Unreliable Outboards

[foggysail]

I check no failures BUT! There was one time I used fuel that had gross water contamination. Heck, that was not the engine's fault. I also had other troubles but the engine continued to operate.

My old Yamaha 8HP 2 stroke started to build with salt in hte cooling circuit after about 15 years of use. I tried using vinegar with moderate success. But along came an opportunity to purchase a Mercury 8HP 2 stroke almost new for less than half the new price. That is the engine I currently use.

Again I had trouble with this engine BUT AGAIN, IT WAS NOT THE ENGINE'S FAULT!!!

The engine started leaking oil on the deck below where I store the dinghy along with the mounted engine. This baffled me! I condemned the manufacturer for using poor oil seals. I purchase the tool to remove the lower unit and rebuilt it completely including the water pump. THE THING CONTINUED TO LEAK OIL!!!

I was bitching about this in a forum back then when someone responded " do you think it could be unburned oil from the fuel???" He was RIGHT ON!!! I never measured the oil mixture in either engine, I just poured into the gas. If more oil is mixed, things will be better. Not so!!!

I started measuring the oil mixture to 50:1. No more oil leaks on the deck. There are two things I do not like about the Mercury (2001 vintage). First it is over 15#s heavier than the Yamaha and second, it is much louder. But again, the engine itself runs reliably.

Foggy

[marshmat]

Re. those who are having problems with ethanol gas. I'm really curious what additives your fuel companies are putting in the stuff, and what flaws there are in their storage tanks.

I say this because I routinely leave 10% ethanol summer gas sitting in the shed for nine months, mixed with outboard oil and a shot of stabilizer, and even in the little old 9.9 (a '79 Johnson) this fuel burns just fine. We're always careful to keep the tanks properly capped (so no water gets in) and our fuel suppliers are all very good about filtering at the pump and checking their tanks with each new batch of fuel. I suspect many of those who are having trouble with ethanol gas are getting it pre-contaminated from less-than-meticulous suppliers.

[schoonerdog]

No, the people having issues with ethanol are those with 4 stroke engines. Doesn't matter the fuel source (unless you get aviation gas like we do where you don't have to worry about ethanol). Outboard mechanics will tell you to empty it out if you're going to be leaving it for more than a few days. 2 stroke users don't seem to have any issues.

[donradcliffe]

The problems with ethanol are not restricted to 4-strokes, and come from the propensity of ethanol to abosorb water. Various bacteria grow in that water, forming chunks which clog carburators. The high humidity on the water causes problems on stored motors on boats.

As posted earlier, the best defense is to run the fuel out of the carburator before letting the engine sit for more than a week. I have seen bits forming in the bottoms of the fuel tanks, but the screens and filters tend to prevent them from being a problem.

[Triton318]

I never had a problem with my 2000 Nissan 9.8 (2 cycle) in the entire seven and a half years I used it on my 28' Pearson sailboat. It never failed to start on at least the second pull. It never quit on me. I took it home once a year in the winter and did the manufacturer's recommended maintenance. That motor was one of the best purchases I ever made for my boat. It was a great engine! I never added any additives to the gasoline either.

[tdpilot]

Simply running the engine dry before shutdown, (unplug the gas line from the engine, and let it die from fuel starvation), is just about the best technique you can use to keep your engine running trouble-free.
Reason is that getting ALL of the gas/oil out of the engine prevents the sludge/varnish that builds up in everything when any residual gas/oil dries out.
This from a lifetime aircraft mechanic.

[tdpilot]

Addit'l note about ethanol gas. If you store the gas in a manner that there is no possibility of outside air getting in, (the cap "snug", but not tight), the ethanol will pretty quickly evaporate out, which is not a bad thing. Ethanol is NOT good stuff for gasoline!
The problem is if there is any air allowed to come in contact with the gas. If that happens over a period longer than a week, then the ethanol will very quickly absorb water, which all alcohols will do. That's when the trouble starts.
Water in any fuel system is big-time bad news. I once had an older fuel system that the fuel level float completely rusted off and was laying in the bottom of the tank because the water that had been absorbed by the alcohol promoted the corrosion within the system.
Also, if you have an older system that was designed before the alcohol use, you have a strong chance of having rubber components in the system that the alcohol will quite literally dissolve. Any alcohol is acid to older rubber components. That's why a lot of the fuel lines from portable outboard tanks quickly get so hard they are unusable.

