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Old 13-05-2019, 09:47   #1
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Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

Anyone using Marco brand variable speed water pumps?

https://youtu.be/o5snaIuu-Ww

Prior boat had an expansion tank, didn't like it.
'New to us' boat has a variable speed Jabsco - that has the problem where the motor keeps running at a very slow pace (common problem with the electric part).

Can't seem to find much info from users....thanks.
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Old 13-05-2019, 09:57   #2
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

I will be following this thread with interest. I also have a nearly new variable speed jabsco that often runs at a slow rate. Would love to find a better solution.
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Old 13-05-2019, 10:20   #3
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

Those are Italian made gear pumps. Reverso sells them as oil change pumps without the variable speed electronics. I think the basic pump is pretty good but I have no experience with the variable speed version.

Variable speed pumps seem to be hard to do. Jabsco is on their second or third version. ShurFlo gave up on it and went to a bypass system to eliminate the accumulator tank.

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Old 16-05-2019, 12:33   #4
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

Decided to try it, and ordered a UP2/E.... just delivered today.

Very compact, tank testing seems to work great. Might get another I like it so much (so far). Run them in parallel for redundancy and also have the ability to drain the water tanks 2x the speed.

The two led's (one blue and one multi colored) will tell you a multitude of things about the pump - solid colors, flashing, etc.... Very cool stuff.
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Old 16-05-2019, 12:37   #5
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

We use these since 2015 (liveaboard most of the time) and are on our second pump currently. They are very good as long as the seal between pump and motor is working. If you change seal and bearings it as soon as the pump starts sounding different (that means the bearings are rusting) it will probably last longer than our first one did...
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Old 16-05-2019, 12:51   #6
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

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They are very good as long as the seal between pump and motor is working. ...
That was my concern with the design. I may lower the pressure once installed and tested - don't need or want blasting high pressure water - as it just seems to make more of a mess with splashing (not using it as a wash down pump).
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Old 17-05-2019, 02:35   #7
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

On my old boat I gave up on pressurized water systems and just put a pump and switch in for each outlet.
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Old 17-05-2019, 18:04   #8
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

I have 2 Marco UP3e pressure pumps, Port & Stbd water systems, in use for about 9 months, no problems. Marco give a 2 year replacement warranty. They are very quiet, often cannot hear them running. I have an acculumulater than on both as the were in the system previously, and seem to work well toghther, even though not necessary.
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Old 23-11-2020, 13:46   #9
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

I have the Marco UP6/E 7GPM pump, $600.00+. The first one worked great for about 16 months and then quit. I found out for the warranty it needed to be returned to the factory in Europe for inspection.
It was summertime and I needed a pump so believing it was a fluke I bought another exact pump and installed it.
Marco did send me a new replacement so I had a spare. Good thing I had the spare because the second one failed after about 14 months. So now I'm on the third pump in less than three years. I should have stayed with Sureflow because it was trouble-free for 10 years.
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Old 19-12-2024, 07:37   #10
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce K View Post
I have 2 Marco UP3e pressure pumps, Port & Stbd water systems, in use for about 9 months, no problems. Marco give a 2 year replacement warranty. They are very quiet, often cannot hear them running. I have an acculumulater than on both as the were in the system previously, and seem to work well toghther, even though not necessary.
I just put in a Marco UP12 water pump into my existing system with a 10l accumulator tank, that was already in place.
The Marco pump as such works well, but it runs for a very long time. Specifically as long as water is running in higher revs and ones the tab is closed it slows down to very low revs and keeps going for another 5 minutes or so.
I wonder is removing the accumulator tank would help this? Or perhaps changing the pressure in it? But for the love of it I can not find what the cut in pressure of the pump would be.... Any advice would be incredible!
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Old 19-12-2024, 07:57   #11
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

How does a variable speed water pump eliminate the need for an expansion tank?


