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07-02-2023, 08:05
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2021
Location: Rhode Island
Boat: SouthernCross 28'
Posts: 23
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Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
Hey amazing people, I have a SoutherCross 28 and when we are heeling to port both the galley and the head sinks siphon water, usually its not an issue the water stays in the sinks, but sometimes it does splash out a lot. I put rubber stoppers in the drains when we are going and that works but it can be a pain when we right and the suction really makes the stoppers hard to remove. I guess my question is: Is it a good idea to put a check valve in between the sink drain and the through hull?
Cpt Mike A.
SV Katrinka
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07-02-2023, 08:26
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
We often close the seacocks for our sinks when we sail. Of course that makes it hard to use the sinks.
Thinking of the check valve - if you are healed over with water pressure holding the check valve closed, maybe the sink wouldn't drain if you used it.
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07-02-2023, 08:35
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Home port Berlin, now at sea
Boat: Amigo 40, 31ft double ender
Posts: 233
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
Same here. Galley sink is close enough to centreline that it doesn’t siphon, but “close heads seacock” is part of our before sailing checklist.
When we upgraded the heads seacock we bought a tru design seacock with a sensor in it. Idea is to generate an alert if the seacock is open and we start heeling.
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07-02-2023, 08:48
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#4
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always in motion is the future
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: in paradise
Boat: Sundeer 64
Posts: 19,650
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackjacobin
Hey amazing people, I have a SoutherCross 28 and when we are heeling to port both the galley and the head sinks siphon water, usually its not an issue the water stays in the sinks, but sometimes it does splash out a lot. I put rubber stoppers in the drains when we are going and that works but it can be a pain when we right and the suction really makes the stoppers hard to remove. I guess my question is: Is it a good idea to put a check valve in between the sink drain and the through hull?
Cpt Mike A.
SV Katrinka
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You should have seacocks rather than just thru-hulls.
__________________
“It’s a trap!” - Admiral Ackbar.
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07-02-2023, 08:50
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2021
Location: Rhode Island
Boat: SouthernCross 28'
Posts: 23
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
I do have seacocks, it was my mistake in the original post.
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07-02-2023, 08:52
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2021
Location: Rhode Island
Boat: SouthernCross 28'
Posts: 23
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackjacobin
Hey amazing people, I have a SoutherCross 28 and when we are heeling to port both the galley and the head sinks siphon water, usually its not an issue the water stays in the sinks, but sometimes it does splash out a lot. I put rubber stoppers in the drains when we are going and that works but it can be a pain when we right and the suction really makes the stoppers hard to remove. I guess my question is: Is it a good idea to put a check valve in between the sink drain and the seacock?
Cpt Mike A.
SV Katrinka
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I meant to write seacock, not through hull. Apologies
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07-02-2023, 09:24
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#7
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always in motion is the future
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: in paradise
Boat: Sundeer 64
Posts: 19,650
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackjacobin
I meant to write seacock, not through hull. Apologies
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No need for apologies
It isn’t siphoning, just water coming up under heel. Close the seacocks when it’s splashing.
It isn’t easy to fix without needing to close the seacocks. We have gravity drain into a gray water tank, then pump it up into a standpipe. This is a big project, much easier to close the seacocks.
__________________
“It’s a trap!” - Admiral Ackbar.
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07-02-2023, 09:45
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Lancaster Co., PA/North East, MD
Boat: Watkins 27
Posts: 293
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
Assuming you're talking about water siphoning out of drain line due to Venturi effect when normally AWL thru hulls are below water line when heeled....or did I not get that right?
Perhaps a short in height (just the A-S u-bend) anti-siphon loop in the drain lines?
But then you say "the water stays in the sink" . Meaning water is coming IN?
IThat's the case....close the seacock..
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07-02-2023, 13:37
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#9
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Kemah Tx
Boat: Gulfstar 51
Posts: 683
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
I have seacocks but they were a PITA to get to so I made a remote linkage for them by bolting a piece of aluminum angle iron to the seasick lever ( bolt is loose so lever can pivot). Now I can open a cabinet door and pull the angle iron out about 4 inches and it activates the seasick lever. Works great and took the hassle out.