[GeoPowers]

Originally Posted by GeoPowers

The only problem I've had so far was with the pull start locking up, but it was an easy fix. I have a Ya-mama 4hp 4-stroke. We run it about 5 times a month in winter, 10 or more in the summer. Usually low to medium RPM's.

I will say that my wife always has trouble starting it! I've watched her, and it seems like she does everything right. I just have the magic touch...(This really ticks her off)

A year and a half later, and after moving to the East Coast, my outboard is my new bane. Most PNW marinas had no ethanol, but now here in MD I can't find any pure gas within reasonable driving range. My outboard is now MUCH more unreliable. I'm on carb cleaning number 3, and I even paid to have it serviced once (with about the same results as me cleaning it). Frustrating!!!!!!!!!!! I've changed the fuel, started using sta-bil, changed filters, flushed fuel lines, nothing seems to work. I'm hoping that my carb cleaning bath I did last time wasn't for long enough, and I'll leave it in for at least 6 hours this time. Free beer to anyone that can get it running reliably again!

Frank

[David M]

We went through this at work with all our small outboard boats.

The only sure fire solution I know of to ethanol related problems is fuel injection. There are no chemicals that work. I tried every chemical that I could find.

What helps somewhat is to burn all the fuel out of the engine by disconnecting the fuel line and letting it die from fuel starvation. This keeps gas from sitting in the carb and then evaporating away leaving a residue behind which clogs the fuel jets.

Frequent use also helps if you have that option.

[hogesinwa]

Same issue on a brand new Honda. Had it fixed by Hudsons down here at the Narrows. They specify additive AND letting it run right out by disconnecting and burning whatever's in there. Also, keeping the tank out of direct sunlight plus a towel over the tank etc etc. Runs beautifully now.

[Highlander40]

I always use stabilizer now.
Recently tried some cleaner by Amsoil called Quickshot. A two stroke tiller had sat unused for over ten years, would not idle but after force feeding treated fuel for an hour, it runs like new. That experience opened my eyes.

I have also noticed that my Yamaha 8hp two stroke outboard runs cleaner with synthetic oil. Regular oil leaves residue running down below the exaust.

[HappySeagull]

Seagulls run fine on 50:1. I use 40:1.
2 stroke oil has come a long way since 1942.

You and your Seagull can be on the "No-problem Podium"

The best tip for these is to DUMP the first gas out of the bowl before pulling that cord..Dump it in back into the tank if you must.The fuel line from tank to bowl is a sort of settling bowl,see?That's why they were originally a clear tube.But it doesn't matter if it's dry.Follow direction.
If they don't start 1st pull,worry.If they don't start third pull,stop pulling and fix.That probably applies to all 2 strokes.
I have mine set up to easily remove bowl and not lose the bowl overboard with a safety line.You need this.Water gets into the bowl.And you don't need to waste gas running them dry then either.Try it.You'll see.

....the bottom end will be full of mayonnaise.The bushings are always worn out.Nobody ever replaces them...They always leave a slick of gear oil behind.

Seagulls do shut off when you throttle off.If they don't, they are wrong.

[schoonerdog]

Hey Frank,

Again, I had the same issue. It's only a matter of time with ethanol. Do this, replace your carborator (that may be less than actually paying to get it cleaned), get rid of the old fuel in your dingy tank, then use avgas from the closest airport.

Good luck!

Originally Posted by GeoPowers

A year and a half later, and after moving to the East Coast, my outboard is my new bane. Most PNW marinas had no ethanol, but now here in MD I can't find any pure gas within reasonable driving range. My outboard is now MUCH more unreliable. I'm on carb cleaning number 3, and I even paid to have it serviced once (with about the same results as me cleaning it). Frustrating!!!!!!!!!!! I've changed the fuel, started using sta-bil, changed filters, flushed fuel lines, nothing seems to work. I'm hoping that my carb cleaning bath I did last time wasn't for long enough, and I'll leave it in for at least 6 hours this time. Free beer to anyone that can get it running reliably again!

Frank

[GeoPowers]

So far so good this weekend- puttered around Solomon's with no issues, and ran the carb dry. Although I will not tempt fate and declare victory. Regardless, you can still have a free beer on me.

Frank

[zeehag]

inline fuel filters help a lot and make a huge difference for low dollar output. made my outboards a lot more reliable.