Strong enough cordless drill to winch up sails

[Franziska]

Originally Posted by Emmalina

Think the day I can't haul my mainsail up by hand is the time to sell the boat !

Well, it's not in all cases à story of the mainsail.
You can use this kit for many purposes. Replace electric winches, replace electric windlass (if you have a vertical manual with dlass) pull someone up the mast, and yes, hoist the sail on big boats.

Large, full batten mains can get fairly heavy...

[Strait Shooter]

Originally Posted by jordanbigel

Re: winch bit, I've been using the Harken bit for about 3 or 4 months (with an M28) and it fits all my Lewmar winches, it turns the winch when I press the trigger. I can't imagine how another one could be "better" - what is the difference?

The Ultimate Cranker is machined to replace the drill chuck which has a shear pin that makes it not as strong in reverse. The Ultimate Cranker has a set screw instead of a shear pin that makes it bullet proof in both directions.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Emmalina

Think the day I can't haul my mainsail up by hand is the time to sell the boat !

You may find that you are not ready to quit sailing when you lose the ability to easily hoist the main, so be careful what you predict!

At age 85 I can still get the main up the mast without the Milwaukee... but it is faster and effortless with the drill and I can save my limited energy for other things... and have no shame in doing so!

Jim

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

You may find that you are not ready to quit sailing when you lose the ability to easily hoist the main, so be careful what you predict!

At age 85 I can still get the main up the mast without the Milwaukee... but it is faster and effortless with the drill and I can save my limited energy for other things... and have no shame in doing so!

Jim

I have to agree with this one. And not just about the age part.

It’s a safety factor to have your energy still available for other situations. If you become overwhelmed with exhaustion and there is an emergency to take care of, it’s possible you might not have the physical energy left to take care of that emergency.

With the drill or standard electric winch, you have a bit of reserve energy left. You don’t have to use the drill or the standard electric winch, but it’s there when you need it at least.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by Emmalina

Think the day I can't haul my mainsail up by hand is the time to sell the boat !

Depends on the boat.

I have a 38' sloop with a furling boom. Like most furling boom setups, it uses a (modified) boltrope because the various low-friction setups, Tides track, Battcars, etc., are not amenable to being rolled around a drum. It's a big sail and the overall friction in the system is high between the boltrope, the drum, and the sail fabric leading out of the drum enclosure. Oh, and battens.

It came with an electric halyard winch, and the solenoid for it was flakey at the survey and failed on the delivery homeward. Can I raise and lower the main by hand? Well, I can, but it is not easy, fun, or quick.

I could tear the whole thing off and get a stock boom and some battcars but I can buy 10 right-angle drills and a half dozen winch solenoids for that amount of money.

[Soteria]

Originally Posted by Kd9truck

Also....smaller lighter drills can be dangerous because you can lose grip and have the drill spin on you Wrists have been injured. The drill I posted is heavy prob 7 pounds. You can not operate without two hands. I’ve used this drill for 3 years and it’s still brand knew on a smaller vessel we used a 1/2 inch drills and burned them out at the rate of 1 a season.

Most of the drills proposed are right angle drills, which seem to be costly and heavy. I have tested various other types of drills including two SDS drills one from Hilti and the other from Ryobi. Further to this I tested a small 40 Nm drill from Ryobi and a impact drill. All the above drills had the same problem which was that the torque stopper kicked in resulting in no further movement on the drill. I understand this is to protect the drill.
After further investigation you can buy a Milwaukee M18 FPD3-0X PERCUSSION DRILL which has torque of 158 Nm. The following advantages:
AUTOSTOP™ control mode offers enhanced safety for the operator by preventing over-rotation in a bind-up, and the weight is much less.
My question is therefore what is Nm you need to be able to pull somebody (80kg's) up the mast (using a Lewmar40)? 158 Nm is equal to a pull of 16.11. Will this be enough?

[mvweebles]

UPDATE - part of what's missing in this discussion is the size of the winch, whether its 2-speed. I have a Andersen 18 single speed to lift a 250 lb dinghy/outboard. The newer right-angle drills including the Milwaukee M18 (previous post) have an safety-clutch system that, for me, kept it from being useful. I tried the Dewalt, Milwaukee, and Harbor Freight Hercules equivilent. All ceased lifting prematurely.

What has worked is a Dewalt DCD999T1 drill (conventional form-factor, not a right-angle) with 6.0V FlexVolt battery. It's a beast. Right-angle drill would be easier to handle, but with the included auxiliary handle, it's not too bad. Pluse it allows me to only have a single winch aboard (rest of my kit is Dewalt).

https://www.homedepot.com/p/DEWALT-2...99T1/313291725

Had it not worked, I would have gone with a larger winch (plus 2-speed).