If your water heater holds 10 gallons (sort of the minimum for a shower) the water will expand about 1-2 quarts every time it re-fills and re-heats. This is why the terrestrial plumbing code REQUIRES expansion tanks for well pump systems. Unlike city water, the water cannot expand back into the city mains because of a check valve. Yes, plastic plumbing stretches, but that is asking a lot and I'm guessing they cycle over the design pressure limits.



I've heard of a lot of troubles with leaks and pump failures when expansion tanks are eliminated. Yes, the pump cycles, but I don't understand how that is a problem. A little noise? It's a boat.


Commonly, excessive pump cycling is cause by an expansion tank with a failed bladder. Replace it. Dependingon the size of the tank and pump settings, you should be able to get a quart or so before the pump cycles. But the tank is not there for quiet, it is there to protect the plumbing from the water heater.
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Old 19-12-2024, 08:02   #12
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

I do absolutely see your point on all accounts.
In the past I had an older, noisier pump that worked OK, was just making conversation impossible for the time it ran. but it ran for about a minute and shut off.
I just can't believe that the pump is meant to pump in "idle speed" for extended periods?
Usually I would set the accumulator tank to 1.2 Bars, as the cut in pressure of the old pump was about 1.4
With the macro pump I am not sure,, but would think a bit higher...
Either way, I was hoping someone had a similar issue and might have an "easy fix"

On a different note: We do have a water heater, and yes the expansion is a factor, that being said, as far as I know most waterheaters have a check valve themselves, so having a accumulator tank on the cold water side doesn't help much for the expansion on the hot water side... (please do correct me if I see this wrong)
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Old 19-12-2024, 08:43   #13
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

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How does a variable speed water pump eliminate the need for an expansion tank?


If your water heater holds 10 gallons (sort of the minimum for a shower) the water will expand about 1-2 quarts every time it re-fills and re-heats. This is why the terrestrial plumbing code REQUIRES expansion tanks for well pump systems. Unlike city water, the water cannot expand back into the city mains because of a check valve. Yes, plastic plumbing stretches, but that is asking a lot and I'm guessing they cycle over the design pressure limits.



I've heard of a lot of troubles with leaks and pump failures when expansion tanks are eliminated. Yes, the pump cycles, but I don't understand how that is a problem. A little noise? It's a boat.


Commonly, excessive pump cycling is cause by an expansion tank with a failed bladder. Replace it. Dependingon the size of the tank and pump settings, you should be able to get a quart or so before the pump cycles. But the tank is not there for quiet, it is there to protect the plumbing from the water heater.
The answer is yes, and no.

For very large complex water systems, there are frequently enough places that accumulate air pockets that the expansion of the heated water is handled without a problem. Other people tolerate the leakage from the pressure relief valve on the water heater. Neither are very elegant solutions.

Some people say they don’t like expansion tanks because they require maintenance or occasional replacement. I don’t know how they manage the rest of their boat….
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Old 19-12-2024, 08:56   #14
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

@Sailing Harmony:
Does that mean your recommondation would be two accumulator tanks? One on cold and one on the hot end of things?
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Old 19-12-2024, 11:29   #15
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Re: Marco variable speed water pumps....opinions?

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Originally Posted by ProjectManaia View Post
I wonder is removing the accumulator tank would help this? Or perhaps changing the pressure in it? But for the love of it I can not find what the cut in pressure of the pump would be.
On our smaller boats we're generally faced with two opposing requirements.
1, We'd like to have a more-or-less constant flow rate/pressure for showers.
2, But we don't want the pump to constantly cycle every time someone uses a cup of water in the galley.
For #1 you'd like a fairly narrow differential setting on the pressure switch, for #2 you'd want a broader setting.
So, we need to accept less than perfection and use a setting that will give us most of what we want, (and be happy).
Removing an accumulator tank rarely solves anything, however, the installation of a simple/inexpensive Square D remote pressure switch that you can adjust is a big step forward., same with a mounted pressure gage so you can actually read the pressure(s).
If you don't know the cut-in of your pump you're pi**ing to windward when it comes to getting the proper air pressure in the accumulator tank.
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