Bruce or CQR

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Yep, the knuckle weighs too much, they tip over, lay on their side and drag in a wind shift.
The weird thing is, in a 90 degree shift, they may hold as the shank flops over and the anchor stays dug sideways!
The Delta solved the weight ratio issue, but wont hold well in the shift. No knuckle.

Never had a serious issue . Thought I was dragging one time in liberty bay with 30 knots wind. It turned out after I was powered up and ready it was another dragging down on me . Fortress anchor on one side of me and his boat on the other side . Was a real pain to hand haul his anchor and clear from me before it fouled me . My dinner got cold. I was not happy.

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by newhaul

Steve just posted this video

https://youtu.be/aW2OFn-1uak

This whole thing depresses me. I've been using a 20kg Bruce for 24 years, in all kinds of bottoms and all kinds of weather.

For us it has worked really well. Sets quickly and easily, holds against a very strong pull when setting, does not drag even in windy situations, resets when the wind direction changes. I have been extremely happy with it and feel safe.

I have a 30kg Claw as a storm anchor and have used it only twice because the 20kg works so well. On those occasions the bigger anchor set quickly and, of course, held with no problems.

But now the evidence is overwhelming: The Bruce is No Good. I am depressed about it because now I have to live with the feeling that I have an inferior anchor, or spend the bucks to buy a different one. Not happy.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by wingssail

This whole thing depresses me. I've been using a 20kg Bruce for 24 years, in all kinds of bottoms and all kinds of weather.

For us it has worked really well. Sets quickly and easily, holds against a very strong pull when setting, does not drag even in windy situations, resets when the wind direction changes. I have been extremely happy with it and feel safe.

I have a 30kg Claw as a storm anchor and have used it only twice because the 20kg works so well. On those occasions the bigger anchor set quickly and, of course, held with no problems.

But now the evidence is overwhelming: The Bruce is No Good. I am depressed about it because now I have to live with the feeling that I have an inferior anchor, or spend the bucks to buy a different one. Not happy.

The lewmar claw is not a Bruce. Just like a CQR knockoff is not a real CQR
The real thing preforms well but the clones not so much.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

The real test of an anchor is not a straight pull, they all mostly hold in that test , although some far better than others. The real world test is a 90 and 180 pull direction shift. That's what matters.

Exactly and most every time I anchored especially the first few years and the weekend that caused this thread my boat rotated twice through two tide changes as usual.

Sometimes just 180 degrees or so but many times several 360's due to tide, wind, and where I'm anchored

[AndyEss]

My experience (albeit limited) is that a CQR sets and holds well in a medium stiff clay (mud) bottom. I believe most of Cheasepeake Bay has a soft to medium stiff clay bottom.
My experience with a CQR in sand bottoms is that I would do better to tie all my empty beer bottles to a piece of rope and toss them in.

No experience at all with a Bruce.

My 40-50 lb (not sure of size and I’m too lazy to get off my settee to look) Manson Supreme holds well in sand, as long as I haven’t snagged a chuck of coral. It isn’t so good in sea grass either.

[opusnz]

I used a CQR mostly living on the hook for over 20 yrs under all conditions. It would only happen about once every one or two years, but it let me down enough that I would take to tandem anchoring if I thought there was a storm coming or the bottom was suspect. My CQR was oversize and I had good gear and technique but it didn't matter. When I finally changed to an Excel, I couldn't believe the difference. It seems to always set right away and holds much, much better. I might consider one of the other new generation anchors (like a Mantus) but I would never go back.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_NjTRAJ0FU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smgWTtFuk3U

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by opusnz

I used a CQR mostly living on the hook for over 20 yrs under all conditions. It would only happen about once every one or two years, but it let me down enough that I would take to tandem anchoring if I thought there was a storm coming or the bottom was suspect. My CQR was oversize and I had good gear and technique but it didn't matter. When I finally changed to an Excel, I couldn't believe the difference. It seems to always set right away and holds much, much better. I might consider one of the other new generation anchors (like a Mantus) but I would never go back.

This is what I see a lot when folks complain about the CQR that their new gen anchors set right away!

Did the salesman tell you folks that?

