Furling Mainsail or Not ?

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by minaret

Noone mentions that a mainsail without battens or slides on luff or foot, therefore essentially no hardware, costs half as much. Or less. I just got a new main for my 76' tall stick for 2k. Would have cost 5 for a regular main the same size.

Fluting effect solved-

G'Day mate,

I couldn't quite make out how the anti whistle thing works from the pix... is it something you hoist up the slot? If so, what do you use for a halyard? I don't have or particularly want a furler, but I'd like to be able to suggest something to folks whose whistles have aggravated me over the years!

Cheers,

Jim

[bbbbbguy]

I love mine. For singlehanding, nothing beats it. I service it every year and its never left me hanging. Try dealing with a sticky main on a traditional, in a blow, with waves, alone! Not me... pop a couple of jammers, throw a few loops in a self tail'r, a crank here and there... volla! not a drop of the rum punch spilled. Yes, I give up .000009% in SOG for sail shape, but the fact is, I'm out cruising... not racing. Set it and forget it.

OH... thanks be to all who have welcomed me to the site!

[SaltyMonkey]

welcome bbbbbguy, and thanks for your SS feedback.

[minaret]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

G'Day mate,

I couldn't quite make out how the anti whistle thing works from the pix... is it something you hoist up the slot? If so, what do you use for a halyard? I don't have or particularly want a furler, but I'd like to be able to suggest something to folks whose whistles have aggravated me over the years!

Cheers,

Jim

I use what used to be the topping lift (have Navtec hydraulic now). It is a doubled strip of very heavy dacron. I tried to give you a little zoom, maybe I'll step outside and get another pic in a few, gotta get a shower after washing my teak decks in the hot sun all afternoon. No excuse for aggravating you with the whistle, it's easy to solve. My factory manual says that at 20 knots wind the fluting effect can be heard for two miles! Of course with sail deployed there is no fluting...

[minaret]

Originally Posted by bbbbbguy

I love mine. For singlehanding, nothing beats it. I service it every year and its never left me hanging. Try dealing with a sticky main on a traditional, in a blow, with waves, alone! Not me... pop a couple of jammers, throw a few loops in a self tail'r, a crank here and there... volla! not a drop of the rum punch spilled. Yes, I give up .000009% in SOG for sail shape, but the fact is, I'm out cruising... not racing. Set it and forget it.

OH... thanks be to all who have welcomed me to the site!

x2 on that. I think most people experiencing jams on in mast furling have old blown out sails. If there is too much "belly" in your main you will get wrinkles, which will cause a jam. Nice stiff new sails furl great, no hiccups at all. Laminated sails also furl great as a result of their inherent stiffness. And cruising long term with a crew of essentially two (me and the wife) means you will be "solo" most of the time unless you want to wake your signifigant other every time you want to reef. That would suck.

[jackdale]

I assuming that an in-mast furls anti-clockwise and unfurls clockwise.

How do you reef/furl or reduce sail on a port tack going downwind? Gybe onto starboard to give the main a straighter line into the mast? Go head to head? Something else?

[minaret]

Originally Posted by jackdale

I assuming that an in-mast furls anti-clockwise and unfurls clockwise.

How do you reef/furl or reduce sail on a port tack going downwind? Gybe onto starboard to give the main a straighter line into the mast? Go head to head? Something else?

You can furl either way. The manual for mine says furl with the sail going into the wrap from the windward side for tighter furling.

[jackdale]

Originally Posted by minaret

You can furl either way. The manual for mine says furl with the sail going into the wrap from the windward side for tighter furling.

Thanks. Is that a Selden?

[minaret]

Hood. NP, anytime.

[HopeFloats]

Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey

Wow HopeFloats! You have a catcha ketch rig with herringbones! Another favorite one of mine. No issues at all?

Hiya SaltyMonkey,

It was time to try something different. Sailing a cat rig is so easy I feel like I am cheating.

[Paul Elliott]

Originally Posted by minaret

Noone mentions that a mainsail without battens or slides on luff or foot, therefore essentially no hardware, costs half as much. Or less. I just got a new main for my 76' tall stick for 2k. Would have cost 5 for a regular main the same size.

