T-ball the mast while up?

[Ryban]

It's finally come time to install my solent stay on my Albin Vega. I have all the components onboard, but I've been putting the project off as it involves cutting a hole in the mast while aloft, which doesn't sound like a lot of fun.

When I was brainstorming ways to attach the inner stay to the mast, the best option I could find (at the time) was to use a T-ball and associated backing plate. The nice thing about this method is that it only involves rivets and epoxy, and no through-mast bolts. The downside is that it leaves an opening in my mast for rain water to intrude, and find its way down into the boat.

Unstepping the mast would be the best way to do the install, but it probably isn't going to be an option right now.

Anyone have experience doing such a fun rigging install while aloft?

[Reefmagnet]

This isn't too different to driilling holes for a radar or like. Shouldn't be too hard. Just don't drop that backing plate down the guts of the mast! And I wouldn't worry about mast leaks. It will just be one more hole. If your Vega mast doesn't have water leaking in it already from the masthead, you have a very special Vega!

[JPA Cate]

Ryban, imho, no, a T-Ball is not a good way to go for a headstay. I don't even like them for our diamond struts. Jim posted a picture of one that had almost completely failed here: Norseman fittings sources? [Sitemap] - Cruisers & Sailing Forums

The back story is that it had been okay, to inspection prior to leaving for a rugged, short passage from the West coast of Tasmania to Sydney, and what he took the pic of was what he found a few days later, north of Sydney.

You're about to take off on a journey where there may be a lot of stress on your solent stay, it should be supported better, imo, and that will mean throughbolted, backing plates, tangs, and toggles.

Ann

[belizesailor]

Ive got them t-balls in my diamond rigs. Replaced them all with new last year. After seeing the Cates' pic on the other thread, Im glad I did!

[Uncle G]

I wouldn't use a T-ball for a stay. I think they are shaped to cope with a pull about 10 degrees from the mast - as a shroud would be. If you pull them out 15 or 20 degrees like a stay, you will put a much greater strain on the 90-degree bend as the fitting will bottom only on the inside of the mast fitting.

[Ryban]

Okay! Was not expecting to be talked out of the T-ball fitting in this post, but so it goes.

Can a through-bolt solution be accomplished with the mast up, though? I always thought these types of fittings required an anti-compression post, and that the only way to fit that was to get inside the mast?

[Dougtiff]

Being a rigger, i have made this coverson a half a dozen times, including at the time a 44 ft. sloop i owned, take a pattern of the mast at deck level, unless it's tapered, have a curved plate made of S.S., 3/16"x6" wide x10" long, with 2 lugs welded to plate, one for the wire and one for a block, drill mounting holes 2" apart, for drilling and taping, 1/4" or 3/16 rivet's, remembering it is mostly in sheer, the placement needs backup, I.E. the lowers or running back stays

[Ryban]

Originally Posted by Dougtiff

Being a rigger, i have made this coverson a half a dozen times, including at the time a 44 ft. sloop i owned, take a pattern of the mast at deck level, unless it's tapered, have a curved plate made of S.S., 3/16"x6" wide x10" long, with 2 lugs welded to plate, one for the wire and one for a block, drill mounting holes 2" apart, for drilling and taping, 1/4" or 3/16 rivet's, remembering it is mostly in sheer, the placement needs backup, I.E. the lowers or running back stays

I'll have to check my budget, because custom steel sounds like $$!

If I went this route, would you also glue the whole fitting to the mast in addition to the bolts/rivets? What about galvanic corrosion behind plates like these?

[JPA Cate]

Yes, you want to isolate the s/s from the alumin(i)um mast. Cut up tire inner tube material works well, and also those very skinny chopping "boards" about .5mm thick. Even PVC electrical tape will work. You'll also want something like duralac or anti-seize in the rivet or screw holes, too.

Dougtiff is right that you would normally need runners to back up an inner stay. However, making it into a Solent rig should keep the upper attachment so close to the back stay that perhaps you won't need them. You might send him a PM with that question. Ours is a fractional rig, and we do need runners, to get adequate forestay tension.

Ann

[Cheechako]

Just install a curved base fitting with high strength rivets. No big hole in the mast that way either.

[Ryban]

Originally Posted by JPA Cate

Dougtiff is right that you would normally need runners to back up an inner stay. However, making it into a Solent rig should keep the upper attachment so close to the back stay that perhaps you won't need them. You might send him a PM with that question. Ours is a fractional rig, and we do need runners, to get adequate forestay tension.

Since it's masthead, I believe I'm okay if the attachment comes within 12" or so of the top of the mast. I'll have to double check this figure.

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Just install a curved base fitting with high strength rivets. No big hole in the mast that way either.

The fitting in the picture you provided is a Wichard part, I believe? If so, the ones I've seen are much too big for my little mast. Moreover, don't they need to be installed inside the mast anyway? I thought the rivets were there to just hold it in place, and the curved plates act as a backing plate for the tang.

[44'cruisingcat]

Originally Posted by JPA Cate

Ryban, imho, no, a T-Ball is not a good way to go for a headstay.

Ann

But a Solent stay is additional to the forestay. There's redundancy if it fails. And it's not going to be taking all the forestay loads.

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by Ryban

Since it's masthead, I believe I'm okay if the attachment comes within 12" or so of the top of the mast. I'll have to double check this figure.



The fitting in the picture you provided is a Wichard part, I believe? If so, the ones I've seen are much too big for my little mast. Moreover, don't they need to be installed inside the mast anyway? I thought the rivets were there to just hold it in place, and the curved plates act as a backing plate for the tang.

I dont know what that one is. There are tons of them around, I'm sure there's one that will fit. The one I did years ago I modified the bend to fit perfect, in a vice and with a big crescent wrench.

[IslandHopper]

Originally Posted by Ryban

The fitting in the picture you provided is a Wichard part, I believe? If so, the ones I've seen are much too big for my little mast. Moreover, don't they need to be installed inside the mast anyway? I thought the rivets were there to just hold it in place, and the curved plates act as a backing plate for the tang.

Yacht Auriga: Adding an inner forestay - Part 5, in which Igor goes diving.