Chain Counter

[Dockhead]

I have a windlass control at my helm, and I have been using it more and more. It is extremely useful when short-handed, and especially when attempting to Med moor. I have discovered that the chain flakes reasonably well without my doing it as usual with my foot, and that in general the windlass works ok unattended.

So this begs the question of how to know how much chain is out, when you're not at the bow.

Lewmar have their own system, with a magnet contact in the windlass, and an expensive control panel.

But why do we need all this complication? When you're veering chain, the windlass is working at a constant speed, and just counting the amount of time the windlass is on will give you a pretty accurate figure. And you don't need high accuracy for this at all. Even lifting the anchor you will get decent results -- because you really don't care if it's +/- 10% or even 20%, and you're not going to be doing it from the helm anyway if the windlass is bogging down.

So why not a simple time-counter wired to the helm switch, which can be calibrated to turn seconds into meters? Which will run upwards when the windlass is veering chain, and downwards when the windlass is lifting chain? This would dead simple, cheap, and extremely useful. Anyone done anything like this?

[Dockhead]

I think one would need a scalable up/down time totalizer for this. Have not found a cheap one yet

[Blue Stocking]

Hmmm!--interesting challenge. Another approach might be,--you know the depth in which you are anchoring from your depth sounder, -- and it has an alarm function. Any way to get audible prompts from multiples of the depth setting ? System languages vary, of course.

[wingless]

Why not just use the in-famous wingless trinary color code to mark the rode?

[Alan Mighty]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

But why do we need all this complication? When you're veering chain, the windlass is working at a constant speed, and just counting the amount of time the windlass is on will give you a pretty accurate figure. And you don't need high accuracy for this at all. Even lifting the anchor you will get decent results -- because you really don't care if it's +/- 10% or even 20%, and you're not going to be doing it from the helm anyway if the windlass is bogging down.

Indeed!

The Maxwell VWC1200 on Led Myne lays out chain at 17 metres/minute (56 feet/minute). And on the rare occasion when I've needed to lay anchor and lay out rode to adequate scope in conditions when working on the foredeck would entail unnecessary risk, I've done the simple math and used the cockpit controls just as you suggest.

I've not yet recovered rode using the cockpit controls.

Al

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Lewmar have their own system, with a magnet contact in the windlass, and an expensive control panel.

But why do we need all this complication? When you're veering chain, the windlass is working at a constant speed, and just counting the amount of time the windlass is on will give you a pretty accurate figure. And you don't need high accuracy for this at all. Even lifting the anchor you will get decent results -- because you really don't care if it's +/- 10% or even 20%, and you're not going to be doing it from the helm anyway if the windlass is bogging down.

So why not a simple time-counter...

We have the Maxwell system; magnet, etc. I don't recall it being all that expensive... and creating an alternative from scratch wouldn't be wise use of my time

That said... and more for readers who may be dealing with rope/chain rode...

Our system is very accurate for chain, not so accurate for the rope portion of our rode (300'). Partly because tension is different, I think; the rope slips a bit on the way out when it's not under slight tension... and partly because the set-up setting isn't perfect (the rode length per revolution is different for rope than for chain).

My next experiment will be to zero the unit when chain is all out, and then just count the rope, do the math.

-Chris

[ontherocks83]

Originally Posted by wingless

Why not just use the in-famous wingless trinary color code to mark the rode?

Because he is at the helm and can't see the chain from there

[IdoraKeeper]

Dockhead, you have plenty of computers aboard. You could use a combination of timer and spreadsheet to output a value with reasonable accuracy. The appearance/ size could be whatever you like. You could then refine the math to be very accurate as you go along.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by wingless

Why not just use the in-famous wingless trinary color code to mark the rode?

Because I can't see it from the helm!

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by ranger42c

We have the Maxwell system; magnet, etc. I don't recall it being all that expensive... and creating an alternative from scratch wouldn't be wise use of my time

That said... and more for readers who may be dealing with rope/chain rode...

