Maxwell windless Old Not working

[Valmika]

I have a friend with a 1989 vintage Maxwell vertical windless. It is having sporadic problems working. We originally thought it was the motor as we couldn't get it to work even jumping it. We had the motor rebuilt and bench tested and it worked fine. Installed it and it worked fine. Field tested it for a two night stay and it worked fine. Now he is out at the island and it is not working again. He says he is getting voltage from both leads out of the solenoid box when ever he hits on of the switches. I always assumed that the black out of the box was a common ground and the two reds were one for up and one for down. Am I wrong here or is the problem with his solenoid? He does have lower voltage on one of the hots (11.5) when he hits the button. Is this just pass through voltage through the motor? The rebuild is warrantied so we need to get it back. My personal feeling is something is wrong with the motor again. Before it seemed to be bad brush spring.

[TheOffice]

Nilsson built it. https://www.jamesnilsson.com/.

Check with them. The switch could be bad.

[donradcliffe]

You are right about the wiring--there is a common ground and two positive leads into the motor--one positive lead should be energized for up and the other for down. If he is out in the field, he could disconnect the down positive lead and just use the windlass motor for up and the clutch for down.

EDIT Just as soon as I hit the enter button, I realized that his symptoms could be caused by a bad ground lead--worth checking.

[TheOffice]

Has he checked the battery to be sure it is not half dead and the battery/terminal cables for corrosion? You can get voltage but not amps.

[LA-Sailor]

Hello everyone,

I am the individual in the field Valmika spoke of. Finally getting to a cafe where I have wifi.

OKAY- A little more background on this issue...

When I left for the island- the windlass worked. I dropped anchor- pulled it up with windlass (no issues!) and found a new spot. Upon trying to pull anchor up again- windlass wasn't working at all. (The motor wasn't even trying to spin. I could hear the solenoid down beneath clicking as I pushed the up and down directions on deck). Figured I'd be pulling up manually now so I let it be for 2 days. Upon returning- it was magically working. BUT- I noticed the motor was getting voltage at BOTH the up and down directions.

First question- is that normal? I assumed that maybe that was overheating the motor. The windlass was working at the time. I disconnected the 'down' cable and was only going to use the up and release w/ clutch like previously discussed... only problem is NOW the windlass won't work! It was working when it had both the hot up/down connected, but when I disconnected the down, the windlass wouldn't work. Ugh. I reconnected the down cable thinking it would work again, but now the solenoid is just clicking like it was when it was not working beforehand.

As I jump the switches from down below, the solenoid is still releasing 13.5v's out of both the down and up terminals... yet the motor won't spin. I have no clue as to what the issue could be.

(It's an old Maxwell Nilsson VW 700).

Any thoughts what I should do? It's a 55lb anchor and a lot of chain... not looking forward to winching that up if I don't have too!

[donradcliffe]

If you can, check voltages at the motor terminals, with the negative lead on the meter going to the windlass ground wire from the battery.

I suspect you will find 12v on all three terminals when you energize the windlass. In that case, you will have a bad ground lead inside the motor case.

[donradcliffe]

Looking at the installation wiring, I realize that the wire to the motor ground terminal does go straight to the battery, so you are not going to find 12v on that terminal even if there is a broken ground inside the motor case. If you are getting 12v across the motor terminals with no action, it pretty much points to a motor problem.

[Valmika]

Thanks Donrad.


I think he also said that he was getting voltage on both terminals out of the solenoid even with the motor disconnected and only one switch jumped. That would make me think the solenoid may shorted on the inside. The problem is it seems to be working again. Hard to diagnose those pesky intermittent problems. Could there be an issue in the solenoid where a short could power up both hot out terminals at the same tome?

[donradcliffe]

From memory, the Maxwell solenoid system bragged about protection against energizing the up and down at the same time. If you do power both the up and down windings simultaneously, it will let smoke out of the motor in short order.

[DumnMad]

Maxwell 700 seems a bit light for your gear.

Try it with rope rode.

[Valmika]

Originally Posted by donradcliffe

From memory, the Maxwell solenoid system bragged about protection against energizing the up and down at the same time. If you do power both the up and down windings simultaneously, it will let smoke out of the motor in short order.

I just checked with Nilsson in NZ and they actually did a quick bench test on one of their units. When you hit the up or down switch power does come through the winding's and it will have voltage on both terminals of the solenoid box. The opposite terminal just has back feed from the motor though. BTW. Thank you theoffice for the link. Those guys have great customer service and are extremely accommodating and helpful.

[Mithril Bham]

Are you running your engine when operating windless?

[TrentePieds]

On the relay box there will be four studs marked "+", "M1", "M2" and "M3" for the high ampage wiring. There will also be three terminals for the low ampage control inputs. Two of these are marked "B2", "B3", and one has no marking.

"+" stud takes the "hot" wire from the battery/master switch. This will likely be a red 4-gauge cable. "M3" takes the "return" to the battery. Likely a 4-gauge black cable.

"M1" and M2" take the wires from the capstan, probably also red and black and 4-gauge. It doesn't matter ELECTRICALLY which goes where.

The unmarked low-ampage terminal is the "common" for the relay coils and is connected with a, say, 14-gauge to "M3" as a convenient way of connecting to "ground".

The "up" and "down" deck switches are fed with 14-gauge wires from the "+" terminal to the one side of the "normally off, push to make" switches. From each deck switch a 14 gauge goes to "B2" and "B3" respectively. It doesn't matter ELECTRICALLY which goes were. If the "up" switch now makes the drum turn in the down direction, just switch the leads around on "B2" and "B3"

A hint: NEVER dismantle ANYTHING electrical without making a wiring diagram of the wiring AS YOU FIND IT :-)!!

All the best

TP

[akprb]

Funny story that won't help you one bit :-)

I was in NZ with our Maxwell windless that was playing up and I did what you did, asked the world for help. Within a few minutes learned that the manufacturer was about a mile from my house! They were first class, fixed her right up and I even had her replated. Good luck!!!