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16-03-2016, 15:09
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Highlands NJ
Boat: O'Day 35
Posts: 20
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Replacements for my Barlow winches?
My 1986 O'Day 35 has Barlow 25 winches for the jib sheets. I see that West Marine has Lewmar winches on sale. Would 30s be a good replacement?
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16-03-2016, 16:00
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#2
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: May 2012
Location: New Orleans
Boat: We have a problem... A serious addiction issue.
Posts: 3,974
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
What size headsail do you have?
The fore triangle is just at 300 sqft. If you upsize that to 400 to account for overlap in 20kn of breeze you have a sheet load of 690lbs. Divide that by the power ratio (30) * friction losses 140%) and you would need to apply 32lbs to the winch handle to trim the sails.
The ideal is around 25lbs so you aren't far off, but 40's would be ideal (24.15lbs). For about $100 more per winch.
I think Barlow has its own rating system and I can't remember it, but assuming it's power ratio is 25:1 your current load is 38.6lbs. Far above idea, but about what most manufacturers use to save money.
__________________
Greg
- If animals weren't meant to be eaten then they wouldn't be made of food.
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16-03-2016, 16:12
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Fort Lauderdale Florida
Boat: Northstar 1500, 35'
Posts: 318
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Replacements for my Barlow winches?
I have a 35' sloop. It came with Barlow 27's, I replaced with Lewmar ST44, I would not mind having 46-48. I had Barlow 16's (if memory serves) for halyards that got a Lewmar 30 for the jib and a Lewmar 40 for the main...
Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum
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16-03-2016, 17:19
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#4
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2008
Location: cruising SW Pacific
Boat: Jon Sayer 1-off 46 ft fract rig sloop strip plank in W Red Cedar
Posts: 21,467
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
IIRC, Barlow used the same rating system that Barient did. Again IIRC, the winch number was the actual line tension in units of 100 lbs produced with 100 lbs force on a 10 inch handle... not the mechanical advantage ratio used by most other winch manufacturers. Barient used to claim that this was a better rating, since it took into account internal friction losses, etc. Thus, your # 25 winches would theoretically produce 2500 lbs tension with a force of 100 lbs on a 10 inch (standard) winch handle.
Jim
__________________
Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II, lying Port Cygnet Tasmania once again.
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16-03-2016, 23:39
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#5
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Carlsbad, CA
Boat: 1976 Sabre 28-2
Posts: 7,505
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
Changed out the Barient 21 winches for Lewmar 43 Self Tailing. One of the best additions made to the boat. The 21's were roughly Lewmar 40 equivalents and took way too much grunt to crank in the genoa with the wind up. The 43s, probably equivalent to current Lewmar 46ST
__________________
Peter O.
'Ae'a, Pearson 35
'Ms American Pie', Sabre 28 Mark II
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17-03-2016, 02:29
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Up the mast, looking for clean wind.
Boat: Currently Shopping, & Heavily in LUST!
Posts: 5,629
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
A couple of thoughts.
Harken walks you through how to size your winches, via the link.
Right now, Hareken winches are on sale at www.MauriProSailing.com & www.APSLtd.com Between 20%-40%
You can look up some of the info, & schematics on your current winches at http://l-36.com/manuals.php?menu=6 & C&C Resource Center
Also, HUTTON-ARCO Yacht Winches in Australia, still makes parts for a number of Barlow & Barient winches.
I'm not trying to push you into one brand of winches or another. But I can say that the customer support at Harken vs. that at Lewmar, is like a Model T vs. a Ferrari. Ditto on the quality of their respective products. Knock on wood.
__________________
The Uncommon Thing, The Hard Thing, The Important Thing (in Life): Making Promises to Yourself, And Keeping Them.
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17-03-2016, 09:03
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: GREEN COVE SPRINGS, Florida
Boat: Irwin 43 Mk111 CC, Sloop
Posts: 386
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by rfkneller
My 1986 O'Day 35 has Barlow 25 winches for the jib sheets. I see that West Marine has Lewmar winches on sale. Would 30s be a good replacement?
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Don't know why you're contemplating replacement, but you do know that since Barlow closed down a group of sailors in Australia are manufacturing spares for Barlow Winches.
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17-03-2016, 09:27
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Chicago
Boat: Alden auxiliary ketch 48'
Posts: 950
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
Anybody re-winched with those new 4 speed Pontos winches Defender is selling?
