Washing machines, graywater, energy

[a64pilot]

I think the drier is the key, we don’t have one, and don’t need one as I won’t cruise where it’s cold, I don’t like cold.
If we had a drier then we would want to reduce drier running time and then maybe worrying about spin RPM would matter.
But as washing usually uses so much water that I’m running the watermaker, and for us that means running the generator, so saving power by washing in a bucket is irrelevant.
It’s would seem that a bucket and a spinner takes up as much storage as a washing machine anyway, and the spinner uses electricity, so why not have a machine that also does the wash too?

If I could find a machine that dried as well as washed I’d consider it, but that may take a very long time per load too.

[Juho]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I think the drier is the key, we don’t have one, and don’t need one as I won’t cruise where it’s cold, I don’t like cold.
If we had a drier then we would want to reduce drier running time and then maybe worrying about spin RPM would matter.
But as washing usually uses so much water that I’m running the watermaker, and for us that means running the generator, so saving power by washing in a bucket is irrelevant.
It’s would seem that a bucket and a spinner takes up as much storage as a washing machine anyway, and the spinner uses electricity, so why not have a machine that also does the wash too?

If I could find a machine that dried as well as washed I’d consider it, but that may take a very long time per load too.

You can do the same also by other means, with some more water, some more rinsing time, and some more drying time.

I don' think the coldness factor is very important here. I live in a reasonably cold place, but cold air is often dry (at least when temperatures are below freezing point), and if you heat the room, also drying is fast. It is possible that in a hot humid place drying the laundry is more problematic, and there is a higher risk of mould.

For us it is so far only bucket (or a sink for small amounts). That has been good enough for us so far. A spinner or a spinning washing machine would help in making the process faster (although not for small amounts of laundry), and the laundry so dry that there would be no drops on the floor / deck.

[YANDINA]

Over/under setup used minimal deck space and worked great for 15 years.



.

[Bill O]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

But as washing usually uses so much water that I’m running the watermaker, and for us that means running the generator, so saving power by washing in a bucket is irrelevant.
It’s would seem that a bucket and a spinner takes up as much storage as a washing machine anyway, and the spinner uses electricity, so why not have a machine that also does the wash too?

Guess this is the problem w/your thinking, the bucket/spin drier combo uses a lot less water and power than your Haier, then you don't need to run the gen or water maker.

The spinner for 2 rinses is ~ 2 min/each at 300W and not continuously for 40-70 min. to run a load of wash in your washer. Therefore don't need to run the gen. to do wash.

The spinner is much smaller, less bulky than your washer, thus is easier to store. It also weighs much less.

The plastic bucket is a multi-purpose item on a boat. I'm sure most people already have at least one on their boat.

No one is advocating you need a spinner, since you already went down the road to install the washer. The facts are for people that want something better than hand wringing or a roller wringer to aide in washing their clothes and don't want to take up too much space w/a washer.


Bill O.

[mikedefieslife]

I've never come across any dirty item that has been cleaner hand washing than in a machine. In fact hand washing has often spread stains and marks.

I also believe hand washing uses more water if you are trying to clean and rinse the clothes properly.

[David B]

Originally Posted by mglonnro

I've been lightly researching washing machines (for clothes and dishes) on sailboats.

Most of the newer, bigger boats (from cruising monohulls to performance catamarans) seem to offer those as options, but are you people really extensively using them irl?

It would be very nice to get some real life feedback on the following:

- Do you use the machines when out sailing? I assume you have to do it either with a generator or an alternator running? Watermaker a must? Graywater straight out into the sea?
- Do you use the machines in a marina? I assume most marinas (at least in the future) won't accept boats leading their graywater straight into the sea? Or?
- If you have both a dish washer and a clothes washer (or either), do you find one more useful/problematic than the other?

I assume a watermaker will solve the water supply challenge, diesel can be used to get enough energy, but the graywater -- I have no idea?

(Splitting out from this thread: http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ty-226982.html)

Wouldn't be without ours. We have had it since day one, and it is a great little machine (Baby Nova). It uses very little water, and can wash two double sheets. No handwashing, no searching for a laundromat, no queuing, no paying. It makes living onboard like living at home.

If grey water is an issue, we have a grey water holding tank. Freshwater comes from tanks or the desalination plant. Power comes from the dock or the generator (or the inverter if pushed). But the thing does not use a lot of either anyway.

[Sojourner]

The ultra high revolution spinners sound cool, and if the energy wasn't a difference, I'd take a higher RPM over lower washer. But I (and lots of us) sail in hot places. I don't need any spinner...I could hang out a sopping towel and a few hours later it'd be dry. Our 1200 rpm front loader is more than sufficient to get things dry in a few hours, even hanging up in the head on a rainy day.

[Pizzazz]

Some here are getting too technical. It is a boat after all. For me, the best solution is a fully automatic washing machine. I use the LG Sidekick which a disassembled and built into my starboard settee. An alternative is the Haier which is taller but narrower. Just do what works in the space that you have. The key benefits of a fully automatic washing machine is that it washes and rinses well, no moving of wet clothes around. It consumes less than 10 AHrs per load but 15 gallons of water for 1 cu ft of laundry (one wash, one rinse cycle).

