Rocna Anchor Fail

[Alecadi]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Okay that's a personal opinion, but have you been to China? I have, I lived there for a year. the Chinese factories will make what ever you want, to what ever standard and quality control you desire. All you have to do is pay for it. So personally I disagree with your recommendation.

It would be interesting to see what the results would be if Rocna paid for independant testing one of there anchors and some Mansons

Statistics, well as you know they can be made to say anything you like.

You bought a Manson, so I am not sure how you can comment on a Rocna. If you had bought a Rocna and then stated that during the last 5 years it had failed because............ then that would be worthwhile intel. By the same token if you say your Manson hasn't let you down in 5 years that is also useful to know.

However, a witch hunt against Rocna across the internet sailing forums, I am not sure that sits well with my desire for fair play and a level playing field.

Finally, if you don't want a rusty lump of metal as an anchor and want one that the manufacturer has proven they will honour any warranty regardless of age (chat to Ram), I suggest you buy one of the new generation Fortress

Pete

Rightfully said... and if I may add some of my own opinion: if you ban from your "shopping list" all made in China products, you will go naked , without a computer and no cell phone etc and your car will miss more than half of its component, etc etc etc...

[Factor]

Originally Posted by sarafina

thread responses.

However on this thread the light at the end of the tunnel is NOT the train comin... it's my gimlet eye * -)

Really pretty blue eyes if I may so so.

[gettinthere]

The "witch hunt" against rocna was brought on by the constant attacks BY rocna on other anchors. Even rocna owners such as maineSail are now standing up against rocna. The chinese manufacture, by itself, is a false lead. But rocna has been using test data from their NZ made anchors as their basis for their claims. They claim their anchor is 40% better than any other. But they got that with a gross distortion of the independent test data.

[David_Old_Jersey]

That's why folks carry spare Anchors. and don't believe all advertising.........

[hpeer]

Sure would be nice if some independent outfit jumped in here and did some real testing including metallurgy. Practical Sailor????

My take is that the new fangled anchors are better and the holding tests prove it. The point about the quality of the metal is something else I supposed.

There may even be an ADVANTAGE to a shank bending rather than breaking as it is better for it to bend and stay attached rather than snap off. Sorta like the mighty oak that gets blown over while the willow bends but stands.

Maybe we should take up a collection and send it to PS.

Maybe we should send our bent shank Rocna's and Supreme's (and Ultra's) to PS for testing.

[s/v 'Faith']

Originally Posted by gettinthere

The "witch hunt" against rocna was brought on by the constant attacks BY rocna on other anchors. Even rocna owners such as maineSail are now standing up against rocna. The chinese manufacture, by itself, is a false lead. But rocna has been using test data from their NZ made anchors as their basis for their claims. They claim their anchor is 40% better than any other. But they got that with a gross distortion of the independent test data.

Originally Posted by Pete7

.....However, a witch hunt against Rocna across the internet sailing forums, I am not sure that sits well with my desire for fair play and a level playing field. ....

Pete

Pete,

The reason I share this thread has much to do with the years of ROCNA's
marketing (on this and other) forums where they have actively disparaged their competitors and made wild claims... which have now turned out to be false.

Rocna is hardly worthy of sympathy here, they have gone on loud and long at making claims against their competitors....

I have a Manson with which I am happy... I might have bought a Rocna... (and frankly the pre-China Rocnas were probably fine).... I have
no dog in this fight.

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by s/v 'Faith'

Rocna is hardly worthy of sympathy here, they have gone on loud and long at making claims against their competitors....

Oh I do agree on that, the endless posts by Craig are one of the reasons I bought a Fortress and keep looking at the prices of Spade anchors.

Whilst he has done much to raise the awareness of better anchor designs there comes a point when enough is enough. I think his postings are a bit like a curate's egg.

Pete

[Joli]

The test strips pulled by Mansons "independent lab?" seem to indicate roughly half the advertised strength from the Rocna web site?

No dog in this fight, just looking at the test results.

[CSY Man]

Where is Craig...?

I got a pre-China Rocna 20 and I am quite happy with it, no complaints except some surface rust on the shank:



My neigbor bought a "China Rocna" and when I touched it, got silver "galvanization" on my fingers..Wonder if it was painted rather galvanized...?

[CharlieCobra]

In Before The Lock...

[boasun]

All the time that I've beeng going to sea. The one statement that has been proved over and over again is: Nothing is sailor proof. The sailor will always find a way to screw it up!
It was the other guy

[doug86]

RABBIT SEASON!

...DUCK SEASON!

RABBIT SEASON!

...DUCK SEASON!

Where is Elmer Fudd when we need him?

[Kettlewell]

I understand there may be some issues with regard to claims vs. reality in terms of material strength, but I do not have enough knowledge to know if these numbers are significant. In other words, as long as both anchors are strong enough, extra strength doesn't really matter other than bragging rights. Personally, I have always been a bit wary of all of these anchors that use a flat plate steel shank. You would think they would all be vulnerable to bending if the anchor was dug in sufficiently and the wind shifted direction. I have seen several examples of various anchors that have had bent shanks, so those types of loads are not impossible, though they must be rare. For that matter, I've seen several drop-forged CQR shanks that have been bent, and those things must be tremendously strong.

[boasun]

Originally Posted by boasun

All the time that I've beeng going to sea. The one statement that has been proved over and over again is: Nothing is sailor proof. The sailor will always find a way to screw it up!
It was the other guy

I repeat:

Nothing is Sailor Proof!

And it was the other Guy!?

[Joli]

Here is a snippet from the Rocna web site:

"The shank on any anchor is a common failure point, normally bending when a high lateral load is applied (for instance, when the anchor fouls on a submarine obstacle and is jammed). For this reason, the shank on the Rocna is a high tensile quenched and tempered steel, with a grade of around 800 MPa. Its pure resistance to bending is around three times that of mild steel. This adds to the price of the anchor, but compromising this strength is not something we would entertain."

Anchor materials (Rocna Knowledge Base)

Rocna obviously believes a hardened, bend resitant shank is important.

According to the Rocna snippet the shank material has a tensile of ~120,000 psi. The test coupon from the Manson website shows the shank tensile to be ~69,000 psi.

Disclaimer; my conversion from metric to english could well be wrong, if so, my apoligies. Could someone back check me?

Originally Posted by Kettlewell

I understand there may be some issues with regard to claims vs. reality in terms of material strength, but I do not have enough knowledge to know if these numbers are significant. In other words, as long as both anchors are strong enough, extra strength doesn't really matter other than bragging rights. Personally, I have always been a bit wary of all of these anchors that use a flat plate steel shank. You would think they would all be vulnerable to bending if the anchor was dug in sufficiently and the wind shifted direction. I have seen several examples of various anchors that have had bent shanks, so those types of loads are not impossible, though they must be rare. For that matter, I've seen several drop-forged CQR shanks that have been bent, and those things must be tremendously strong.