__________________
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
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17-03-2016, 09:48
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: St Croix USVI
Boat: Shannon 38
Posts: 100
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
I was looking to replace a pair of Barient 28s which were primaries on my heavy 38'cutter more because they were not self-tailing than for any other reason. My research lead me to the same conclusion reached earlier in this chain, that the ratings were other than mechanical advantage. The mechanical advantage of my 28s was slightly better than a conventionality rate 40. I wuond up buying conversion kits from Winchmate at a little less than $600/each and am very pleased with their performance. I don't know wheter they have conversion for smaller Barient and Barlow winches but here is the webxite address:
Self-Tailing Winch Conversion fits Barient, Barlow, Cathay, Universal and others: Winchmate
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17-03-2016, 09:51
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#10
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: May 2012
Location: New Orleans
Boat: We have a problem... A serious addiction issue.
Posts: 3,974
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
I meant to link this. Harken It's a calculator for sheet load at a given sail size and wind strength.
The problem with the winch guide Uncivilized linked is that is assumes the sail is no larger than 100% of the J dimension, which is a bit unrealistic.
And I would second Harken as a supplier. Their customer service is the best in the business. I pretty much default to Harken, even if their prices are a bit higher the support you get is just so fantastic.
__________________
Greg
- If animals weren't meant to be eaten then they wouldn't be made of food.
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17-03-2016, 09:57
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#11
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: May 2012
Location: New Orleans
Boat: We have a problem... A serious addiction issue.
Posts: 3,974
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyoldboatguy
Anybody re-winched with those new 4 speed Pontos winches Defender is selling?
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No, but if I needed to swap out mine I would absolutely use these, even given the price premium. Everything I have heard has been positive, and I really miss our old three speed winches. It says something serious when the Open 40's have made the switch.
http://www.yachtingworld.com/reviews...ur-speed-winch
__________________
Greg
- If animals weren't meant to be eaten then they wouldn't be made of food.
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17-03-2016, 11:54
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Los Angeles
Boat: Samson 36 Seashell
Posts: 20
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
I have a pair of Arco 44 bronze two-speed, self-tailing winches. They are comparable to Hutton arto 45 ST in power ($1050 eac) and 52 ST in size ($1550 each). They are lightly used and in great shape. I'm asking $600 each.
Larry Chamblee
213 280 5902
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17-03-2016, 12:38
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Missouri
Boat: Beneteau 393
Posts: 107
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
My previously owned Beneteau 331 had Lewmar ST 30 for the jib sheet. My B393 has Lewmar ST 48.
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17-03-2016, 12:46
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Panama City, FL.
Boat: 26' O Day 1985
Posts: 25
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
rfkneller, I have an O'Day 1985 26' that I recently replaced two Barlow jib sheet winches on. I went with the Lewmar self-tailing winches and couldn't be happier. There were no issues with having to work too hard with the old 18s being used so I stuck with the same size winches. I am dealing with a much less square foot total canvas than yours however. - Sam
__________________
The Little Engine That Could had a self-a-steam problem.
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17-03-2016, 13:07
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Up the mast, looking for clean wind.
Boat: Currently Shopping, & Heavily in LUST!
Posts: 5,629
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Re: Replacements for my Barlow winches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED
A couple of thoughts.
Harken walks you through how to size your winches, via the link.
Right now, Hareken winches are on sale at www.MauriProSailing.com & www.APSLtd.com Between 20%-40%
You can look up some of the info, & schematics on your current winches at Marine Manuals & C&C Resource Center
Also, HUTTON-ARCO Yacht Winches in Australia, still makes parts for a number of Barlow & Barient winches.
I'm not trying to push you into one brand of winches or another. But I can say that the customer support at Harken vs. that at Lewmar, is like a Model T vs. a Ferrari. Ditto on the quality of their respective products. Knock on wood.
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I think that I kind of transposed things here, given the early hour at which I was up.
Regarding customer service, what I was trying to say was that Harken is MUCH nicer to deal with than Lewmar. In the 3 decades or so, that I've been playing the game.
The Pontos winches are intriguing. But I'd have to try them out. As at double the price of a two-speed...
Yeah, 3 or 4 speeds is nice for the primaries on a big boat, but how does it help you when you're only using a 40x winch on something far smaller?
Has anyone done a timed test with them vs. a regular winch, when, say, tacking a mid-sized jib (400 sqft)?
__________________
The Uncommon Thing, The Hard Thing, The Important Thing (in Life): Making Promises to Yourself, And Keeping Them.
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