|
|
11-01-2021, 09:45
|
#91
|
Registered User
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Miami Florida
Boat: Ellis Flybridge 28
Posts: 4,057
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
Just to settle the argument.
__________________
Retired from Hopkins-Carter Marine Supplies
|
|
|
11-01-2021, 09:51
|
#92
|
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Panschwitz, Germany
Boat: Woods Mira 35 Catamaran
Posts: 4,229
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
I don't get this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HopCar
Just to settle the argument.
|
|
|
|
11-01-2021, 10:12
|
#93
|
Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: La Ciudad de la Misión Didacus de Alcalá en Alta California, Virreinato de Nueva España
Boat: Cal 20
Posts: 20,489
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
Franz:
It’s a joke.
__________________
Num Me Vexo?
For all of your celestial navigation questions: https://navlist.net/
A house is but a boat so poorly built and so firmly run aground no one would think to try and refloat it.
|
|
|
11-01-2021, 10:27
|
#94
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 870
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adelie
Franz:
It’s a joke.
|
Well... that is debatable.
|
|
|
11-01-2021, 10:45
|
#95
|
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Panschwitz, Germany
Boat: Woods Mira 35 Catamaran
Posts: 4,229
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
Oh my, got it now, but, it's a bit lame.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adelie
Franz:
It’s a joke.
|
|
|
|
11-01-2021, 10:48
|
#96
|
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: Tacoma, WA
Boat: IN Process
Posts: 49
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
Quote:
Originally Posted by rslifkin
Unless you have aluminum tanks, in which case this will destroy them in short order.
|
In that case you should be able to use iodine.
That is what we use when we keg our home brews.
|
|
|
11-01-2021, 19:07
|
#97
|
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 212
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
Jedi has already said how this is handled in hot water cylinders.
The water needs to be maintained above 65 Centigrade to prevent bacterial growth. Most hot water cylinders are now set to operate at 75 Centigrade and then use a tempering valve which mixes some cold into the outlet pipe to prevent scalding.
I use Isotemp cylinders with both electric and engine heating. The engine heat has less regulation and the tank can reach 85 Centigrade. Having easy access to the tempering valve is useful if you regularly change between the two sources of heat.
|
|
|
11-01-2021, 19:43
|
#98
|
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,409
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
I may be a little behind the curve here, but where does the germa actually come from ? 100% of my water comes from the water maker so it should be germ free when it hits the hot water tank and or the water storage tank.
|
|
|
11-01-2021, 23:42
|
#99
|
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 272
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
Quote:
Originally Posted by NaClyDog
How do people deal with Legionella concerns when it comes to mostly electric hot water heater setups?
When we upgrade the electrical systems on our cat, we would like to have less of a reliance on running the engines to get hot water. I understand the engines get the temp in the tank hot enough to kill the Legionella bacteria. But, is this practical / possible with a mostly electric solution (i.e. we only want to heat water when we need it, not all the time and ensure the Legionella bacteria is killed)?
Everyone seems to be telling us to "forget it, just run the engines" but we want to explore other options.
hanks.
|
I expect you have the same concerns about your hot-water systems at home?
No doubt you have a system to prevent that?
|
|
|
12-01-2021, 00:08
|
#100
|
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Panschwitz, Germany
Boat: Woods Mira 35 Catamaran
Posts: 4,229
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
That's a different game. Home water cylinders are permanently attached to electricity and the heater kicks in when the water gets below a certain heat.
On boats that is not common. Especially not if you are at anchor.
There are also many boats which do not have an inboard engine to heat water via the cooling water outlet.
Anyone who heats the water with a genset probably tries to run the the genset as little as possible which leads to lukewarm water from the boiler when the genset has not been on for a while.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chasfgr
I expect you have the same concerns about your hot-water systems at home?
