Dinghy Disappointment :(/Dinghy Joy :)

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

Thank you for insulting me and my boat, I'll remember it

Just to check on how well your boat is thought out, I would appreciate a picture of it with the dinghy in stored position. I am including mine below; pls. note the solar panels on top as well as satellite and other antennas:

Well, I was teasing you a little -- hope you caught that. I think you know pretty well how much I admire your boat.


Of course if you want solar and all that, you've got no choice but build a junk pile ( ) on your after deck.

Your boat is 11' longer than mine, so can better afford it anyway -- it's proportionally smaller in relation to the rest of the boat. It would be horrible on my boat.

We had a "junk pile" on the previous boat, which was more tropical (kept in Florida) -- arch, davits, solar panels, engine hoist, etc. We never sailed in anything over F6 so it was ok.

But up here with all the heavy weather sailing we do, and plans to go further and further North, I just don't want all the windage, hence no solar, now minimal davits which won't be used in heavy weather or longer passages. I miss the solar, but everything is a compromise.

[Palarran]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

In my opinion, there are two really good ways to store a dinghy, and only two I know of -- a dinghy garage (if you look at the way it's done on the HR64 -- that's what my next boat will have), or foredeck. On big enough boats you can have a kind of well in the foredeck a RIB can fit down into -- that's very cool and even better than a dinghy garage, but I think probably not practical on a boat less than 70' or so.

There is a third, but you would have to join the dark side

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Well, I was teasing you a little -- hope you caught that. I think you know pretty well how much I admire your boat.

I know that and you know me too good

Still waiting for that picture though, and you should trade that dinghy and outboard

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Palarran

There is a third, but you would have to join the dark side

Yes, I actually agree! With a catamaran, davits work much better for a few different reasons including no heeling, and also because the lifted dinghy fits between the hulls rather than sticking out behind the transom.

The downside though is weight and trim which is an issue with cats -- so the dinghy can't be too heavy.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

I know that and you know me too good

Still waiting for that picture though, and you should trade that dinghy and outboard

I'll snap one when I get a chance.


My bad feelings about the new dinghy have evaporated, however. It fits so nicely in the small davits, so securely! Now I know I'm going to be tempted to never deflate and store it -- human nature. But at least I can.

With the motor off, it's only 43 kg. Only problem is windage.


My next boat, which will be custom made, and which will be metal (I've already written 100 pages of specifications for it, and with major inspiration from the Sundeer), will follow the Dashew idea of having a narrow beam and light, empty ends, with watertight bulkheads separating them from the passenger space. So the dinghy garage (actually, a very large lazarette with a way to pull the dinghy in through an opening transom) will be aft of the walk-in engine room, and will look something like what the HR 64 has. This limits the size of the dinghy, but I think I will be able to get in something like my old one, 11' or so, maybe with inboard jet propulsion. This will not be like the dinghy garages on Hanses, which are just narrow spaces under the cockpit floor, but a large lazarette area with access from above as well as through the transom, and with lots of deck storage besides space for the dink.

The logic is that unless you carry the dinghy on the foredeck, it's going to be sticking out causing windage and making LOA in any case. It's far better to have it enclosed and adding to your waterline length.


I have a good friend whose main dinghy (out of 3) is a 24' RIB with pilot house and inboard diesel. We've had some fun on that.

He just carries it on deck on chocks. Of course it's a 60 meter motor vessel, so he doesn't have the storage problems we do

[Kenomac]

The brand new four stroke 6hp Tohatsu purchased for our previous boat came with very specific directions for the initial "break in" period. One requirement was to NOT use full throttle for the first ten hours or so.... as I recall.

Our current outboard is a fourteen year old 15hp two stroke Mercury.

Here's the Tohatsu break in directions:

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

The brand new four stroke 6.5hp Tohatsu purchased for our previous boat came with very specific directions for the initial "break in" period. One requirement was to NOT use full throttle for the first five hours or so.... as I recall.

Our current outboard is a fourteen year old 15hp two stroke Mercury.

Mine was not new. Nearly so, but certainly broken in.


In any case, the problem is now identified and solved and all is well. I like this motor. It's simple and very light, light like a two stroke. Has a belt driven (!) overhead cam. Like the Italians like. I'll live with it for a while and see.


Is your Mercury the American one, or the Tohatsu stencil brand?

My previous dinghy had a 15 year old Mariner 25hp two stroke, American made, and what a great engine!!! Smooth and very responsive and powerful, always started with half a pull (the electric start was completely superfluous). Totally reliable -- in seven years of hard use in my ownership, not one significant problem, and certainly never a problem which disabled it. I wish every device or system on the boat were like that.