[mitiempo]

Originally Posted by mvweebles

UPDATE - part of what's missing in this discussion is the size of the winch, whether its 2-speed. I have a Andersen 18 single speed to lift a 250 lb dinghy/outboard. The newer right-angle drills including the Milwaukee M18 (previous post) have an safety-clutch system that, for me, kept it from being useful. I tried the Dewalt, Milwaukee, and Harbor Freight Hercules equivilent. All ceased lifting prematurely.

What has worked is a Dewalt DCD999T1 drill (conventional form-factor, not a right-angle) with 6.0V FlexVolt battery. It's a beast. Right-angle drill would be easier to handle, but with the included auxiliary handle, it's not too bad. Pluse it allows me to only have a single winch aboard (rest of my kit is Dewalt

I think you mean 20 volt.

[chrisr]

Originally Posted by mvweebles

UPDATE - part of what's missing in this discussion is the size of the winch, whether its 2-speed. I have a Andersen 18 single speed to lift a 250 lb dinghy/outboard. The newer right-angle drills including the Milwaukee M18 (previous post) have an safety-clutch system that, for me, kept it from being useful. I tried the Dewalt, Milwaukee, and Harbor Freight Hercules equivilent. All ceased lifting prematurely.

What has worked is a Dewalt DCD999T1 drill (conventional form-factor, not a right-angle) with 6.0V FlexVolt battery. It's a beast. Right-angle drill would be easier to handle, but with the included auxiliary handle, it's not too bad. Pluse it allows me to only have a single winch aboard (rest of my kit is Dewalt).

https://www.homedepot.com/p/DEWALT-2...99T1/313291725

Had it not worked, I would have gone with a larger winch (plus 2-speed).

suspect that even with the smaller winch, the 28v milwaukee would do the job for you.

it has quite a bit more torque than the 18v

cheers,

[mvweebles]

Originally Posted by chrisr

suspect that even with the smaller winch, the 28v milwaukee would do the job for you.



it has quite a bit more torque than the 18v



cheers,

The old 28v would likely do, but not because of the torque. The auto-clutch feature on all the new right angle drills was the issue. Because of the weight of my dinghy (250 lbs) and lack of mechanical advantage in the #18 winch, the drills' safety device detected a locked condition and shut down immediately. Even with the lifting rope doubled back to double the mechanical advantage.

The DeWalt conventional format drill I posted above does not have the safety feature. Plus it has a 3-speed gearbox so can go fairly slow.

BTW - I did indeed make a typo in the original update post. I meant 6.0Ah Flexvolt battery (I said 6.0v). This battery supposedly has 42% more power than the 5Ah battery. It is a handful.

[Miyalk]

Originally Posted by mvweebles

The old Milwaukee M28 right angle drill apparently produced 1080 ft lbs of torque (.https://www.bhid.com/product/milele-spc-0721-20). New crop of 20v cordless produce same at top end (Milwaukee) down to around 850 for upper end of Dewalt. They are not right-angle drills though.

Looking at replacing my old M28 with a new Super Hawg, the old M28 was 1080 inch pounds. (not foot pounds) which is about 122 Nm

The new Superdawg is also 122Nm or 1080 inch pounds, so the same as the M28

[mvweebles]

Originally Posted by Miyalk

Looking at replacing my old M28 with a new Super Hawg, the old M28 was 1080 inch pounds. (not foot pounds) which is about 122 Nm

The new Superdawg is also 122Nm or 1080 inch pounds, so the same as the M28

As mentioned in the post immediately before this, there is also an issue with the auto-clutch safety feature that seem to be a "feature" on all current hole-hawg style right angle drills, including the higher end Harbor Freight knock-off. The safety clutch is designed to shut the drill down if it hits a nail or something. Unfortunately, lifting a heavy dead weight from scratch triggers the shut down. You might be able to lift a person up the mast from the deck where the load is gradual. moving the same person from a stop at the spreaders to the masthead will likely trigger the shut down. Lifting a dinghy is similar at least in my experience - as long as a long single pull, no problem. Pause part way and the clutch disengages in restart.The older M28 did not have a safety clutch so comparing torque values may not tell the story.

[Miyalk]

The new Super Hawk has a mechanical clutch on Low speed, so I dont believe this is an issue.

[Iron E]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

You may find that you are not ready to quit sailing when you lose the ability to easily hoist the main, so be careful what you predict!

At age 85 I can still get the main up the mast without the Milwaukee... but it is faster and effortless with the drill and I can save my limited energy for other things... and have no shame in doing so!

Jim

It wasn't a well thought out comment. I can think of at least a dozen legitimate reasons a drill or electric winch may be preferred to hoist the sails, arthritis, disabilities, injuries both permanent and temporary, and you gave me one more. Also, why is it okay to have an assist on the anchor and not the sails?

[LouK]

Did anyone verify that the new Milwaukie 18V Super Hogs were able to both hoist a main sail and /or a person up the mast?