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Old 11-04-2018, 20:10   #1
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Join Date: Mar 2012
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Boat: Lagoon 450S
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Lagoon 450 - Mast car damage at gooseneck

I was inspecting the mast on my Lagoon 450 and found what did not look right at the gooseneck.

There is a support that holds the mast track above the gooseneck, and prevents the car from contacting the gooseneck. That support is held by a single screw that sheared and allowed the support to fall into the opening in gooseneck. Now the car drops down low enough to hold the pin that holds the boom, bending the eye.

This picture shows the lowest car resting against the boom pin. The track support which also acts as a car stop, has slipped off the goosneck and is about 1" lower that where it should be. Causing the car to go lower than designed. Click image for larger version

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This picture show the support when I removed it. It has a threaded portion (left side in picture) that goes up into the track. The small hole in the bottom is for a screw that holds the pin in place on the mast, that sheared and let the support fall into the gooseneck. Attachment 167973

I purchased this cat used. Any ideas on what this is supposed to look like? Is this a common problem?

Thanks!
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Old 31-03-2020, 18:46   #2
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Re: Lagoon 450 - Mast car damage at gooseneck

For anyone else with this issue, we have the same problem on our 2015 450F. The screw holding the pin to the mast snapped, and the support pin slipped off the Gooseneck. We put this down to dropping the sail too quickly.

To rectify the issue we have had to try to drill out the screw - very hard to get to, and of course we found it impossible to drill the stainless screw without damaging the alloy mast.

We then put a new, fatter screw in its place, together with a large washer below the pin to spread the load.

I also stuck felt pads (designed to protect floors) to the underside of each car, so that when the sail drops they don’t exert as much force on the pin.

Time will tell if it works, but if I knew about this before I would have glued a washer below the pin to stop the screw snapping.
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Old 01-04-2020, 05:38   #3
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Re: Lagoon 450 - Mast car damage at gooseneck

Drilling out the screw must have been challenging! I tried and finally gave up. I glued the pin base to a 1/4” piece of aluminum on top of the gooseneck. It’s held up well for more than a year.

My thought on why it happened was the reef line was pulled down too hard. The holding screw may have been loosened by the sail drop banging you noted, and the pin slid back off the gooseneck. But, the extreme downward force was caused by setting the reef improperly. It even bent back the top of the gooseneck pin itself!

When we reef now, we set the tack of the sail close to the desired position with our main halyard so the reef line pulls down against the luff, not down onto the sail cars. Then, continue to tighten the reef line to set the clew, the tack does not get pulled down against the sail cars. Once the reef line is secure, we’ll pull on the main halyard again to tighten the luff.

The cause is just a guess since it was in a damaged state when we purchased our 450S. Our sails don’t seem to come down that hard. Maybe I need to lubricate the track! Just my observations and conclusions. Thanks for sharing!
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Old 01-04-2020, 06:20   #4
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Re: Lagoon 450 - Mast car damage at gooseneck

Image of our fix.
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Old 01-04-2020, 08:49   #5
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Re: Lagoon 450 - Mast car damage at gooseneck

That's so interesting - you might well be right and we snapped the pin in the same way!

I find that if the first reef isn't tight enough, gusts cause the foot of the main to move back and forth, causing chafe on the friction ring at the clew.

We have twice snapped our first reefing line due to this chafe. We have just bought a new main and I have fitted massive blocks instead of friction rings for the first reef to prevent this chafe.

We have had long debates about how much tension there should be on the reefing lines - I think in future I'll try your approach.
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Old 01-04-2020, 17:52   #6
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Re: Lagoon 450 - Mast car damage at gooseneck

We get chafe where the reef line enters and exits the boom. I placed some dyneema covers at those points.

I received advice that keeping the foot of the sail tight is important to reduce the power of the main. So, the reef line needs to be tight. Apparently also reduces flapping at the foot. Maybe your problem. So we set the tack so it doesn’t get to close to the boom, and hold it there with the main halyard. Then tighten the reef to get the tack tight back and down. This tightens the foot without letting the clew get too close to the boom.

I’ve figured out that if the clew is too close to the boom the reefing line rubs against the boom and chafes. So the reef block at the clew needs to be as low as possible, but high enough that the reef line enters the booming without chafing. Locking down the halyard at the right spot keeps the block from going too close. I found a sweet spot where the lines run reasonably clean from sheave to sheave, and the reef line is tight, so less squeaking and chafing. That being said, there is still room for improvement!
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Old 01-04-2020, 19:22   #7
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Re: Lagoon 450 - Mast car damage at gooseneck

Thanks for that - I had a feeling that the reef should be as tight as possible.

We finally finished fitting the new sail today after screwing in the new batten receptacles and cutting the battens to fit them. What a mission!

When we're allowed to leave this anchorage I'll try putting in a reef to test how the reefing lines work with the new blocks and maybe post a picture as the chafe is obviously a common issue.

I made a mistake of asking the sailmaker to put a friction ring attachment point on the luff for the third reef instead of the webbing loop that was on the original sail. The third reefing line isn't long enough to go back up the mast to this reefing point, and there is no stainless eye on the mast for the third reef, so I'll have to make up a webbing loop!

Really appreciate your advice,

Jason
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Old 01-04-2020, 19:56   #8
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Re: Lagoon 450 - Mast car damage at gooseneck

Your welcome. The instructions that come with the boat are not very clear.

The advice I got from a rigger that inspected our boat is that the clew needs to be down so it’s pulled back tight by the reefing line, so the foot gets stretched tight. If the clew isn’t not down and the reef line is not pulling back tight, the foot will be loose. It’s obvious once I was told.

Lots of projects to do when staying on the boat is a really good idea!
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Old 01-04-2020, 20:06   #9
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Re: Lagoon 450 - Mast car damage at gooseneck

Your welcome. The instructions that come with the boat are not very clear.

The advice I got from a rigger that inspected our boat is that the clew needs to be down so it’s pulled back tight by the reefing line, so the foot gets stretched tight. If the clew isn’t not down and the reef line is not pulling back tight, the foot will be loose. It’s obvious once I was told.

Lots of projects to do when staying on the boat is a really good idea!
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Old 01-04-2021, 10:29   #10
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Re: Lagoon 450 - Mast car damage at gooseneck

Hi,

I’m trying to replace one of my damaged cars, would you happen to know who the manufacturer of the cars is?

Thanks
Mark
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Old 01-04-2021, 10:59   #11
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Re: Lagoon 450 - Mast car damage at gooseneck

Quote:
Originally Posted by geekoman View Post
I was inspecting the mast on my Lagoon 450 and found what did not look right at the gooseneck.

There is a support that holds the mast track above the gooseneck, and prevents the car from contacting the gooseneck. That support is held by a single screw that sheared and allowed the support to fall into the opening in gooseneck. Now the car drops down low enough to hold the pin that holds the boom, bending the eye.

This picture shows the lowest car resting against the boom pin. The track support which also acts as a car stop, has slipped off the goosneck and is about 1" lower that where it should be. Causing the car to go lower than designed. Attachment 167966

This picture show the support when I removed it. It has a threaded portion (left side in picture) that goes up into the track. The small hole in the bottom is for a screw that holds the pin in place on the mast, that sheared and let the support fall into the gooseneck. Attachment 167973

I purchased this cat used. Any ideas on what this is supposed to look like? Is this a common problem?

Thanks!
this is an easy repair, go to your local Lathe specialist and tell him make me this piece from Grade 440 stainless steels and hardening et 1010-1050 °C and in oil.
or better make from Titanium Grade 5

https://www.makeitfrom.com/material-...tainless-Steel
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