conveniently stowed nylon plait anchor rode

[Rick]

O.K. I had to verify the Yale advertisement that the "brait" would stow in a smaller volume than the usual three-strand and it does! I used a Rubbermaid "flexifold (0r whatever they call it) laundry basket which holds 1.75 bushels of volume for this 600 ft length of 5/8 inch line.

The whole thing weighs 66 lbs and fits in my lazarette without a fuss. I had to use Gorilla tape (their version of duct tape which is thicker and stronger and more tanacious) to hold the nice handles together when lifting else they would pop apart from what I guess is a much heavier "laundry load" than usual.

I've used both the 8 and 12 stand plait and like both yet this Yale version is more difficult to splice than the other, oh well!

[rsn48]

Funny, I was just thinking about this product. How much more expensive is it and is it only available in few chandleries and the net, or is it being carried far and wide - so to speak"?

[GMac]

It should be commonly available. Yale did make a big hooha about this 'new' 8 braid which does seem a tad strange as the were one of the last to get around to making it.

Blame those bloody New Zealanders again, specifically Maxwell Winches. It was them who stirred up the bigger demand with all of those Freedom Auto rope to chain winches.

I do believe that there is some rope (more the raw fibres really) shortages due to the military buying huge amounts of production. We have recently shipped up 10,000mts for their winches as the local manufacturer was, appearently, told 'supply us (the military) now or you'll never see another order from us ever'. Hard to say no to a cheque book the size of the US Government , I certainly wouldn't.

Like most ropes there is good and bad 8 braid so choose well. Given a choice ask for a Type66 nylon, its a higher grade than the more common Type6. Type66 has higher Thermal Stability so will stay nicer a lot longer.

We say Braid, you say Brait and the Pommes say Octiplait.

Rick - by hard to splice you mean??? too soft, too hard. The bit I saw had little to no twist and did seem a bit floppy to me.

[Talbot]

I have spliced octoplait to chain and reckoned it was easy, so was the eye splice for the other end. Lovely stuff as a warp to go with the anchor cable. Its primary benefit is the ease of stowage, and considerably reduced likelihood of a tangle when deploying it.

I also have 3 strand on the second anchor, and the only reason I havent changed to octoplait, is that I hate throwing away good rope!

[GMac]

Originally Posted by Talbot

I also have 3 strand on the second anchor, and the only reason I havent changed to octoplait, is that I hate throwing away good rope!

Not to mention why spend the bucks on a sexy rope when it is going to do not much most of the time anyway

[Talbot]

second anchor is lighter, so I often use it as a lunch hook anyway.

[Rick]

There's a part of you, GMac, which doesn't do much most of the time yet when you need it you want it to perform not only well but better than anything available in order to survive! This is why some blue water cruisers say not to use a lunch hook but to always anchor as if a williwaw might come up at any time in order to prevent loss or damage.

[Talbot]

This is why some blue water cruisers say not to use a lunch hook but to always anchor as if a williwaw might come up at any time in order to prevent loss or damage.

My kedge (aka "lunch hook") and line are oversize for the size of my boat, its just that the main anchor and chain are bigger still.

I have no trouble sleeping when at anchor!

[GMac]

I do race, deep fishing and anchoring anchors on my boats.

Race anchor is an alloy one which will hold the boat in most. This is used due to weight and with the knowledge it is good but not the best. Rode is minimum allowed by rules i.e not that big or grunty but OK short term and ovenite in nice weather.

Deep fishing anchor is a grapnel on a real long bit of small line used when in very deep water. It is used more just to stop the boat when fishing. Never used overnite, when no one on board and etc.

Anchoring anchors are the one/s I use when not racing or fishing. Will hold thru most if not all weathers. Rode is beefed up to match.

I'm sort of lucky to be able to have whatever whenever so I do play around with them a fair bit. Currently sitting next to 300 + odd anchors, 60 tonnes of chains, 25 tonnes of rope, 20000 assorted shackes and connections. And I do like to play

Swapped my race rode yesterday purely due to colour. Sexy navy blue colour now. Is that a sign of someone with to much time on their hands or what

As for secondary rodes, I'm in the school of thought which is it must be more than capable of doing the primary anchor job, as it gets used less go with a cheaper rope i.e a 3 strand rather than a multi, go polyester as it stores a lot better over the years, don't splice it directly to any chain or whatever (you never know when a 80-100mt rope maybe needed for something else). If it all goes wrong with the primary you have a good second and you are also heading off to get a new primary ASAP. I like setting up the secondary as more multi-purpose, just in case, but with anchoring as 1st thought.

[GordMay]

...” Currently sitting next to 300 + odd anchors, 60 tonnes of chains, 25 tonnes of rope, 20000 assorted shackes and connections ... Swapped my race rode yesterday purely due to colour. Sexy navy blue colour now. Is that a sign of someone with to much time on their hands or what ...”

