Code C by Rolly Tasker

[GILow]

Someone asked me about a code C sail the other day.

I hadn’t heard of one before but assumed it was some kind of variant of a Code 0.

I finally got around to looking one up today and it seems to be some kind of Rolly Tasker name for a sail they are pitching to the cruising market.

https://www.rollytasker.com/en/about...th-the-code-c/

At first glance it looked interesting, but then they start talking about adding mini bow sprits, pre rigging it before you set sail, maintaining tension so it doesn’t snag in your foresail , trimming it with barber hauls and I’m left wondering what the weather is like on their planet.

Am I missing something or is this the most stupid step backwards from an asym since God’s dog was a puppy? How can all of those properties make for a good cruising sail?

[Kestrahl]

I like how they say you need to use a barber hauler close reaching... Maybe that is what happens when you make a code zero out of cheap stretchy spinnaker nylon....... Barber haulers are normally used beam and broad reaching to control twist, like moving the car forward on your Genoa.

[GILow]

Originally Posted by Kestrahl

I like how they say you need to use a barber hauler close reaching... Maybe that is what happens when you make a code zero out of cheap stretchy spinnaker nylon....... Barber haulers are normally used beam and broad reaching to control twist, like moving the car forward on your Genoa.

Yes, they practically admit this in their description.

Actually, the more I read their bit of promotional literature the worse it gets. I’m now realising that having it pre rigged is a nightmare of trying to get it tightly furled, having to tie it off once furled and having to go forward and untie it before you can use it. And attach the sheet at the same time.

How on earth did they come up with this for a cruising boat? Everything about it says multi-crew race boat.

[fxykty]

Ummm, I’m not getting the problems. RT are describing a soft forestay sail that goes in front of the regular forestay and is sheeted to the back outside corner of the boat. Yes, it is basically a code O, or gennaker as known in the multihull world. Their marketers have given it a new name. There is nothing controversial or complex about what they’re selling.

- Mini bow sprit: if the sail is going to be left up (pre-rigged) then it needs separation from the regular forestay so it doesn’t interfere with your primary headsail. If you don’t already have a bow sprit or bow pole then you will need to install one. But only if you want to keep the sail up when you’re not using it.

- Pre-rigging: this simply means keeping the furled sail hoisted when you aren’t planning to use it. It doesn’t need a special tight furl, just a regular furl with sheet lightly tensioned. The sheets can stay on - we continue furling until they are wrapped 10-12 times around the sail.

Halyard tension: there needs to be plenty so that it doesn’t sag into the primary forestay. Smaller boats can use a single part halyard but boats over about 40’ need 2:1 halyards.

Barber hauler: if the sail is cut relatively flat, basically a large genoa, and is sheeted to the outside stern corner of the boat, even with a tight sheet the upwind angle will be pretty wide. So you can use an in-haul on the sheet to pull the clew further inboard to tighten the angle.

[GILow]

Originally Posted by fxykty

Ummm, I’m not getting the problems. RT are describing a soft forestay sail that goes in front of the regular forestay and is sheeted to the back outside corner of the boat. Yes, it is basically a code O, or gennaker as known in the multihull world. Their marketers have given it a new name. There is nothing controversial or complex about what they’re selling.

- Mini bow sprit: if the sail is going to be left up (pre-rigged) then it needs separation from the regular forestay so it doesn’t interfere with your primary headsail. If you don’t already have a bow sprit or bow pole then you will need to install one. But only if you want to keep the sail up when you’re not using it.

- Pre-rigging: this simply means keeping the furled sail hoisted when you aren’t planning to use it. It doesn’t need a special tight furl, just a regular furl with sheet lightly tensioned. The sheets can stay on - we continue furling until they are wrapped 10-12 times around the sail.

Halyard tension: there needs to be plenty so that it doesn’t sag into the primary forestay. Smaller boats can use a single part halyard but boats over about 40’ need 2:1 halyards.

Barber hauler: if the sail is cut relatively flat, basically a large genoa, and is sheeted to the outside stern corner of the boat, even with a tight sheet the upwind angle will be pretty wide. So you can use an in-haul on the sheet to pull the clew further inboard to tighten the angle.

Yes. My point exactly.

How the hell are all those extra requirements good for a cruising boat? I mean seriously, the whole thing about cruisers is keeping it simple. An asym does that well.

And if you are a cruiser who likes to go fast, no worries, there are plenty of fast sails to choose from, go nuts.

I think it’s a load of marketing nonsense and it worries me because the guy who came to ask me about it is no kind of speed freak, quite the opposite. He’s just getting started on his cruising adventure and has very little experience to draw on. He gets sucked in by that kind of ******** marketing label and he’d have a nightmare time trying to manage that ridiculous sail. Frankly, it would probably kill him.

[fxykty]

We are cruising, not racing, on a relatively well sailing catamaran. We have four sails:
- Self-tacking membrane jib for upwind and stronger winds to 30 knots AWS. We have separate staysail and storm jib for stronger winds.
- Membrane mainsail with 3 reefs for all wind directions and wind strengths, though we usually drop it if we anticipate a lot of downwind conditions with AWA greater than 140*.
- Large Dacron gennaker (AKA screecher) that is relatively flat and rated to 15 knots AWS. We use it upwind in very light conditions and all the way to downwind on its own. It particularly shines 55-110* AWA. It furls and is hoisted on a 2:1 halyard. We keep it up if we anticipate using it, otherwise bring it down. Sheets are left in place.
- Medium size 1.5oz nylon symmetric spinnaker with a sock. Used on its own for extended deep angles in up to 20 knots AWS.

These 4 sails in various combinations cover all conditions. The symmetric spinnaker is the least used. But even if we had a para sail or asymmetric spinnaker on a top down furler we would not be without the gennaker. YMMV

[fxykty]

One additional thought applicable to monohulls: if you have a large 120/130 % overlapping genoa or a yankee type sail on your primary forestay then you probably don’t need a gennaker/code 0. But if your primary headsail is smaller than that, you will have a hole in your sail wardrobe. Whether that matters is both dependent on the type of boat you’ve got and how you like to sail. No one size fits all.

But back to the original post in this thread, what Rolly Tasker is selling is completely reasonable and is basically a re-marketing of an existing sail type. Nothing fancy or complicated at all.

[JustMurph]

Originally Posted by GILow

How the hell are all those extra requirements good for a cruising boat? I mean seriously, the whole thing about cruisers is keeping it simple. An asym does that well.

None of that stuff is difficult or complicated. Same as any other screecher.