Anchoring too close to other boats?

[noelex 77]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Your approach works very well as to wisely using the length of your vessel to add spring to your snubbers and will similarly minimize the swing angle. Do you run your bridle along the deck inside the rail stanchions, or outside through some stand off fair leads outside the stanchions? If on your deck doesn't that lead to some rubbing of the deck and or the sides of your deck house?

There tends to be very little rubbing on the sides because the bow tappers and the twinned bridle meets its joining apex at its connection to the chain rode so the line desires to stand off the boat sides since they are inside the V formed from the widest beam points where the mid ship cleats are typically mounted and your boats freeboard sides generally fall inwards as it beam approaches the water line. The twinned bridle does come into contact if the boat swings angle, but it can't swing angle very much because it gets pulled taught on one side which pulls the hull back toward centered alignment and the opposite side is comparatively eased off when the side that becomes tensioned more takes up more of the total load. Kind of self regulating system.

This configuration is quite similar to how your spring lines don't rub significantly even though your boat swings angle when docked between finger piers of a slip and the boat side lies against a spring line, and also because the bridle doesn't move about much when placed taught under strain shifting just a few degrees vertically since the midship doesn't pitch nearly as significantly. Certainly no more rubbing then occurs when a boat lies onto its fenders at dockside or when med moored and laying against adjoining vessels, or rafting. It is harder for the boat to yaw swing when its bridle attachment points have greater athwartship distance instead of being very nearly in line with the rode direction when attached to just the bow cleats of the anchor roller.

The extra length of the bridle derives much greater stretch capacity and thus greatly reduces the peak loading in both approaches and doesn't increase the swing radius from the anchor. Use the LOA when it can be utilized for advantage. Adding length to the bridle with either of our schemes adds far greater holding power than adding similar distance of chain rode deployment.

In our case the snubber runs from a stern cleat to the bow roller via a couple of low friction rings. The alternative approach, which is just as valid, is to attach a long snubber from the bow to the chain.

For both alternatives there is no need to add more chain. The nylon adds the elasticity and the chain is kept loosely attached to act as a safety backstop in case the snubber breaks.

[Chotu]

The thread has become quite interesting.

I don't want to kill the lively discussion, but I went to a 6:1 scope. All is well.

I'm always over doing it on scope. 10:1 if I have room. Not in these crowded harbors.

Anchor is a 50lbs (or 45??) Manson Supreme with proper shackle and 3/8" BBB chain. Never dragged in my life and I've slept more nights at anchor than I have in a bed on land. I think this is because I'm anal about scope. Lol.

But the answer for me was to reduce scope to fix my mistake.

I also talked to the guy to reassure him I wouldn't let our boats touch. Told him I'd move if we got too close which I did (by reducing scope).

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Really? The other boat would need to be on 1:1 scope for that to be even possible.


In a crowded anchorage, it is quite normal for boats to be over each other's anchors or between boats and their anchors. It's not a big deal to get your anchor up out of a situation like that. That's why no one has mentioned this.


The only semi-complicated issue is if someone lays his anchor chain over yours. That's also not all that big a deal, but we do try to avoid that.

I agree that it is usually possible for the other person to get away without too much drama, bit Chotu COULD be right over his anchor.

For example, if the boat downwind was set on 4:1 his anchor would truly be right below the bow of Chotu's 50' boat.

(in 18' of water, 4:1 would be a radius of 69' not including catenary)

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by wingssail

I agree that it is usually possible for the other person to get away without too much drama, bit Chotu COULD be right over his anchor.

For example, if the boat downwind was set on 4:1 his anchor would truly be right below the bow of Chotu's 50' boat.

(in 18' of water, 4:1 would be a radius of 69' not including catenary)

This is ok. I've had other boats over my anchor before.

They typically just motor up a boat length or so to allow me to grab my anchor from under them. Happened to me in this very same anchorage before. Funny coincidence

[scallowayuk]

you were being inconsiderate, supposed he had to move,with you 20ft from his bow how does he do that.ive been in this situation .very uncomfortable and as boatman said its never too dark to move.