Sure, but if you want a lufftape, negative roach, and no battens, you can always do that with a non-furling main (admittedly more difficult to reef / stow on the boom.)

I've got a boom furler on VALIS: lufftape, full-length battens, and good sail area. It works pretty well, and is certainly easy to reef singlehanded.

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by Paul Elliott

Sure, but if you want a lufftape, negative roach, and no battens, you can always do that with a non-furling main (admittedly more difficult to reef / stow on the boom.)

I've got a boom furler on VALIS: lufftape, full-length battens, and good sail area. It works pretty well, and is certainly easy to reef singlehanded.

Plus the in mast main sail will last longer, why? because it's stored nicely rolled up inside the mast for 6 days a week not stuffed into a duffle bag.

How many people do you see properly fold their slab reefed main sails?

Pete

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Plus the in mast main sail will last longer, why? because it's stored nicely rolled up inside the mast for 6 days a week not stuffed into a duffle bag.

How many people do you see properly fold their slab reefed main sails?

Pete

Indeed. Little mentioned but a great advantage of furling mains -- ideal storage of the sail out of the sunlight and weather, neatly rolled up. The sail will last much longer like that.

The other advantage is furling and unfurling in infinitely variable increments on any point of sail and either tack, without luffing up. And from the cockpit.

To the Original Poster: I have Selden in-mast furling on my boat, and my case contradicts the Marmalite thesis -- that you either hate it or love. I neither hate nor love my in-mast furling. It doesn't suck. It is very reliable. It has a couple of big advantages. But you definitely pay for it in terms of sail shape, sail trim, and efficiency.

Would I order in-mast furling if I were specifying a new boat? I really don't know; have to think about it. Maybe. Maybe not. I didn't have the choice since I bought my boat used. There was not a single boat with slab reefing on the market in Europe during the whole year I was shopping, among those similar in size, age and type to the boat I eventually bought. So slab reefing was just not even an option for me.

For what it's worth, here in the UK, with very challenging conditions, a lot of harsh weather, and a lot of very keen sailors, the proportion of cruising boats over 45 feet and less than 10 or 15 years old with in-mast furling approaches 100%. That should tell you something, I guess. It does not suck, and it is perfectly suitable for hard offshore work. But you do lose some performance, and you will not be able to trim your mainsail as perfectly.

[bbbbbguy]

A while nack, I was sailing with a friend in his Beneteau 50 Oceanis. We were sailing around St Vincent. We decided to pop over to Bequia for lunch. In the middle of the channel, the wind kicked up and the 8 footers started to roll. Unfortunately for me, his rig is traditional, and the reef lines were on a winch at the mast. Thank god Beneteau has pulpits at the mast. It eas a pain, uncomfortable, and all I could think was INFURL MAST! Perhaps I'm spoined, perhaps I'm just used to what I know.

[beiland]

Originally Posted by minaret

I also dont think my 5'6" wife would have such an easy time of reefing a rig that size without power furling. As it is she pretty much just pushes a button. This means the boat is never overpowered under sail, and you never procrastinate about reefing. It also takes about thirty seconds to do without leaving the cockpit. These are huge safety bonuses for us. The other advantage is that the helm can be carefully balanced on any point of sail with the ketch rig, which is all power furling. This makes the job much easier for the autopilot and is generally much easier on the boat. Really you can balance the helm on most points without using the AP at all.

Interesting subject thread that i just had to join and follow along, particularly with Minaret's reference to ketch rigs


....and problems with traditional mainsails, as expressed by many here.

I found this particularly interesting:

Originally Posted by Dockhead

For what it's worth, here in the UK, with very challenging conditions, a lot of harsh weather, and a lot of very keen sailors, the proportion of cruising boats over 45 feet and less than 10 or 15 years old with in-mast furling approaches 100%. That should tell you something, I guess. It does not suck, and it is perfectly suitable for hard offshore work. But you do lose some performance, and you will not be able to trim your mainsail as perfectly.

I've been an advocate for a ketch-rig, no-mainsail, all-furling rig for years now:
Origination & Justification

Ketch Rig by Chris White

Handicap Rig

Sail Propulsion