No doubt you have a system to prevent that?
|
|
|
|
12-01-2021, 03:28
|
#101
|
Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 49,138
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
Quote:
Originally Posted by motion30
I may be a little behind the curve here, but where does the germa actually come from ? 100% of my water comes from the water maker so it should be germ free when it hits the hot water tank and or the water storage tank.
|
The bacteria comes from the environment, usually surface water.
You're right; the exclusive use of R/O should preclude legionella.
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"
|
|
|
12-01-2021, 03:37
|
#102
|
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Panschwitz, Germany
Boat: Woods Mira 35 Catamaran
Posts: 4,229
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
Gord, do you see running R/O in a non/low silted marina at the ocean shore with a large (in terms of throughput but for tiny particles) particle filter in the feedline as critical?
I relate primarely to the risk of some folks being irresponsible and using the seawater toilet there despite it being forbidden.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GordMay
The bacteria comes from the environment, usually surface water.
You're right; the exclusive use of R/O should preclude legionella.
|
|
|
|
12-01-2021, 04:00
|
#103
|
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 141
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
"The (terrestrial) solution to the temperature dilemma, is to use a quality mixing valve, to allow VERY hot water to go to the dish washer and laundry machines to actually kill GERMS,"
Some mixing valves are also anti scald valves, a far better choice for a boat.
An anti scald valve will shut off the hot water should there not be enough cold to mix to bring the temperature to the preset.
A mixing valve will do the best it can , but with no cold water it will still pass very hot water.
Most boat motors can circulate 180f to 200f coolant , hot enough to do damage if not reduced.
|
|
|
12-01-2021, 05:29
|
#104
|
Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 49,138
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franziska
Gord, do you see running R/O in a non/low silted marina at the ocean shore with a large (in terms of throughput but for tiny particles) particle filter in the feedline as critical?
I relate primarely to the risk of some folks being irresponsible and using the seawater toilet there despite it being forbidden.
|
I* see two main problems with inshore or marina use of R/O desalinators.
1. Silting (which you excluded), which will harm the pump. Any decent particulate filtre will eliminate dangerous silt.
2. Petroleum contamination of supply water, which will destroy the R/O membrane. I don’t know how to practically & effectively filtre hydrocarbons from (flowing) water, hence, I would never run my desalinator where there is any likelihood of petroleum contamination of the input water (ie: marinas).
I’m not very concerned with biological contamination (fecal etc) of my desalinator’s feed water. R/O deals with that very effectively, although, one might be concerned with contaminating your supply pre-filtre.
* I’m not an R/O expert, of whom CF has several (Tellie, SV THIRD DAY, probably more)
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"
|
|
|
12-01-2021, 05:36
|
#105
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Rochester, NY
Boat: Chris Craft 381 Catalina
Posts: 6,207
|
Re: Electric hot water heater / Legionella bacteria concerns
Quote:
Originally Posted by GordMay
I* see two main problems with inshore or marina use of R/O desalinators.
1. Silting (which you excluded), which will harm the pump. Any decent particulate filtre will eliminate dangerous silt.
2. Petroleum contamination of supply water, which will destroy the R/O membrane. I don’t know how to practically & effectively filtre hydrocarbons from (flowing) water, hence, I would never run my desalinator where there is any likelihood of petroleum contamination of the input water (ie: marinas).
I’m not very concerned with biological contamination (fecal etc) of my desalinator’s feed water. R/O deals with that very effectively, although, one might be concerned with contaminating your supply pre-filtre.
* I’m not an R/O expert, of whom CF has several (Tellie, SV THIRD DAY, probably more)
|
If you're willing to run a few pre filters, you can handle most types of contamination. Something along the lines of a fine sediment filter, then a carbon block filter, then something like GAC+KDF, then an oil/hydrocarbon removal filter. Of course, all the extra filters starts to get expensive, especially the more specialized ones. So I wouldn't bother with it unless you really needed to.
|
|
|
|
|
Thread Tools |
Search this Thread |
|
|
Display Modes |
Rate This Thread |
Linear Mode
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
Advertise Here
Recent Discussions |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Vendor Spotlight |
|
|
|
|