[scallowayuk]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Really? The other boat would need to be on 1:1 scope for that to be even possible.


In a crowded anchorage, it is quite normal for boats to be over each other's anchors or between boats and their anchors. It's not a big deal to get your anchor up out of a situation like that. That's why no one has mentioned this.


The only semi-complicated issue is if someone lays his anchor chain over yours. That's also not all that big a deal, but we do try to avoid that.

no the other boat would just need about a minimum of 40ft of chain or more for his anchor to be under the boat in front.and if its a big deal depends on the boat in front.what if theres nobody on board.and your singlehanded.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by scallowayuk

you were being inconsiderate, supposed he had to move,with you 20ft from his bow how does he do that.ive been in this situation .very uncomfortable and as boatman said its never too dark to move.

I moved and also talked to the guy saying I was too close. How was that inconsiderate?

In a dark harbor filled with boats, mooring balls and random small floats, yes, it can be too dark to move.

Lastly, anyone over someone else's anchor just needs to motor forward slightly to let the other person retrieve their anchor.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by wingssail

I agree that it is usually possible for the other person to get away without too much drama, bit Chotu COULD be right over his anchor.

For example, if the boat downwind was set on 4:1 his anchor would truly be right below the bow of Chotu's 50' boat.

(in 18' of water, 4:1 would be a radius of 69' not including catenary)

OK, fair enough.


But what problem would that be? That's really a non-issue.

Originally Posted by Chotu

. . . Lastly, anyone over someone else's anchor just needs to motor forward slightly to let the other person retrieve their anchor.

This

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by scallowayuk

no the other boat would just need about a minimum of 40ft of chain or more for his anchor to be under the boat in front.and if its a big deal depends on the boat in front.what if theres nobody on board.and your singlehanded.

You just gently push the other boat out of the way with your hands. Put fenders out if necessary. I've done it a million times. It is an absolutely standard situation in crowded anchorages and no big deal.

[gma4]

You were anchored there for three days, during which time you were obviously concerned, because of the stormy and windy conditions, that you had anchored too close. In the time it took you to write up your note, and post it to this site, you could have moved.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by gma4

You were anchored there for three days, during which time you were obviously concerned, because of the stormy and windy conditions, that you had anchored too close. In the time it took you to write up your note, and post it to this site, you could have moved.

3 days, huh? And where does it say that?

Where, also, does it say I'm concerned about stormy and windy conditions?

Just making things up out of thin air at this point?

The only concerns here are ones of anchoring etiquette and discussing an interesting development that everyone with a boat has been through once or twice.

[AKA-None]

A misunderstanding of the original post where you said 3 days ago and wind coming up.

[gma4]

Chotu: Your original post said: "I dropped anchor in a fairly crowded harbor 3 days ago.."
and "...as the winds are increasing and changing through some storms..."

I am at a loss as to how you can say that I made that up. Is that not in your original post?

Yes, this is all about anchoring etiquette, and your admission that you were wrong shows that you don't have any.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Chotu

3 days, huh? And where does it say that?

Where, also, does it say I'm concerned about stormy and windy conditions?

Just making things up out of thin air at this point?

Post #1:



I dropped anchor in a fairly crowded harbor 3 days ago. We were tired from the sail and the girlfriend was paying out the chain while I kept the boat on station.
...

Now with the anchor holding well we are just a bit closer than I had planned to the other boat.

As the winds are increasing and changing through storms apparently our chain was straightened out even more putting us even closer to this guy.

I can't be more than 20 feet off his bow now if winds are lining up just wrong. ...

It's night time right now and the winds are lining up just wrong....

[noelex 77]

I think it would be nice to foster a culture on Cruisers Forum where members can acknowledge and document mistakes, so that we can all learn from the experience.

I would hope that members can start threads such as this without adverse comments, but rather receive constructive suggestions on how the problem could have been avoided or remedied.

So thanks Chotu for a great thread and having the courage to report a situation that did not work exactly as planned .