Aries Windane

[atoll]

i agree with both of you a tiller would be best,but that was not the ops question!

having used both systems with either an aries or a monitor over many many miles,the cruicial thing is to have the boat so well balanced that it is nearly sailing it self,if you are using more than a quarter turn of the helm you are either oversteering or not concentrating hand steering,once balanced an aries only needs an eight of a turn to bring a balanced vessel back on coarse,and the windier and faster the boat the better they steer.

[atoll]

Originally Posted by Celestialsailor

Then I guess Sailomat and Monitor are misinformed

sailomat is a completly different system,and monitor is a latter day copy of the aries,that can be supplied with a hub to be fitted to any wheel steering system.

please read the original post from the op and reply to that,since you have obviously used a hydralic wheel with an aries with sucsess as i have over,more than one circumnavigation.
or are you quoting hearsay as is common here

[lateral]

As long as there is no slip & he only has THREE full turns hard against the stops, full starboard to full port (ie 1.5 turns each way) it should work with a balanced boat. Six turns will under correct as the pendulum doesn't have the amplitude.

[atoll]

reading the ops original post it is not clear weather he has 3 or 6 turns lock to lock,but after 100,000 miles of dodgy boats,any self steering is better than no self steerin,and belive me after 1000 miles hand steering he will find a way to get it to work lol!

[roverhi]

It was impossible to balance out our Westsail once we came hard off the wind. There was increasing weatherhelm as the boats speed increased. The Aires steered without a problem. All I did was movr the chain tiller connection to weather to compensate for the displaced rudder. If I'd had to balance the boat to get the vane to work, would have had to sail at two knots the whole time. The monitor on my P35 loved weather helm. The faster we sailed and the more weather helm, the better the vane handled the boat. At slow speeds where the helm was neutral, the vane actually wouldn't steer because of not enough water flow past the pendulum rudder to generate the force to turn the wheel.

Personally, think that any boat will work with pendulum servo steering as long it's connected to a tiller without the mechanical loss inherent in wheel systems. Many boat owners say their PS systems work with a wheel but I haven't been so fortunate. Had to ditch the Monitor because of its nonexistant performance below 4k boat speed. Suspect those that do work with a cable wheel are steering a balanced rudder that takes little force to turn at any speed. Hydraulic systems can be the best of both worlds. With a pressure relief valve in the system, a PS vane
attached to a stub tiller isn't fighting the wheel steering to move the rudder.

As usual we get misinformation on this site. Aries, Monitor, and SailoMat all say their vanes don't work well on hydraulic steering systems because of slippage. That's not me putting my obvious anti-wheel bias into it, that's the vane manufacturers. An autopilot or a person doesn't feel the slippage as they just keep moving the ram or wheel the small excursions that it takes to keep the boat on course. I'll bet there isn't that nice piece of rope work that marks a centered rudder on a cable steering system on a hydraulic steered boat's wheel.

SailoMat is a Pendulum Servo Vane. The type first brought to the cruising masses, but not invented, by Nick Franklin's Aires. Nick took Blondie Hasler's pendulum servo idea and combined it with someone else's horizontal pivoting vane to make a truly effective system that worked over a wide variance in wind and sea conditions without much tinkering. The SailoMat works the same as the Windpilot Pacific,
Fleming, Monitor, etc, etc.

[JulianGullsway]

Guys calm down, I never mentioned anything about leaking hydraulics its brand new system thats little over 3 months old. My question is or was will it work with the Aries Windvan given that it takes 3 whole turns on the wheel to go hard too (from centre), but any way I have the Kit already minus the clutch / Drum which now thanks to Roly I have, I guess we shall have to wait and see, I reckon it will work, if not you will see see the whole system up for sale!!! Thanks for all your imput, I love this forum

[Celestialsailor]

I don't see anyone getting riled up about anything. Only stating facts from manufacturers and personal experiences. I've never seen a hydraulic system that did not have a small amount of creep. To test your own system, go hard over to one side and keep a fair amount of tension on the wheel and see if your system creeps a little. That should solve the debate if there was any.

[JulianGullsway]

Will do, thanks for your input, I will give it a go the weekend. I have to admit I'am very keen to try alot of whats been mentioned on the above subject, its going to be interesting to see the result!!

[nick.sirius]

Hello All,
I have a 39ft southern cross that is mounted with an Aries (lift up). It appears to have all the parts I need except the plywood blade, I’ve searched the web and cannot find specifics on thickness, width, height and shape. If it’s not too much trouble, can someone provide the recommended specs for the blade?

[Celestialsailor]

Did you try this site?

Aries Spares Contact Details

[hpeer]

Originally Posted by nick.sirius

Hello All,
I have a 39ft southern cross that is mounted with an Aries (lift up). It appears to have all the parts I need except the plywood blade, I’ve searched the web and cannot find specifics on thickness, width, height and shape. If it’s not too much trouble, can someone provide the recommended specs for the blade?

I've got a couple of spares on my boat, unfortunately I just came back and won't be there until the weekend. Feel free to PM me and annoy me until I get you the dimensions.

BUT............

I just built an Aries adapter for a tiller pilot. I used 3/16 aluminum plate, and that was a little thin for the slot. IIRC the blades are just 1/4" ply, that would square with my tiller pilot experience.

As to the size and shape they are (very, very roughly) 40 inches long and about 10 inches wide. That's the 'standard' blade. BUT you could make your own either larger or smaller, longer or shorter, and see how it works.

I think that a big thin blade would be optimum for light wind while a smaller blade would be better for heavy wind.

Nothing says it has to exactly be one size. Fart around, ply is cheap. Let us know what you learn.

[hpeer]

AND...........

Wind Vane

Wind Vane



The shape of the vane is not as important as the weight of it. Some sailors prefer the vane to be slightly lighter that the lead weight below. This means that the vane will search for mid position by itself. I tried a lighter vane on my circumnavigation but I did not like it. I changed it back to even the lead weight by putting a bolt onto it in the top. Consequently I now make all vanes to even the lead weight below but you are free to try lighter ones. Plywood is a very good material to use. It does not wear by the sun and it is easy replaced in any harbour in any country. I had seven with me on leaving New Zealand. When a big wave breaks over the vane gear, the vane will break no matter what it is made of. Those who state anything else have never felt a stormy breaking wave on their body. The force is tremendous! The plywood vane snaps off without doing any damage to the rest of the gear. I have never had the vane broken by the force of the wind.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by nick.sirius

Hello All,
I have a 39ft southern cross that is mounted with an Aries (lift up). It appears to have all the parts I need except the plywood blade, I’ve searched the web and cannot find specifics on thickness, width, height and shape. If it’s not too much trouble, can someone provide the recommended specs for the blade?

Hi Nick, I have a lift up Aries as well, but all my vanes are on the boat. Unfortunately the boat is undercover her winter cover until May. If you don't get your measure by then feel free to PM me, but hpeer's dimensions sound bang on to me.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by hpeer

I just built an Aries adapter for a tiller pilot. I used 3/16 aluminum plate, and that was a little thin for the slot.

Do you have any pics or plans for your tiller pilot adaptor hpeer? I've just ordered a tiller pilot and would like to build a similar adapter. Would love to see what you've done.

[nick.sirius]

Thanks all, this really helps. To summarize i'm going to cut the vanes roughly 10x40 inches and then cut down and shape them until they are the same weight as the lead counterweight. I'm sure i'll be back here asking for help running the control lines when i get to that project. Were leaving on a cruise Feb 29th and i wanted to get the vanes built while at home.