Our system is very accurate for chain, not so accurate for the rope portion of our rode (300'). Partly because tension is different, I think; the rope slips a bit on the way out when it's not under slight tension... and partly because the set-up setting isn't perfect (the rode length per revolution is different for rope than for chain).

My next experiment will be to zero the unit when chain is all out, and then just count the rope, do the math.

-Chris

I would just install the Lewmar system and forget about it, but I would have to drill through a watertight bulkhead, install an appropriate cable gland, then run a bloody cable all the way from the bow to the helm, pulling yet another cable through my overcrowded helm cable duct, bleh.

I thought a simple up/down scalable time totalizer might be very simple, if I could find one. No cabling, just pop it into the instrument panel, and set up the scaling. I would even do without the scaling and do the conversion in my head, if I could only find the appropriate cheap totalizer. In that case, practically no installation at all other than cutting the slot in the instrument panel.

[Dockhead]

By the way, the Maxwell rode counter (I think the Lewmar is a stencil brand of the same unit), costs $400! So installation may not be the only consideration here.

[noelex 77]

A couple other options come to mind that might give you the same information in a round about way

1. GPS. Start a waypoint when you drop the anchor some of the units will give you a reading in metres from that waypoint. This has to reasonably close to the amount of chain out.

2. Laser rangefinder. This is great to judge the ideal drop point when Med-mooring. I quick distance measurement will provide reassurance that you not going to run out of chain (or have too little out). You can reverse onto the quay with confidence.

If you do specifically want a chain measurement some cruisers have adapted bicycle computers. These measure distance in the same way as the chain counter, with a magnet on the wheel passing over a fixed sensor. They can be calibrated to allow for different sized wheels although with the small radius of the gypsy you are likely to end up with with some simple mental arithmetic to convert the distance cycled to amount of chain out. Most modern gypsies have a recess for gluing a magnet.

The cycle computers are cheap, however, you will have the same installation problems. Some have wireless sensors, but I think the range will be too short.

[wingless]

Originally Posted by wingless

Why not just use the in-famous wingless trinary color code to mark the rode?

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Because I can't see it from the helm!

My experience is that good anchoring is not based on depth and knowledge of deployed length, both of which I have from my helm.

When I want / need to anchor properly I use the bow switches and watch the rode, letting out more at the appropriate time.


If I were to make a deployed rode indicator, then I would use an up / down counter, like this panel-mount 8-digit counter, along with circuitry to display the desired units.

The method I would use is to amplify the voltage discontinuities created by the brushes transitioning from one commutator segment to the next. That signal would then go to a counter IC. The circuitry would reset counter and increment / decrement the display at the appropriate count for the desired units. The motor polarity would be used to command the up / down display counter.

[NahanniV]

I'm waiting to see a wireless chain counter that uses a smartphone as a display. It could also be a remote switch, but that might be a bit dangerous.

This could be done with something like a Raspberry Pi in a waterproof enclosure for much less than $100.

Installation would be simple for a vertical windless: wire to the windless power (at the windless), glue small magnet on shaft, attach hall effect sensor, connect to the switch wires (for switching and to sense direction).

[Roy M]

I use a Quick chain counter (Chain Counter for Panel) in conjunction with my Lewmar windlass. Most modern windlasses have a recess in the gypsy to install a small magnet which activates a simple magnetic switch with every rotation. I have other projects to attend to so reinventing the wheel was not for me. The Quick allows for remote control up/down as well as keeping track of the chain. In addition, I have a remote handpiece that allows me to perform the same functions at the bow, keeping well away from the chain and gypsy in nasty conditions. Further, I have installed several more up/down rocker switches in the chain locker and elsewhere to allow me to pull and flake chain singlehanded when that's handy. And I'm going to be including a remote switch in a position to assist me when using the windlass to retrieve the dinghy. For all the functionality, it was simpler to pay someone else to do the engineering and fabrication of a quality part.