Dinghy. Davits or foredeck on ocean crossing

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by wingssail

Even if you secure the dingy to absolutely prevent any movement the momentum of 250# weight plus the weight of the arch and davits themselves and the solar panels up there are still trying to move the back of the boat. It is momentum both in pitch and roll which is happening. This affects the boat's natural motion in the waves and places stress on the davit attachments. And then there is windage.

And today (I wish I'd photographed it) a boat left the anchorage with a dingy on the davits just above deck level, which introduces another risk. The ends of that dingy extended beyond the width of the vessel by a couple of feet. If they take a knock down or a strong gust heels them well over it is likely that the projecting end of the dingy will drag in the water, which will present a huge force on the dingy and whole structure. Obviously the choice then it to raise it up, which obscures the view aft, or way up allowing you to see under it, but exacerbating the weight and momentum aloft.

I am convinced the dingy suspended on davits aft is not the best for heavy weather seamanship or even simply comfort in a seaway and not good for performance, sailing or motoring. It is simply thought of as a more convenient way of storing the dingy and the downsides are rationalized or diminished in importance.

But I recognize that every skipper has his own opinion and there is no one right way.

Those are all absolutely valid concerns. As far as the effect on pitching as well as risk of pooping the dinghy, hull shape will be a factor. A boat with a wide stern and tons of buoyancy aft will carry a dinghy in davits better than a double ender would, for example. The more buoyant stern will lift more easily, so short of breaking waves, it'll be harder to poop the dinghy and the weight aft will also have less effect on pitching, as the center of pitch rotation will tend to be further aft.

A dinghy longer than the boat is wide is definitely a concern. In my mind, that's pretty much a hard limit of how large a dinghy can be carried in davits by any boat (even powerboats). Once the dinghy extends beyond the beam at the aft end of the boat, you start to get into additional challenges and problems.

The weight aloft for roll is the biggest concern that can't be mitigated I think. Of course, it depends on how heavy the dinghy is relative to the boat, but the effect will always be there. Windage is also a problem, but if you've already got a setup with a dodger, bimini (with maybe some solar panels on top), etc. then the dinghy is relatively speaking not a huge windage penalty. But if you're going from a clean cockpit or just a dodger to a dinghy hoisted way up in big davits, then you're adding a ton of windage.

[MJH]

Originally Posted by skipmac

Just installed new, stronger davits that should bear the weight just fine but coastal and near shore trips it's still pretty difficult to secure the dinghy so it doesn't swing around in a seaway.

Also davits are high enough that I have about zero concerns of taking a wave into the dinghy.

Last trip I did manage to brace the dinghy well enough in the davits that it just barely swayed a bit but this was in max 4-5' seas or in some long 6-8' swells.

But crossing the ocean where bigger stuff might happen?

My conservative soul says foredeck better than davits but am I being too conservative? Obviously if it does get nasty offshore and I find the dinghy isn't doing well on the davits it will be too late to change.

I can understand why sailors want to use dinghy davits, its handy and makes launching and stowage easier. Thats OK for inland waters but not so for offshore or passage making where waves are bigger, winds are stronger, and weather can be a surprise. I'm sure there are folks who have used davits offshore without regret but it is poor planning; they were outliers. You just don't want to get caught with a dinghy dangling off the stern when @#$% hits the fan...you have other more important things to be concerned with. It all falls under prior planning for the worst. And I would NEVER have a dinghy on davits with the outboard installed like I have seen.

After the purchase of my new-to-me boat I removed and sold the davits and install a windvane for the offshore waters I expected to cross, a much better investment for me. On our roundtrip to Hawaii the rubber dinghy was stored in the quarter berth during both crossings, same for a Gulf of Mexico crossing. While cruising on coastal inlet waters it is either being towed or on the deck depending on the day's weather forecast and distance to be traveled.

I have had two regrets towing the dinghy in inland coastal waters. In both cases the wind got surprisingly very high. On my first experience the dinghy flipped but luckily the motor was not installed and I diverted to the nearest marina for the night. On the other occasion I was exiting British Columbia's 35nm Bute Inlet and the funneled incoming wind was gusting to 35K and I was afraid to turn around for the possibility of losing the dinghy so just pulled it in close and continued on for the rest of the day and evening with speeds down to 2.5K until exiting the inlet; there are no suitable anchorages there. I learned a hard lesson about inlet winds.

Good Luck.

[MicHughV]

Most davits also serve as a platform for solar panels.....so it's a fairly braced system
I hoist the dink using the davits block and tackle system and then throw two wide nylon straps around the bottom of the dink and over the davit cross-bar and cinch tight.
Additionally, I tie two ropes in an X over the dink to prevent side to side movement.
By the time I'm done, it's immovable.

Oh yeah, I pull the drain plug.

Can't say I've ever had a problem, the solar panels provide quite a bit of cover, so even when it rains, little gets in the dink.

I used to carry it on the foredeck, but seeing as the aft tubes, straddled the mast, found that it impeded my movements there.