It was starting to rust apart, however, so definitely time to sell it on.

It only had two drawbacks: drank huge amounts of fuel, and too large and heavy to take off the dinghy, meaning it had to be carried in the davits.

[Kenomac]

The two stroke Mercury is a 2002 model.

[Panope]

Custom boat (not mine). The dinghy garage is one of many innovative features designed by the owner.

Steve

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hc5c7mMlUIk

[a64pilot]

My old Mariner 25 HP, was actually I believe a Yamaha, but it was on OLD one, late 80's.
One of the better running two strokes, one I got the carb dialed in


The following is from "The Legend of Mercury" by Jeffrey L. Rodengen (1998), starting at page 158:

In 1972 (a year that proved extraordinarily busy for Mercury), Brunswick bought a minority interest in Yamaha manufacturing. The plan was to diversity distribution in the United States by adding another brand of outboard engine to cover the market. At the time, Mercury and OMC (with Johnson and Evinrude products) each maintained about 30 percent of the market. The second-brand strategy was meant to give Mercury a second bite of the same apple, even though Mariner would in effect be competing against Mercury engines.

According to the terms of the agreement, Mercury provided Yamaha with second-generation blueprints and taught the japanese manufacturer how to build quality engines, including methods to reduce corrosion (and other metallurgical technology). Under the joint venture, Yamaha and Brunswick owned equal shares in a Yamaha subsidiary, Sanshin Kogyo Company, manufacturer of outboard motors. The subsidiary sold all its outboards to Yamaha, which in turn sold the motors to Brunswick, which then marketed the motors under the Mariner name. For Brunswick, the new outboard was called Mariner to offer, according to Reichert, "an image different than that of the high performance image of Mercury, using the idea of the "ancient mariner" of reliability and durability.

[s/v Jedi]

The problem with the dinghy garage will be that a good dinghy does not fit in. The perception of what a good dinghy is will change drastically when moving from Europe to the tropics. We have huge graveyards of either small or any size pvc dinghies here. The 10' / 3.1m hypalon RIB with big tubes with 15hp 2-stroke is the right size for starters.

Thei ghies that I see in the sailboat garage have a bow that digs into every wave of 1' and up.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Palarran

There is a third, but you would have to join the dark side

Why is there a flotation collar on the engine, looks like a ski belt.

[TeddyDiver]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

The problem with the dinghy garage will be that a good dinghy does not fit in. The perception of what a good dinghy is will change drastically when moving from Europe to the tropics. We have huge graveyards of either small or any size pvc dinghies here. The 10' / 3.1m hypalon RIB with big tubes with 15hp 2-stroke is the right size for starters.

Thei ghies that I see in the sailboat garage have a bow that digs into every wave of 1' and up.

That's true with most dinghy garages but there's a solution. A nesting dinghy in a garage can double the length of the dinghy.

[a64pilot]

Mine is I believe the perfect size for us, 3.1 Meter and 20 HP.
But I would like to find a lighter, possibly better made one, we do want a flat floor though so that means double hull.
Lockable locker isn't as useful as I once thought it would be, and if you have a double hull, you need to have a way to drain the space between the hulls, I had to add that, only partially successful I believe.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

The problem with the dinghy garage will be that a good dinghy does not fit in. The perception of what a good dinghy is will change drastically when moving from Europe to the tropics. We have huge graveyards of either small or any size pvc dinghies here. The 10' / 3.1m hypalon RIB with big tubes with 15hp 2-stroke is the right size for starters.

Thei ghies that I see in the sailboat garage have a bow that digs into every wave of 1' and up.

Yes, I understand that different cruising areas demand different dinghies, and I think I've experienced it all myself.

I've had different dinghies, from 9' AB to 11' Avon to several others, all Hypalon (never PVC!), soft floor, air floor, RIBs, with different motors ranging from 2.3 HP to 25 HP.

As always, it's all a painful compromise, and I don't know what the naval architect will be able to achieve in the event, but my design brief asks to try at least to fit in an 11' RIB, definitely wheel steered, either something like my old one, or something like the Avon Seasport 330 Jet. The jet tender is no good for pulling up on a beach, and will have less carrying capacity than the more truck-like normal RIB, but with 100 horsepower (!!) is an entirely different ball game for range and capability to explore.

If that can't be made to fit, then the next size smaller Avon heavy RIB, like the 315 Rover, which can carry over 1000 pounds.

Or maybe an aluminum hull RIB which would be lighter.