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07-02-2023, 13:45
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#10
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 572
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
One way I saw this dealt (I am not advocating it, just offering it as an option) with was a macerator pump installed on the galley sink drain. No water will come back up the line when heeled.....but the macerator pump must be used to drain the sink...a setup I would not want.
The other option is to raise your sink height, possibly with a sink riser which would raise the entire sink level above the heeled waterline.
I have seen check valves installed in drain lines....I have seen none that operate for any period of time.
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07-02-2023, 14:26
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Good question
Boat: Rafiki 37
Posts: 14,538
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allied39
One way I saw this dealt (I am not advocating it, just offering it as an option) with was a macerator pump installed on the galley sink drain. No water will come back up the line when heeled.....but the macerator pump must be used to drain the sink...a setup I would not want.
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My boat is set up this way. Galley sink has a water pump to drain the sink. My head sink uses a manual pump. Works fine, and never lets any water back in.
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07-02-2023, 15:20
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2023
Posts: 1,985
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
A check valve in a galley sink will be no end of trouble. Avoid it.
This is a function of boat design. To my way of thinking BAD boat design. Sinks that are far enough outboard to go under the waterline when heeled NEED to have seacocks closed while sailing. If you have a sink like this AND the seacock is not readily accessible, then DOUBLE shame on the boat builder. ALL seacocks should be readily accessible, they are all emergency equipment.
If you think not being able to use your sinks while underway is a problem, you might invite the designer of your boat along for a multi day passage and give him the job of dishwasher…
Another potential solution is to have the sink drain to a “gray water tank” which is then pumped overboard through an antisyphon loop. This is fraught with its own design and implementation issues, but CAN be done successfully This assumes you have room for such an install below the cabin sole, something that might not be available.
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07-02-2023, 17:15
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Rhode Island
Boat: Tayana FD-12
Posts: 1,204
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
I have check valves everywhere. As long as diameter is the same it works. My drains are 1-1/4" and 1". Maybe I'm fortunate as my drains are on a larger side. But I took on a lot of water in my head sink on one occasion. After adding the check valve, I had just enough room to place it in vertical position, head sink was no longer flooding in heavy weather sailing.
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07-02-2023, 17:41
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 572
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
Quote:
Originally Posted by SailingHarmonie
A check valve in a galley sink will be no end of trouble. Avoid it.
This is a function of boat design. To my way of thinking BAD boat design. Sinks that are far enough outboard to go under the waterline when heeled NEED to have seacocks closed while sailing. If you have a sink like this AND the seacock is not readily accessible, then DOUBLE shame on the boat builder. ALL seacocks should be readily accessible, they are all emergency equipment.
If you think not being able to use your sinks while underway is a problem, you might invite the designer of your boat along for a multi day passage and give him the job of dishwasher…
Another potential solution is to have the sink drain to a “gray water tank” which is then pumped overboard through an antisyphon loop. This is fraught with its own design and implementation issues, but CAN be done successfully This assumes you have room for such an install below the cabin sole, something that might not be available.
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Well yays...not every boat is perfect in this imperfect world. Sometimes we just have to find ways around these imperfections, like the OP is trying to do.
Hey, OP, another thought. You could put a valve below the sinks in addition to the seacocks you have, easy to access and will achieve what you want without having to scuttle your boat cause it's bad.
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07-02-2023, 17:48
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Good question
Boat: Rafiki 37
Posts: 14,538
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Re: Galley and Head sinks Siphoning
Seriously, it's not a big deal with a pump setup. I was pretty concerned when I first bought this boat and realized both sinks had to be actively pumped (one with an electric and the other with a manual pump). But it has been a zero issue in over a decade of ownership and pretty good use.
Yes, definitely, there should be a seacock, but a pump setup solves all your problems.
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