My CQR always sets right away. Actually the worn CQR that came with the boat. (No drag; no movement)

I drop it as I am coming into an anchorage after I get the boat slowed down then drift set.

That's pretty much it, but it sets the first time. Not sure how any other anchor could possibly set faster.

But then again, i know the bottoms here, so there is no need for a newer style anchor yet

[boatpoker]

Don't think I could have slept all those years with that rusty chain and worn out hinge pin in the anchor. Guess my risk tolerance is different.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

Don't think I could have slept all those years with that rusty chain and worn out hinge pin in the anchor. Guess my risk tolerance is different.

Actually that setup is fine but I have gone with my spare chain and rode that came with my $2,000 boat and will soon find a replacement CQR at least in the next 3-5 years either 20 or 25lb.

The one in the photo you posted will go on the Bruce after I knock off the rust.

[opusnz]

Originally Posted by thomm225

This is what I see a lot when folks complain about the CQR that their new gen anchors set right away!

Did the salesman tell you folks that?

My CQR always sets right away. Actually the worn CQR that came with the boat. (No drag; no movement)

I drop it as I am coming into an anchorage after I get the boat slowed down then drift set.

That's pretty much it, but it sets the first time. Not sure how any other anchor could possibly set faster.

But then again, i know the bottoms here, so there is no need for a newer style anchor yet

Maybe give some people some credit. I am not a newby. My CQR would normally set right away but once in awhile it would drag and drag. I remember in Tonga once in fairly hard coral sand it would just lay on it's side and dig a furrow across the bottom. Eventually it would grab and you would think it was dug in but chances are when you dove down and had a look it was just hooked on a small piece of coral. In those conditions, (or in others like grass) a sharp new generation anchor that can cut in and dig in deep is much better, more reliable and more forgiving.

A CQR is by no means the worst anchor but if you watch SV Panope's videos linked by myself and others, the difference is obvious.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by opusnz

Maybe give some people some credit. I am not a newby. My CQR would normally set right away but once in awhile it would drag and drag. I remember in Tonga once in fairly hard coral sand it would just lay on it's side and dig a furrow across the bottom. Eventually it would grab and you would think it was dug in but chances are when you dove down and had a look it was just hooked on a small piece of coral. In those conditions, (or in others like grass) a sharp new generation anchor that can cut in and dig in deep is much better, more reliable and more forgiving.

A CQR is by no means the worst anchor but if you watch SV Panope's videos linked by myself and others, the difference is obvious.

Hey I get it.

Some folks enjoy buying stuff for their boats.

The anchor I had the most trouble with to get set was this one pictured or one similar but mostly on seaside..............the ocean side where I grew up not bayside.

[barnakiel]

We had a China fake Bruce knock off on our first round the world trip. It was very good. No issues. We have a "real" Bruce, bigger, now. No problem either.


We had a CQR when we took the boat over back in 2003 and it was the only anchor I ever got rid of. It was a genuine CQR and failed to set on most days.


b.

[Breaking Waves]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

Bruce .... No problem

CQR . . . only anchor I ever got rid of.

exact same with us - lots of Bruce time with no problems, while the first boat I had we got rid of the CQR right quick after some dragging.

However, I do have to say that one of the skippers on the 112'ers I was involved with just loved CQR's and speced one for their rebuild. We tried to talk him out of it and into a more 'modern' anchor but he stood fast. And the Owner says they don't drag with it (including time in Patagonia and South Georgia). It is quite large - which makes up for a lot of design sins.

[opusnz]

thomm225, don't put words in my mouth. I didn't tell you to buy anything. I told you the difference I have found between my new and my older generation anchor. No more and no less. Also, you have no idea on my budget and what I spend money on. If you have never dragged anchor, good for you.


Seriously, I thought we are supposed to be here to help each other. I seldom post here but if all if these forums are filled with keyboard commandos trolling then it becomes about as much fun as staring at a turd. I won't bother.

[opusnz]

Breaking Waves, SV Panope is doing testing on the larger versus smaller Bruce anchors. The theory is that the larger ones are good but the smaller ones don't have the weight or tip pressure to penetrate the bottom....


I had one friend on a heavy ferro 48 footer with a very large Bruce that was very happy it.