Beaching Legs

[Anomaly]

Originally Posted by boatman61

that is standard procedure...
We called it 'reconnoitering'...
Then you mark it on your chart... triangulated... for future use

Precisely!. Or, to put it another way, isn't that what God made tides for?--- Reconnoitering new/strange beaches and harbors prior to drying out? (and, of course, also so harbor "grids" (another invention from the pre-travel lift era) would be possible)

[goboatingnow]

That's exactly what I meAn which is why the OPs comments 're adjustable legs rings wrong. You always know in advance where to deploy legs. It's not a guessing game

Dave

[Anomaly]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

You always know in advance where to deploy legs. It's not a guessing game

Dave

Huh? Just because you have observed the bottom doesn't mean its going to be as smooth as a runway tarmac..... This conversation strikes me as curiously inflexible. Almost every other critical system on a "well found" sailing vessel is adjustable (e.g., shrouds, engine shaft alignment...) and yet in this area where all agree its critical to get the loads distributed between the keel and the two legs correctly, it as if you need NO ability to adjust whatsoever. So the world cruiser a) only deploys where they locate tarmac levelness or b) deploys and adjusts to the conditions they have scouted out in advance? Seems to me if the answer is (a) one might just skip carrying the legs at all (except in one's home port) because those conditions might truly be a blue moon occasion. Sheesh, the stands one uses at haulout yards are adjustable and they ARE on tarmac (frequently)..... Not much more to discuss I guess. I'm off to look up the (adjustable) Herreshoff design mentioned earlier

[Laidback]

Here is picture of sailboat - fin keel careened to a pier starboard side and supported on port by a Leg -- leg base is on firm footing.
If one does not know the ground not a good idea just to trust your mind gossip.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Anomaly

Huh? Just because you have observed the bottom doesn't mean its going to be as smooth as a runway tarmac..... This conversation strikes me as curiously inflexible. Almost every other critical system on a "well found" sailing vessel is adjustable (e.g., shrouds, engine shaft alignment...) and yet in this area where all agree its critical to get the loads distributed between the keel and the two legs correctly, it as if you need NO ability to adjust whatsoever. So the world cruiser a) only deploys where they locate tarmac levelness or b) deploys and adjusts to the conditions they have scouted out in advance? Seems to me if the answer is (a) one might just skip carrying the legs at all (except in one's home port) because those conditions might truly be a blue moon occasion. Sheesh, the stands one uses at haulout yards are adjustable and they ARE on tarmac (frequently)..... Not much more to discuss I guess. I'm off to look up the (adjustable) Herreshoff design mentioned earlier

Hahahahaha ..... Thats very true.... but you forgot one major factor in the above.... your boats usually in a Travel Hoist while your running round adjusting those legs...
The fact is... very often you don't need to see the bottom 'Tide out'... the general lay of the coast/terrain/beach will tell you... if your off a rocky shore.. chances are pretty good you've a rocky bottom... of a sandy beach much the same below...
Your looking for sheltered waters for this so if you think about it... except in dirty rivers your pretty much gonna be able to see the bottom most times...
If your boat draws 5ft... you don't sit in 10ft waiting for the drop... you move in till you 'kiss'... just make sure your on the right side of the Springs or Neaps....lol

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by Anomaly

Huh? Just because you have observed the bottom doesn't mean its going to be as smooth as a runway tarmac..... This conversation strikes me as curiously inflexible. Almost every other critical system on a "well found" sailing vessel is adjustable (e.g., shrouds, engine shaft alignment...) and yet in this area where all agree its critical to get the loads distributed between the keel and the two legs correctly, it as if you need NO ability to adjust whatsoever. So the world cruiser a) only deploys where they locate tarmac levelness or b) deploys and adjusts to the conditions they have scouted out in advance? Seems to me if the answer is (a) one might just skip carrying the legs at all (except in one's home port) because those conditions might truly be a blue moon occasion. Sheesh, the stands one uses at haulout yards are adjustable and they ARE on tarmac (frequently)..... Not much more to discuss I guess. I'm off to look up the (adjustable) Herreshoff design mentioned earlier

Was pondering this thread a bit more last night.........

.......Obviously different folk have different posting styles - me goes for providing some information (or at least pointers in a direction) rather than laying down absolutes, nor claiming to be able to provide the whole (or the only) answers.

That's not only because I am nice , it's so I can't later get blamed

Others prefer a more blunt approach.........that has the benefit of being succinct


In regard to Legs, you are forgetting the Secret Weapon - Wellington Boots If you are not sure, then not only look - go and have a wander around. Maybe even with a boat hook to prod around. Everyone likes a firm bottom , but appearances can sometimes be deceptive

Apart from avoiding too much of a slope (accorss the beam) you also want to avoid the keel being on solid ground and the Loadbearing leg on soft *****. or in thin air (can happen in tidal harbours with banked streams created). 2 foot to the left ok. 2 foot to the right = leg in thin air

Adjustable legs won't automatically avoid this turning into a disaster, as you won't know how far the leg will sink until it does. nor whether that is too far. More rare, but still possible, is that legs on solid ground and keel sinking = boat dangling in the middle

Upshot is that (IMO ) anyone who sails to a new port with legs and immediately dries out without being 100% sure that the ground is suitable for their (standard / non adjustable) Legs is an idiot

You make a good point about the stands used to prop up boats on the hard being adjustable. That's because they are used by different shaped and sized boats. Their are 3 benefits I can see for adjustable legs a) easier to sell (as don't need to be made exact - customer does final fit) b) Customer gets an exact fit for their boat and c) resale - would fit other vessels. Adjusted when used? Not for me. If the bottom ain't suitable for standard legs then I wouldn't moor her their.

I did a google on the boat in your bio - my concern would be if the balance point was back past the keel then possible that legs would act as 2 parts of a tripod, rather than just props (with keel carrying the weight). Not to say that can't do this (Beneteau? do some models where the twin rudders fulfil this tripod function) but would want to make sure that both the legs and the reinforcement to the hull at the leg fixing point was designed with this in mind.

My gut reaction on a fin keeler like that is not to bother, a fuller keel gives more option on leg location and unless moored in a drying harbour 95% of your drying out needs could be sorted by pre-planning against a harbour wall or post (and if non-tidal area legs would be of no use anyway).

Also, one more thing to bear in mind When drying out with a fin keel (legs or no legs) even once you have your balance point sorted still possible that she will tip forward (or back) if the weight onboard changes (2 folks on the bow? - or a full tank of diesel. and 3 mechanics in the cockpit ). Of simply if the slope is a bit too much and gravity takes over.

[Anomaly]

D.O.J. --- Thanks. Is there a prize for most use of emoticons per post? And your comments on wellies, firm bottoms, and well, er, where was I? (got distracted there....) are appreciated.

But, you looked up my boat on the internet? I don't think so.... there are two versions of the Soverel 33. The first, by the father (Bill) was a heavy displacement cruising vessel. The second, by the son (Mark), was a light displacement racing sled. The second version is the one on the 'net and that everyone knows about. I have the first version and only know of two still in existence. Not a fin keel but a "cutaway full stub keel/centerboard" arrangement (is that a technically correct expression?). Plenty of keel length and a flat, reasonably wide shoe to rest on one of those firm bottoms....

And, of course, my other boat is a Pearson 24 with a genuine full keel (cutaway forefoot) that ought to do nicely on legs. As will the Soverel too I suspect. But, I take your points.