Hot water comes from the water heater (electricity at the marina, engine heat when under way).

Drying is either under the sun (when practical) or clothes hanging in the head with the diesel heater pumping hot air in the head, venting through a hatch. Works well.

Grey water is discharged overboard, never had any issues.

Various other thoughts I had over the years but discarded.

- Dual bin washer spinner. It was too much work, did not wash well, did. It rinse well, made a mess. It did use less water though.

- Washer/drier combo. I do not have the space in my 31 ft boat, the drier uses too much electricity, forced air diesel heat is better. Also, expensive.

- 3200 spinners. They do extract more water (my 700 rpm 20” drum gets clothes down to 60% damp, the 3200 rpm spinner would get them down to 40% damp) but the effort to move clothes around and the extra space is not worth it. Further, people who hand wash and use the spinner either need to move clothes back and forth four times or end up with not well rinsed clothes despite having a spinner. A waste in my opinion.

Overall, having a washing machine on board is a great addition and the convenience is unmatched but you either need to get a combo and live with the space, weight and power requirements or integrate a washing machine like the LG or the Haier into your boat’s systems (water heater, forced air diesel heater, watermaker) for a more distributed solution.

SV Pizzazz

[Heg]

Second the Daewoo mini. Had ours onboard for 3 years now and love it. Super quick cycle ( 30 mins) and a full wash uses 30 litres. You can also just do spin or rinse and spin . We just use cold fill. Runs off the inverter with no issues .
I watch other cruisers washing by hand or lugging loads ashore ... not my idea of fun .

Originally Posted by mikedefieslife

Just installed a Daewoo Mini MKII model (16.5kg). It uses 100w when not heating water (which you don't need to in warm climates), and uses 30l for a normal 30min wash. I have a watermaker on board.

Considering that washing was often up to €20-30 a time in the Med, it won't be too long until it pays for itself.

The plan will be to do two-three small loads a week depending on what needs washing.

I'm not sure why you would worry about grey water any more than if you were using a bucket. Try to use environmentally friendly soaps all round.

[Ballsnall]

Check out the appliances designed for caravans. Lots of good stuff suitable for boats at reasonable price. The old twin tub washing machines were the best small machine ever made in my opinion and I think they may still be available.

[Alita49DS]

As my wife would tell you, a washing machine on a boat is an absolute boon.

Our Jeanneau 49DS came with a fitted (under the chart table seat) Thomson top loading washer /dryer. All very neat as it uses the drop under the sole to reduce the height. Works a treat. Top loading is better. Only run it when on shore power. Waste water straight out to sea. Not a problem. Never found an eco product that is other than rubbish.

[mglonnro]

Originally Posted by David B

Wouldn't be without ours. We have had it since day one, and it is a great little machine (Baby Nova). It uses very little water, and can wash two double sheets. No handwashing, no searching for a laundromat, no queuing, no paying. It makes living onboard like living at home.

If grey water is an issue, we have a grey water holding tank. Freshwater comes from tanks or the desalination plant. Power comes from the dock or the generator (or the inverter if pushed). But the thing does not use a lot of either anyway.

I'm more and more happy to hear that they are not a "complete waste of space", but actually rather useful.

[mglonnro]

Originally Posted by Heg

Second the Daewoo mini. Had ours onboard for 3 years now and love it. Super quick cycle ( 30 mins) and a full wash uses 30 litres. You can also just do spin or rinse and spin . We just use cold fill. Runs off the inverter with no issues .
I watch other cruisers washing by hand or lugging loads ashore ... not my idea of fun .

The Daewoo mini is interesting. We actually saw one in Cannes last year and my wife got quite excited about it.

[Chotu]

I am looking at these models in the thread and they barely seem worth it. Am u missing something?

Running an entire wash and long/weak dry cycle to wash a pair of sheets? That's all that fits?

Seems like a huge waste of generator hours. Why not just store up dirty laundry and send it out at the next stop for wash and fold service?

Legitimate question. I want to love these things. My girlfriend wants one. But they seem useless to me. Are they really worth all the effort?

[mikedefieslife]

Originally Posted by Chotu

I am looking at these models in the thread and they barely seem worth it. Am u missing something?

Running an entire wash and long/weak dry cycle to wash a pair of sheets? That's all that fits?

Seems like a huge waste of generator hours. Why not just store up dirty laundry and send it out at the next stop for wash and fold service?

Legitimate question. I want to love these things. My girlfriend wants one. But they seem useless to me. Are they really worth all the effort?

Generator hours? Mine uses 10a per wash. The idea is that you don't save up a week's worth of washing but instead wash smaller loads more frequently.

Next stop? Wash and fold service? You're having a laugh right? Care to tell me where the wash and fold service is in Restinga (El Hierro) where I am now?

Also when available most of these services will tumble dry your clothes on high heat. That means any technical clothing is ruined. Womens underwear, merino wool items, nice high thread count sheets, swim shorts, sports gears, even socks.