[Capn Rick]

You could use stand-off brackets. Weaver makes them for their tilt up davits, but looks like they would work to steady the dinghy in a standard davit by attaching to the transom.

[Capn Rick]

Weaver website: https://www.weaverindustries.com/ind...stand-offs.htm
Sorry, forgot to add.

[BBill]

I suppose it matters where you are sailing and if you plan on running under bare poles dragging anything. A dink on davits will be a monkey on your back if the s#!&*t hits the fan and a deck mounted dink not so much. I kept a rigid sailing dink upright on deck in chocks with a massively heavy weight canvas cover to keep water out...42' x 24k lb cutter. No worries. I would do an inflatable before doing anything on davits for ocean crossing...and I hate inflatables.

[Nepidae]

You've gotten a lot of replies.

Being a tra×ler owner we went to David's after trying a number of things.

If you're going to keep a motor attached then David's are also the best choice, most 4 stroke engines like to be upright.

Look at Atkins & Hoyle out of Canada. Best I found.

Good luck.

[Elie]

I have met very large breaking waves between US East Coast and Bermudas. In the Gulf Stream. A dinghy exposed in davits would have been a significant added trouble and certainlly an added worry. On the foredeck or over the roof is a much secure way to do it. But if it is just a passage when calmer weather is forecasted, davits would be a good option. Just remember that the weather paterns are not as reliable for more than a few short days.

[sck5]

Having been hit with unforecasted extremely unpleasant weather between the East Coast and Bermuda, I am happy I had the dink on the foredeck. Way too much windage aft and it would have been torn off by the storm we had. Besides, the only way to really find out if the davits were strong enough is to have wind and waves strong enough to rip the dink off. Not the moment to discover the answer.

[OneBoatman]

Everything depends on the dimensions of your boat and what make sense for you. I have an older offshore sloop equipped with the early Edson cast aluminum davits. Very strong and will carry my 4 H.P. Yamaha mounted for near coastal cruising but this is not how I sail when making a passage offshore. I'm not fond of carrying the dinghy abnormally high or sailing with the extra windage and weight at the stern because it is un-seamanlike and at some point a liability in severe weather. Others adopt the theory that if they get pooped from behind they are already dealing with more than they bargained for. I think a wave breaking over a dinghy on davits could cause a lot of damage that wouldn't happen if there were no dinghy there. My solution was to buy an Acquilles FX 300 because while it is a RIB in that the bottom is hard, the transom folds down just the same as their original inflatables so it fits deflated between my mast and the dodger in its valise and I can still see over it through the dodger. I'm not a salesman, but you do what your comfortable with, some people opt for the inflatable bottom dinghys due to space considerations, others are ok with their dinghy raised high on davits, or are OK with it laying on the foredeck, some put a hard bottom dinghy on chocks right in front of their dodger or on the foredeck. I'm sure everyone hopes the seas stay under 15' but that's not always going to happen.

[Triumph]

One very possible issue with dinghy on Davits is taking a knockdown. Not that uncommon offshore in stormy weather. Now imagine your boat on its side doing 8 knots. With a quarter wake rising up at the stern. Will the nose or tail of the dink be in the water? Good chance the answer is yes.

Stand on the dock and look down the side of your boat. Where will the nose of the dinghy be in a knockdown?

Image the force of dragging the bow of your dinghy through the water at 8 knots. Something will give.

Better to strap it down on deck if possible.

Bill
Www.thebookofsail.com

[col50]

Imagine the force of a dinghy trying to float when submerged on the deck or on davits.
That force is probably greater than what a flooded dinghy exerts.

[merrydolphin]

My Cal 46 had massive custom SS Davies. I could haul up my C-12 caribe with electric start 25hp Yamaha 2 stroke, gas can and battery etc. Then after up could climb into the dingy to work on it. ( I weigh near 200 lbs.). I lashed down the dingy very tightly using bow, stern and then crossed spring lines all very tightly tensioned. For a serious sea passage I would remove the motor and mount on solid bracket on the Mizzenmast. Could I lose the whole rig in a bad storm? I suppose so but never did in tens of thousands of miles. In heavy weather a wave might slap the bottom of the dingy a little.

Agaln these were not your typical davits. The previous owner paid a LOT to have them made and mounted.

[Muaddib1116]

Originally Posted by merrydolphin

My Cal 46 had massive custom SS Davies. I could haul up my C-12 caribe with electric start 25hp Yamaha 2 stroke, gas can and battery etc. Then after up could climb into the dingy to work on it. ( I weigh near 200 lbs.). I lashed down the dingy very tightly using bow, stern and then crossed spring lines all very tightly tensioned. For a serious sea passage I would remove the motor and mount on solid bracket on the Mizzenmast. Could I lose the whole rig in a bad storm? I suppose so but never did in tens of thousands of miles. In heavy weather a wave might slap the bottom of the dingy a little.

Agaln these were not your typical davits. The previous owner paid a LOT to have them made and mounted.

Sounds pretty awesome. I'd love to sea a picture of those.