a Delta that was not oversized. Did have it pull out when winds shifted though. I'm not knocking the Ultra here but disagree with some of their comments...
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Old 18-10-2009, 11:13   #8
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35 lb CQR? If your boat is the 58 footer pictured you need a LOT bigger anchor... the Delta will set a lot better than the CQR. I would have about a 100 lb anchor on that boat...
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Old 18-10-2009, 11:28   #9
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Good day to all,
I looked at the rocna also; in the running was the Mason Supreme. I had a 35 CQR and an older claw (painted white) that came with the boat. I used the CQR several times but it didn’t set every time and I drug a bit in moderate conditions. I got a delta 35 to replace the claw and it worked well enough. As it came closer to the time we were going to head out to cruse for real I thought more seriously about ground tackle. I have two manual windless on the bow (Prout 37 Snow goose) I went with the Mason over the Ronca and have not regretted that to date. Everything I read in practical sailor and everything I could get my hands on put the two close in setting power. Price was another story. The Supreme has set every time and in little more than its length. I have set and circled the anchor as the wind clocked around us and she stayed set. I have yet to drag (knock on wood!) I like to go and look how the anchor is set before I leave the boat unattended or I sleep with any possibility of a breeze coming up.
I have yet to put down in a rocky bottom so about that I have yet to test. But I like the idea I can put the chain to the slide on the top of the shank and pull her out backward. I had to put standoffs on the bow roller to keep the point out of the gel coat. That was a matter of using a hole saw and starboard, ľ-20’s and recessed the bolt heads. I’m sold on them.
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Old 18-10-2009, 11:29   #10
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The Davis Talon is a plow very similar to the Delta and had excellent results in one of Practical Sailor's tests. Dimensions are shown on their website. Available in galvanized and stainless.

Welcome to Davis Anchors
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Old 18-10-2009, 11:37   #11
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Go with the Rocna. Touch wood it has never failed us yet including a real pounding in NJ with 30-40kt winds & waves to match
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Old 18-10-2009, 13:14   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James S View Post
I donít want to sound like a smart ass, I really am not! But what is the cost of the modifications compared to the value of the boat?

For me its an area not worth scrimping on.

Mine didnít / doesnít fit well either but I will modify accordingly because I think its worth it to have the best hold I THINK I can get.

I just posted this pic on another thread so forgive me if you already saw it.
You can see that the anchor shank hasnít dropped like it shouldÖIíll have to cut out the cross piece on the top and re-install one thatís a bit higher
I don't think you're a smart ass at all.

The price of the rocna AND the modifications, similar to what you have done, would be less than the 3000$ cost of the Ultra.

The issue is I don't want to modify the boat, I think modifying it would lessen the value of my boat by at least 10 times what the anchor is worth.

I would have to remove the bow beaching ladder (can also be used as a bow passerelle) to be able to move the anchor above the bow like you did, It works, just something I don't want to do.

Another option may be to remove the ring above the rocna but then it would just be another anchor and may present a whole bunch of other problems.
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Old 18-10-2009, 13:30   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
Some of what I read in their response is BS. The Delta Anchor has a high center of gravity and is designed to lay to its side before it catches on the sea floor and begin to penetrate. BS, I have snorkled and watched from deck a Delta many many times in clear water, they almost universally orient themselves on the bottom in the correct position not on their side, in fact the low center of gravity is their claim to fame vs the CQR! I really dont get their "engineered for SS" comment either. Steel and SS are roughly the same strength and either can be made a lot stronger depending on how the fabrication is done. Frankly, who worries about the strength of the material if there was much difference? Are you worried about your anchor breaking form the force of the sand?? However I have heard good things about the Ultra. The Delta is a great anchor, but will pull out if the there is a major strong wind shift. Never had a Delta drag even with a high windage Catamaran and a Delta that was not oversized. Did have it pull out when winds shifted though. I'm not knocking the Ultra here but disagree with some of their comments...
Thanks for your honest comments. It is appreciated.
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Old 18-10-2009, 13:34   #14
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Just a bit more info.

I am basically cruising the great lakes and the ICW, and may, hopefully, one day do the Great Loop.

I have yet to anchor overnight, we usually get to a marina or wall to tie up to. Anchor is mostly day or evening anchoring for us. Don't plan to anchor out on lake Huron overnight or anything...

I also have two large BOX anchors on board for the stern. When I was just testing it, it did hold well and immediately grabbed and set, and with just a 3:1 rode. But this is not designed to be a main anchor.

Last time I tried to anchor with the cqr, I just quit after 4 tries. I want something that will grab when I put it down.
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Old 18-10-2009, 13:41   #15
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I'll second this comment.

I had a #35 anchor on my 30 foot sailboat.
Agreed, I am planning an 88 lb. anchor with 200 ft of 3/8 chain which itself weighs 300 lbs also.

The boat weighs 44000 lbs dry, must be around 54000 fueled and loaded. Both the rocna and Ultra sites recommend the 88lb for my size.
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