Nope - sounds like someone with nearly enough gear on hand, to me.

[rsn48]

Here in Vancouver and Canada, Brait is one thing, and Braid is another; I know I just about made the mistake of purchasing Braid thinking it was Brait.

Help me out here, is Maxwell Brait the same as Yale Brait?

[GMac]

Originally Posted by rsn48

Here in Vancouver and Canada, Brait is one thing, and Braid is another; I know I just about made the mistake of purchasing Braid thinking it was Brait.

Help me out here, is Maxwell Brait the same as Yale Brait?

I both are 8 braid Nylon ropes. These also travel under names like Braid, Brait (US), Octiplait (UK), 8 Braid (NZ), Square braid, multiplait, that platted stuff (worldwide) and a few more. All just a case of local terminology.

Constuction is the same but the ropes differ a smidgen when talking lay length and firmness, a lot of the Maxwell (mine actually) is shorter and firmer that the Yale in most places but in the US I think they are both the same as Maxwells there is the New England version. All US versions seem to be very very similar. Mind you Maxwell are chewing thru massive piles lately so maybe they are sending it up there as well, they have in the past. I'll ask.

The word 'braid' covers many many types of construction with many sub types i.e 16 or 32 carrier Double braid is what most boat ropes are but under that is, for example, 16 or 32 carrier Dyneema cored Double braid and so on. There is also 12 braid, fine braid, textured braids just to mix it up even further, which are more a mulitplait than a braid really. Not enuff names for too many differant products

Here we just use 8 Braid, 12 Braid, Double braid and so on. Seems to work for us simple folk down here

[rsn48]

I can pick up Maxwell Brait at a marina chain called Steveston's in Vancouver. I think the advert I have been seeing (don't hold me to this) is the one in the mags with the line sitting in two different aquariums; one the standard line takes up more room than the Brait - I think it is the Yale Brait.

The early 27 foot Catalina's came with anchor lockers that are tight for space. I just bought 1/2 line - 250 feet - with 30 foot BB 5/16th chain and I couldn't get half of the chain in. I had to install a hawser pipe as the good people back in California decided we didn't really need that option on our boat. I almost killed my hand trying to get it into the hawser and moving the line around. I posted my problem in another forum and Bait line was suggested as the miracle cure since its "lay" characteristics were superior to other lines including the 8 stranded Braid I was shown.

Maxwell Brait comes in one hundred, two hundred and three hundred length; I'm going with the 300' jobbie and it should fit. The guy at the marine store also reminded me that the normal nylon rodes sold also became a bit stiffer when immersed in salt water so I guess I have just become a Brait fan.

[GMac]

Spoke to maxwell today and when they are not using ours they sell Yale. Generally they sell Yale in Nth America and ours elsewhere unless stuck for local supply. Some comments along the lines of "fussy buggers those Americans you know" was made, in a nice way though.

What Nth America calls Brait we call 8 Braid and the pommes, sorry, English call Octiplait.

The Brait is used as the construction in a non-rotating one meaning it flops rather than tries to coil into the lockers like a 3 strand laid rope does. This allows better use of small locker space especially when the Auto R2C (rope to chain) winches don't like any 'back pressure'.

Regarding the marine shop guys comments he is not quite right. All nylon will go hard over time, just the nature of the beast. Basically there is 3 types of raw nylon product being used in ropes. One is called a textured nylon, this is reject stuff from the clothing industry and used in cheap nasty ropes (mostly asian made only) and will go bad very quickly. Another and the most common by far is a Type6 nylon, again will go hard but not as fast as the textured. Most Nylon ropes are made of this. The other is a Type6-6 nylon which is the real good stuff and has far superior thermal stability. This will also go hard but take a long time. What the time frame for each rope is depends on how hard it is used and how it is stored generally. If used within spec and looked after (not to hard to do) a Type6 and 6-6 should last many many years.

Generally all good Braits are made from Type6-6 raw product.

The key with any Nylon (in Europe it is more commonly called Polyamide) is keeping it away from any heat source, this will make it harden faster. Also salt build up is not the best. So every now and aging giving the rope a good wash in COLD fresh water will do it no harm. You can then soak it overnite or a few days in some COLD fresh water with a little (don't over do it) fabric softener.

Otherwise go hard and have fun.

Sail safe,
Another Braid, Braid, Octplait fan

[GordMay]

What GMac said, except, I wonder about the Brit's:
Nylon is only one of the several Polyamides(albeit the most common), which are polymers containing monomers joined by peptide (amide) bonds.
A polyamide can occur both naturally (ie: proteins, such as wool and silk), and can be made artificially (eg: Nylon, Kevlar (aramid)), etc.